Gladiator

Substantial revison of my previous posts on this thread.

Why didn't US Military or Forst Service tamker helicopters drop water on WTC?

Why were beams cut at a fairly smooth diagonal at the second floor level, Molten metal found, and Thermite, which melts metal found at WTC?

These questions, with references are explored in another thread. Ny latrest post on that thread. My previous posts do not reflect the information on Thermite. I have just now become aware of the scince of Thermite and Nano-Thermite. My appologies for my previously ignorant posts.

http://www.debatepolitics.com/conspi...post1057677695 (9/11 being an inside job)

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How did Our Oil get under Their Sand?

kathaksung

Several 9/11 hijackers seen in OKC prior to attacks
Red Dirt Report, editor
Posted: July 19, 2008

Discussed was explosive information regarding the fact that several witnesses in Oklahoma City have confirmed with eyewitness reports and credit card receipts (from expired government-issued credit cards) that five of the 19 9/11 hijackers were in Oklahoma City.........
That Mohammad Atta and four of his cohorts were sighted in Oklahoma City on the Thursday, Friday and Saturday before 9/11/01........

During this report, your Red Dirt Reporter addressed information compiled by Norman-based researcher Michael P. Wright who has uncovered information on Nick Berg, Zacarias Moussaoui and later, white suicide bomber Joel Hinrichs, among others. Wright discovered in a 2000 University of Oklahoma student directory that a man with an identical name as a 9/11 hijacker attended the school and the following year a man with a nearly identical name had a school email of abuali911@ou.edu..........

Red Dirt Report | Red Dirt Reporter

Consider:

1. OKC bombing is created as the first attempt to expand the police power of FBI -- FBI director Louis Freeh submitted a proposal similar to Patriot Act after OKC bombing but failed to pass in congress.

2. WTC was pulled down by explosives not fire. The second attempt to expand Feds' police power and this time they succeeded.

3. Moussaoui was the only one said belong to the 911 terrorist group survived. A convenient witness for a false flag attack.

4. Nick Berg's "beheading" case was used to distract the Abu Ghraibu prison scandal and used to tarnish Muslim.

All have a purpose for the cover up of wrong doing of government. Those people, Atta, Moussaoui, Nick Berg.... most likely work for the Feds as moles. Birds of a feather flock together. It's no strange they were all present in OKC. It seems that there was a Feds train camp there. Or they were sent there to cover up the OKC bombing truth.

Frank Talk

By iron workers who were removing the steel? The collapse initiated from where the planes hit so cuts on the second floor are irrelevant to the collapse.

Evidence of this?

Gladiator

It is true that some beams were cut at an angle by iron workers. The excessive slag can be seen on those diagonal cuts that resulted form Thermite/Thermate. Increased sulfer content is found in the beams cut by Thermate. Most all of the steel beams were rather quickly shipped to China and smelted down for recycled steel. There may be some beams in the 9-11 museum.

The lower part of the buildings would have remained standing, if not for the Thermite/Thermate charges. Beams can be seen falling away from the towers. There is little bending of any of the steel beams, which would be an ordinary failure.

There is one 3 foot ball of melted 9-11 materals at the 9-11 museum, I saw on TV. There are photos of firemen uncovering rubble, and a glow shining up on their legs. Firemen had to replace their boots frequently because the heat from the molten steel would heat the rubble, above the moten steel. There are eyewitness accounts from clean up workers who found molten steel for weeks after 9-11.

Search 9-11 Thermite.

Most official reports do not include any reference to molten metal found.

Osama Bin Laden did not claim to be responsible for planting Thermite/Thermate charges. Bin Laden expressed surprise at the effectiveness of the two airplanes bringing down three buildings.

If you were to consider the possiblity that Thermite/Thermate charges were placed for WTC 9-11-01, who might have had the knowledge of when 9-11 was coming? Who assisted in funding 9-11? Pakistan? Who has connections with Pakistan to fund and find out when 9-11 was coming? How many people were interested in creating a public reason for War with Iraq, before 9-11?

