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Tenn. Tea Party Wants Slavery Removed From Textbooks?

This is further evidence that the Tea Party are just right wing progressives who wish to use the government to impose their own particular viewpoint. Limited government? Yeah right! They are nothing but the Obamas of the far right.


Yeah no **** they want the government to control text books now by law.
 
Holy crap...did you realize that slavery in Korea didnt end until 1894??? That Koreans engaged in slavery and human trafficking like all other peoples??? WTF??? I though that was solely an American thing begat by the founding fathers...who freqin knew???

Of course I do, but we don't deny it and are ashamed of it....unlike the Tea Partiers. Also, why are you attacking other people's countries? Did I deny that slavery didn't exist in our country before?
 
Here is a British case establishing the status of a slave when entering England:

Slavery at common law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

1729:



The legality of slavery in the colonies was established by the British. Not by Johnson v Parker. We simply held on to the tradition and even fought 2 wars because of it.

England...not the Colonies. Any other case broguht before the colonial commonwealth? Cuz...Im still seeing Johnson as the landmark slave possession case here.

And it gets to the point though...right? We are talking the 1600s...not 1776 and the founding fathers so you accept (rightfully so) that the institution of slavery practiced everywhere else was naturally and logically in place at the formation of the US and not some by-product of the evil founding fathers...right?
 
Of course I do, but we don't deny it and are ashamed of it....unlike the Tea Partiers. Also, why are you attacking other people's countries? Did I deny that slavery didn't exist in our country before?

I dont excuse it justify it, nor frankly care about it. Slavery was a product of the worlds history. This inane focus on American slavery and the founding fathers is stupid. Teach it all. And its beyond comical that you wade in on a discussion about slavery in America, then when it is pointed out that your own folk engaged in the same behavior you bleat about some 'attack'.
 
agreed. every single person who signed the constitution deserves a hypocrit award, yeah, but it's just a fact that people take time to see the dumb things they do. consider it as america, young and dumb
 
England...not the Colonies.

Haha. No. At this point in history, if a slave is legal in England, it's legal in the colonies and vise versa.
 
We're talking about the people...the Founders. All the TN Tea party is saying is that the Founders shouldn't be generally portrayed as slave-owners because they weren't all slave-owners. All the want is to be fair. They want kids to learn about the abolitionist Founders and the black Founders, not just that Jefferson and Washington owned slaves.

Why wouldn't you want a more well-rounded education on the people who founded this country?

Mellie, stop excusing the actions of Jefferson and other founders. He owned slaves and had children with them... regardless if he thought slavery was wrong or not... if he changed his mind or not. The fact is, he owned slaves and treated them like second class citizens and built his house in manner that he could not even see them while they preformed their slave duties. They were his own children and part of his own family... That is pretty damn disgusting. Stop ignoring **** like that.
 
Haha. No. At this point in history, if a slave is legal in England, it's legal in the colonies and vise versa.

And yet "John Casor (surname also recorded as Cazara and Corsala[1]), a servant in Northampton County in the Virginia Colony, in 1654 became the first person of African descent in the Thirteen Colonies to be declared by the county court a slave for life.[2]"

Now...granted I dont have copies of slave holder journals but that sure does seem to indicate he wasnt the first to be owned by a black man (read that a few times for effect...slaves...owned by black men. Right here in America), but the first person declared to be a slave for life. Not an indentured servant...a slave for life. And his massa...well...now he was a black man wasnt he.

So we can play this all night or we can accept that blacks owned slaves throughout time. Whites owned slaves. America in its infancy had the benefit of learning from the growth achieved by other countries. Where slavery was enacted for 700 years in England, the importation of slaves was banned in America in 1808, a scant 20 years after the formation as a country. States had banned the practice before we became a country...yes...actions made by our 'founding fathers.' Its a shame that the lessons of humanity learned by most of the world by the 1800's still hasnt been learned where slavery is still practiced today. Old habits die hard, dont they.
 
I'm sorry, but it sounds to me like the tea party wants the whole truth told. They're tired of kids being taught that the Founders were nothing but a bunch of racists. I was taught that the 3/5 Compromise was put in the Constitution because white people didn't think blacks were fully human. Do you understand how twisted that is to teach a child that? It's twisting history for an agenda.

I was never taught the founders were racist and loathed equality... Some of them owned slaves. That's a ****ing fact. Are you denying that????

I am also disturbed that you are a teacher.
 
No, it didn't.

I find it very interesting that some people are refusing to give black people who helped found this country any credit. It's almost as though you think they were all puppets and just "helped" because they had to. It's almost as though you think all black people hated white people back then and vice versa. It's almost as though you think all the white founders were racist. Weird....

A partner conversation to this could be the "Civil Rights Era" which didn't start in the 1960s, but most people think it did.

