Federal Judge Rules UC can Deny Science Credit from Creationist Schools - Page 2

Kernel Sanders · 08-13-08, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeeJayH

one more example of the pompous who think that ~90+% of the world is irrational for holding their long held beliefs
without proving the non-existence of god(s)
sad taht this is what you need to make yourself feel superior to the rest
are you lacking in other ways that requires such compensation?

Believe what you want to believe, but creationism is not science. I said that allowing colleges to treat it as such is a win for rationality, nowhere do I say it's a win for atheism

shuamort · 08-13-08, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeeJayH

one more example of the pompous who think that ~90+% of the world is irrational for holding their long held beliefs
without proving the non-existence of god(s)

You're saying that 90% of the world holds that creationism only is the truth by quoting his post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeeJayH

sad taht this is what you need to make yourself feel superior to the rest
are you lacking in other ways that requires such compensation?

Is there a reason that his stated opinion needs to result in personally attacking him?

DeeJayH · 08-13-08, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuamort

You're saying that 90% of the world holds that creationism only is the truth by quoting his post.

Is there a reason that his stated opinion needs to result in personally attacking him?

that time of hte month i guess

seriously though, despite being agnostic i find the attacks on the religious as ignorants distasteful
and i only read the OP
which is what i quoted, and what i responded to, so far
art is not science
philosophy is not science but they all get credits

DarkWizard12 · 08-13-08, 04:15 PM

Well, tell me this and this is all I need to know:

Are state-universities public universities? If they are, then they should accept anyone based soley on if they graduated and the university has the room. Usually when the world "public" gets thrown, it synonomous with "everyone; the entire public", despite what they learned, only the fact that they learned and got the credit from the HS.

Kernel Sanders · 08-13-08, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkWizard12

Well, tell me this and this is all I need to know:

Are state-universities public universities? If they are, then they should accept anyone based soley on if they graduated and the university has the room. Usually when the world "public" gets thrown, it synonomous with "everyone; the entire public", despite what they learned, only the fact that they learned and got the credit from the HS.

It isn't about acceptance into the university, it's about whether or not UC needs to give students science credits for having taken God Did It 101

shuamort · 08-13-08, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeeJayH

that time of hte month i guess

seriously though, despite being agnostic i find the attacks on the religious as ignorants distasteful
and i only read the OP
which is what i quoted, and what i responded to, so far
art is not science
philosophy is not science but they all get credits

I think it would be unfair to lump religious folks in one bucked and statethat they all support creationism. That would be ignorant. The Catholic Church, for one, has shown that it can run in tandem with its faith.

Quote:

Bishop DiLorenzo of Richmond, chair of the Committee on Science and Human Values in a December 2004 letter sent to all U.S. bishops: "...Catholic schools should continue teaching evolution as a scientific theory backed by convincing evidence. At the same time, Catholic parents whose children are in public schools should ensure that their children are also receiving appropriate catechesis at home and in the parish on God as Creator. Students should be able to leave their biology classes, and their courses in religious instruction, with an integrated understanding of the means God chose to make us who we are."

DeeJayH · 08-13-08, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuamort

I think it would be unfair to lump religious folks in one bucked and statethat they all support creationism. That would be ignorant.

I would agree
was a knee jerk reaction to the War on Christianity

but seriously, how many other topics/subjects are excluded?
been over 20 years since i was in college

are classes about greco roman gods excluded?
is intro to islam

shuamort · 08-13-08, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeeJayH

I would agree
was a knee jerk reaction to the War on Christianity

but seriously, how many other topics/subjects are excluded?
been over 20 years since i was in college

are classes about greco roman gods excluded?
is intro to islam

Unless I'm misreading the ruling, it seems that the school was also lacking in their teaching of history. (They taught a history of world religions).

Funny thing is that, IIRC, the Santorum Amendment (from R-PA Senator Rick) was his way of making sure that "competing thoughts" of creationism (aka intelligent design) were being taught in tandem with evolution. Although the amendment failed on its own, it was resurrected (forgive the pun) into the No Child Left Behind Act.

The ruling seems to also stay in boundaries with stating that creationism can be taught as long as evolution is taught with it. Since evolution was absent from the curriculum, it doesn't satisfy the UC's requirements for admission.

jfuh · 08-13-08, 05:47 PM

Christian right's going to come in here now and scream foul play and discrimination against their beliefs. Which frankly I don't have too much problem with because those beliefs are not science and thus can not be accredited as such.

tryreading · 08-13-08, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeeJayH

I would agree
was a knee jerk reaction to the War on Christianity

but seriously, how many other topics/subjects are excluded?
been over 20 years since i was in college

are classes about greco roman gods excluded?
is intro to islam

Its not about what's excluded as far as classes, its about rejecting special treatment for religious school graduates:

Charles Robinson, the university's vice president for legal affairs, said the ruling "confirms that UC may apply the same admissions standards to all students and to all high schools without regard to their religious affiliations." What the plaintiffs seek, he said, is a "religious exemption from regular admissions standards."

Colleges have standards, and if you don't meet them, tough luck, you can't attend some colleges. And this is because your parents were irresponsible enough to send you to a substandard religious school where you weren't taught the subjects everyone else admitted to the college was required to be taught:

Rejecting claims of religious discrimination and stifling of free expression, U.S. District Judge James Otero of Los Angeles said UC's review committees cited legitimate reasons for rejecting the texts - not because they contained religious viewpoints, but because they omitted important topics in science and history and failed to teach critical thinking.

(Both quotes from the OP's link)