How many of the pre 9-11 Iraq War planners had connections to plant Thermite/Thermate at the WTC? If Osama Bin Laden did not claim to plant Thermite at WTC, and claimed responsibility for the airplanes hitting WTC and the Pentagon, wouldn't it seem logical that someone ELSE planted the Thermite/Thermate? Who might be on your list of who else might have planted the WTC shape charges?

Now that you realize that some generally good intentioned people might have used a public relations gimmick to enhance 9-11, are you going to call for an investigation? Their arrest and punishment? There were people at 9-11 warning that the building was going to fall. Were those the people who had planted the charges, and were trying to warn the firemen to get out? All the civilians who could get out, had gotten out. The deaths of civilians were primarily those killed by the jet fuel fires, and those blocked on upper floors by unpassable stairways. The falling of the towers, themselves, cost very few lives.

Many people who have figured out that Thermite/Thermate shape charges probalby had a role in the WTC building collapses, have decided not to try to follow up this possiblity. The idea that airplanes brought down the WTC towers on 9-11-01 is a justification for US military action in Afghanistan, Iraq, and in confronting Iran. So to suggest an investigation into Thermite/Thermate at the WTC on 9-11-01, would also be an attack a Myth/Logic that justifies and motivates US Military action in the Middle East and elsewhere.

Like US interests in Ethiopia as a major shipping point for the US military to the Middle East.

For most Americans who either now support the War, or who are simply of not strong opinion for or against Wars in Afghanistan or Iraq, it is probably easiest for those people to simply discredit the idea and evidence of Thermite at WTC on 9-11.




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dirtpoorchris

Musta been the Isrial. Our government won't allow any more official investigations into it, we kiss Isreal's ass all the time. Prolly even Isreales in a boat taking pictures of the towers at the time to use it as a layout for something to sell.

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Leave it to US. To make the sun rise in the West. And fall on the East.

kathaksung

Since WTC was a hot potato in real estate market, (the insulator of the building was asbestoes that was poisonous to health) and the property belongs to New York Harbor authority. The government insider planned to pull it down for a long time. The trick was let it collapse in a terror attack, then let Insurance company pay the cost. That's why we saw there were two bombings. One was in 1993. The next time was on 911, 2001. All in the name of Islamic extremist.


The first WTC bombing was proved done under FBI's guidence. At that time, "Al Qaida" hadn't been invented. The name then was Islam extremist.

Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed!!

From the 'Lectric Law Library's stacks
Combined report by Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash
From newspaper _The_Shadow_ Oct. 1994/Jan. 1995 Issue

Two cassette tape recordings, obtained by SHADOW reporter Paul DiRienzo of telephone conversations between FBI informant Emad Salem and his Bureau contacts reveal secret U.S. Government complicity in the February 26, 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center in New York City in which six people were killed and more than a thousand were injured.
After careful deliberation, the SHADOW believes the question regarding the bombing boils down to the following: Did the FBI do the bombing, utilizing informant Salem as an "agent provocateur" or did it fail to prevent an independent Salem and his associates from doing it? The taped conversations obtained by the SHADOW seem to indicate the former:
FBI Informant Edam Salem: "...we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the DA and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful great case!"

Who is Emad Salem? FBI bomber, Arab double-agent or just greedy? Possibly a combination of all three. Salem is a former Egyptian Army officer who is currently the U.S. government's star witness against Egyptian cleric Dr. Omar Abdel Rahman, whom the FBI says was the ringleader in several bombing plots, including the World Trade Center. Shortly after the bombing at the Twin Towers (World Trade Center) the U.S. government moved to take Salem into the Witness Protection program.

According to the FBI, Salem was aware of the plot ostensibly because he had infiltrated Sheik Rahman and his associates. He was recruited as a government informant shortly after the 1991 assassination of of right- wing militant Rabbi Meir Kahane. As an associate of Rahman, Salem traveled in the cleric's inner circle, surreptitiously recording conversations, and selling his information to the Bureau. But unknown to his FBI handlers, Salem was also secretly recording his conversations with them, most likely to protect himself.

According to attorney Ron Kuby, after Salem was taken into the Witness Protection program on June 24, 1993, he told the feds about the more than 1,000 conversations he had recorded sometime between December, 1991 and June, 1993. Kuby says that while some of these tapes are not significant, others contain substantive dealings with Salem and his FBI handlers. Salem was actually bugging the FBI.