It's one thing to honor them for their sacrifice as soldiers... It's another to point out that sacrifice and pretend like they didn't have it so bad afterall, or downplay the fact that some founders did own slaves. What those soldiers did and why, and their motives is irrelevant to your attempt to turn it into an issue about the people who signed the Declaration of Independence. If Jefferson and Washington weren't out there on the battle field with them and wrapping their wounds, breaking bread, risking their life for their their's, and burying them side by side with the whites then their sacrifice doesn't have **** to do with the signers of the DoI.
 
I've already answered your question. Calm down. It wasn't just signers of our Declaration of Independence that helped found our country.

You are using a very unconventional definition of what being a founder means... Basically, every Joe Schmoe who polished a gun during the Revolution is a founder. I pretty much detest the trivialization of words for any purpose, and this is no exception. What do you propose we call the traditional founders... the visionaries and philosophers who actually signed of the Declaration of Independence and the people responsible for writing the Constitution now?

If you want to point out that some slaves fought in the war, that's one thing... playing semantics is another.
 
And yet "John Casor (surname also recorded as Cazara and Corsala[1]), a servant in Northampton County in the Virginia Colony, in 1654 became the first person of African descent in the Thirteen Colonies to be declared by the county court a slave for life.[2]"

I'll highlight the important part for you. Do you read your own posts after you write them? Here is your statement:

VanceMack said:
Any other case broguht before the colonial commonwealth?

Now, I don't know what you think the "colonial commonwealth" means but as far as history is concerned it means all of Imperial England's territories. As British slavery laws applied to EVERY SINGLE COLONY, including the 13 colonies, what do you think are the implications of a imperial case legalizing the institution of slavery in the colonies 50+ years before Jonson v. Parker?

I'll wait for you to put 2 and 2 together.
 
I dont excuse it justify it, nor frankly care about it. Slavery was a product of the worlds history. This inane focus on American slavery and the founding fathers is stupid. Teach it all. And its beyond comical that you wade in on a discussion about slavery in America, then when it is pointed out that your own folk engaged in the same behavior you bleat about some 'attack'.

Of course, the US wasn't the only country to have a history full of slaves. Of course, my own country had slaves, which I am ashamed of. Yet I don't denied it, unlike the Tea Partiers. Yet you pressed on the issue about Korean slaves, so if that isn't an attack, then what is it? Did I say that the US was the only slave-owning country in history?
 
Here's a pretty graphic photo of the two Koreas, the free south and the enslaved north, taken at night from a satellite.

It only marginally relates to the topic, but is an interesting contrast anyway.

picture8.jpg
 
I'll highlight the important part for you. Do you read your own posts after you write them? Here is your statement:



Now, I don't know what you think the "colonial commonwealth" means but as far as history is concerned it means all of Imperial England's territories. As British slavery laws applied to EVERY SINGLE COLONY, including the 13 colonies, what do you think are the implications of a imperial case legalizing the institution of slavery in the colonies 50+ years before Jonson v. Parker?

I'll wait for you to put 2 and 2 together.

You dance like a drunken Hillbilly...badly. In the colonies...the FIRST CASE brought before the commonwealth AND the first known slave was awarded via the Johnson Casor case. Johnson...Freed indentured servant (and a black man) sued for the lifetime OWNERSHIP of another man (who happened to be black) and was awarded ownership in the FIRST case of outright slavery in the colonies. Teach that. And teach everyone else in the world that practiced slavery. Throughout history. Make sure native Americans know their history. Make sure Hispanic folk know their history. Make sure black folk know their history. Make sure they teach who STILL practices slavery today, just as strongly as they teach who practiced slavery long before there ever WHERE European colonies in America.

Spin it like you spin yer sister...it still aint gonna be nuthin more than reality, dood.
 
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Of course, the US wasn't the only country to have a history full of slaves. Of course, my own country had slaves, which I am ashamed of. Yet I don't denied it, unlike the Tea Partiers. Yet you pressed on the issue about Korean slaves, so if that isn't an attack, then what is it? Did I say that the US was the only slave-owning country in history?

I said the same thing about ANYONE that wnats to deny hyistory as I said about the Koreans...teach EVERYTHING! Make sure the youth are taught not only that the Founding Fathers inherited and for a time continued the tradition of slavery but make sure they understand it was the way of the whole world...and yes...even in your little slice of heaven. I dont think they should selectively teach it ANYWHERE and I challenge you to find even a hint of that on anything I posted.

Im sorry you are ashamed at your history. I will tell you plainly that I am not.
 
I said the same thing about ANYONE that wnats to deny hyistory as I said about the Koreans...teach EVERYTHING! Make sure the youth are taught not only that the Founding Fathers inherited and for a time continued the tradition of slavery but make sure they understand it was the way of the whole world...and yes...even in your little slice of heaven. I dont think they should selectively teach it ANYWHERE and I challenge you to find even a hint of that on anything I posted.

Im sorry you are ashamed at your history. I will tell you plainly that I am not.

How should anyone feel about slavery? I'm not sure how to read what you write here, but the fact is it wasn't just an acceptance of the way the world was, but some actually believed in the way it was. We can work our way through each person, but the point is if it wasn't accepted, even believed in, would we have continued?
 
How should anyone feel about slavery? I'm not sure how to read what you write here, but the fact is it wasn't just an acceptance of the way the world was, but some actually believed in the way it was. We can work our way through each person, but the point is if it wasn't accepted, even believed in, would we have continued?

The history of the world shows pretty clearly that slavery as an institution was on its way out in civilized countries. England abandoned slavery at about the same time the US did. The US banned the importation of slaves about 50 years before slavery itself was banned. Many of the northern colonies banned slavery before they became states. It is my belief that the civil war was not fought over slavery...slavery was the convenient rallying cry. I also believe that slavery would have run it's course ion short order and we would have had far less racial strife over the last 100 years had it done so.

Im sure thinking people feel repulsed about the thought of and practice of slavery. People that feel ashamed about history that they palyed no part in are in my opinion hystrionic fools.

Perhaps if the worlds true history on slavery including the fact that it is still practiced today were taught, people might have a greater understanding of the truth. I wonder how much further along race relations would have been if people understood history vs hysteria.
 
The history of the world shows pretty clearly that slavery as an institution was on its way out in civilized countries. England abandoned slavery at about the same time the US did. The US banned the importation of slaves about 50 years before slavery itself was banned. Many of the northern colonies banned slavery before they became states. It is my belief that the civil war was not fought over slavery...slavery was the convenient rallying cry. I also believe that slavery would have run it's course ion short order and we would have had far less racial strife over the last 100 years had it done so.

Im sure thinking people feel repulsed about the thought of and practice of slavery. People that feel ashamed about history that they palyed no part in are in my opinion hystrionic fools.

Perhaps if the worlds true history on slavery including the fact that it is still practiced today were taught, people might have a greater understanding of the truth. I wonder how much further along race relations would have been if people understood history vs hysteria.

I would not argue the civil war was fought over slavery, but instead how southern states want slaves counted both ways, as slaves, keeping them as slsaves, property, and as people to help with representation. The point is, we sadly were not as opposed to slavery as we should have considering our rethoric concerning freedom.

As for feelings, we all have to look back on our past, and we're likley to have feelings about it, be it our personal past or our national past. It is merely human nature to have feelings. I've done things I wouldn't change that I feel bad about, even though I learned. I suspect I'm not alone with that type of feeling. This can be true concerning our nation. We've done things as a nation we should not feel proud about. And it is good to have those things see the light of day and to remind ousrselves that we can do bad things. We're human, not perfect, and if we don't pay attention and stay vigilant, we can do wrong in hurry.

And what you ask be taught is what is taught. However, you seem to be asking that it be taught with a more positive spin, meaning to me that perhaps you can how you feel about it. I could be wrong of course, so I'm not saying I know this is the case for sure. But there really isn't any significant hysteria to any measurable degree.
 
The civil war was fought to preserve the union. The Confederate States seceded and tried to form their own nation. The Northern States fought a war to keep them from doing so. Slavery was a part of it, but the war was not fought to end slavery.

Slavery may have ended in the US and other fat lands of the world, but it has not ended in every country even today. It still persists in the less "developed" nations. It has also been a part of human history for thousands of years. To simply single out slavery in America and not study slavery as an institution is to misunderstand history.
 
I would not argue the civil war was fought over slavery, but instead how southern states want slaves counted both ways, as slaves, keeping them as slsaves, property, and as people to help with representation. The point is, we sadly were not as opposed to slavery as we should have considering our rethoric concerning freedom.

As for feelings, we all have to look back on our past, and we're likley to have feelings about it, be it our personal past or our national past. It is merely human nature to have feelings. I've done things I wouldn't change that I feel bad about, even though I learned. I suspect I'm not alone with that type of feeling. This can be true concerning our nation. We've done things as a nation we should not feel proud about. And it is good to have those things see the light of day and to remind ousrselves that we can do bad things. We're human, not perfect, and if we don't pay attention and stay vigilant, we can do wrong in hurry.

And what you ask be taught is what is taught. However, you seem to be asking that it be taught with a more positive spin, meaning to me that perhaps you can how you feel about it. I could be wrong of course, so I'm not saying I know this is the case for sure. But there really isn't any significant hysteria to any measurable degree.

We? What...did you have access to some time machine? How many slaves exactly did you own? Or was it your neighbors that owned them that you didnt speak out loudly enough against?

Look...people all across the world...not just this country were speaking out against slavery and promoting change. The 'peculiar institution' was under attack by society and growth. History proves that to be correct. The total historical perspective of slavery including its origins and where it is being practiced STILL should be taught.
 
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