The World Trade Center bombing, along with subsequent alleged plots to bomb prominent targets in New York City, spawned a number of federal indictments and trials resulting in the conviction of more than a dozen men, all of Arabic descent. Salem's exposure as a government informant who had a year earlier infiltrated the group of men later charged in the bombing conspiracy caused many to wonder why he and the FBI failed to provide any warning of the pending World Trade Center bombing.

The answer now appears self-evident. According to William Kuntsler, attorney for Ibrahim El-Gabrowny, one of those accused in the larger bombing case, the entire conspiracy was the product of Salem, the government informant. Kuntsler's law partner Ronald Kuby told the SHADOW that within hours of the World Trade Center blast, Salem checked into a midtown hospital, complaining of a loud ringing in his ears. There is a growing belief that some of the four men charged and since convicted and jailed for the World Trade Center bombing, Mohammed Aboulihma, Mohammed Salameh, Nidal Ayyad and Ahmad Ajaj, may be innocent [victims] of a government frame-up.

Attorneys for those convicted have maintained that the government's case is circumstantial at best, with no evidence or motive linking the accused with the bombing. The FBI and federal prosecutors have not as yet responded to questions over the lack of warning of the attack on the Twin Towers, despite the strategic placement of their informant.

Two possible scenarios emerge. One: Salem is a rogue FBI informant who created the conspiracy to bomb the World Trade Center for the money his information about the plot (minus his role) would bring. An attorney for one of the convicted men told the SHADOW that Salem was an FBI informant from November of 1991 to the summer of 1992. The attorney says that the FBI became aware of the World Trade Center bombing plot through informant Salem during this period, but they refused to believe his information or pay Salem's exhorbitant fees. In fact, the feds claimed that they dropped Salem as an informant during the summer of 1992 after he refused or failed a lie detector test. This left Salem with a bombing plot but no one to sell it to.

According to the attorney, Salem let the plot that he hatched go forward and the World Trade Center was bombed so that he could get money and publicity. The attorney says that within 48 hours of the bombing, the FBI requested Salem to help them solve the case. Salem quickly pointed the fingers at the defendants, all followers of Sheik Rahman.

So, who did it? From the above point of view, Salem constructed the bomb plot with those whom he subsequently set up. The U.S. government and its FBI were innocent bystanders who failed to prevent the carnage due to their unwillingness to take Salem's claims seriously, despite his close collaboration with Bureau agents for the better part of a year.

The other scenario looks like this: Informant Salem organized the bomb plot with the "supervision" of the FBI and the District Attorney as part of a classic entrapment setup. He befriended certain individuals, possibly some of the defendants, convinced them that his intentions to bomb the World Trade Center were sincere, and convinced them to get involved. The bomb goes off. Greedy Salem, with his ears still ringing, sells out his accomplices while attempting to sell more information to the Bureau. In order to protect him and their relationship, the FBI sequesters Salem and utilizes him against the real target of the FBI, Sheik Rahman.

In one of the taped conversations between Salem and "Special Agent" John Anticev, Salem refers to him and the Bureau's involvement in making the bomb that blew up the World Trade Center. As Salem is pressing for money while emphasizing his value as a Bureau asset, the conversation moves in and out of references to the bombing and the FBI's knowledge of the bomb making:

FBI: But ah basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary but you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. (Nancy Floyd is another FBI agent who worked with Salem in his informant capacity. The second tape obtained by the SHADOW is of a telephone conversation between Salem and Floyd -Ed.)

SALEM: Well, I have to tell her of course.
FBI: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

SALEM: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with receipts and now it's questionable.
FBI: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the' ordinary.

SALEM: Okay. I don't think it was. If that what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the DA and we was all informed about it and we know what the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful great case! And then he put his head in the sand I said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." (Deep breath) Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

FBI: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.
SALEM: Of course, I appreciate that.

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http://www.ntimc.org/attachments/may...s_were_out.pdf

dirtpoorchris

Maybe look to whoever made lots of money right before it.
Long watch but he names some intresting names.
We Are Change Interviews 9/11 Whistleblower