Obama only paid a 26% income tax rate for 2010

Morality Games · Apr 23, 2011

apdst said:
You're absolutely right. However, I question the hell out of a president that decries rich people, all the while he's rich and playing the same games.

Political gestures are only worth it if somebody cares. Neither conservative, liberal, or moderate opinions of Obama will transform because he acted against his advantage on taxes.

Henrin · Apr 23, 2011

Morality Games said:
Because the law doesn't require it. If Obama passed a law where he had to pay more in taxes, he would probably follow it.

Why does it matter what the law states? If he wants to pay more like he says he can do so and not change a thing. If he is only running on what is required than I can only assume he isn't serious about his claims of wanting to pay more himself.

Barbbtx · Apr 23, 2011

justabubba said:
this thread again shows the reich wing is clueless about things economic
in various discussions a distinction has been made between marginal tax rate and effective tax rate to show why the wealthy are able to exploit tax loopholes
and it is clear in this thread that many remain clueless of the distinction between the marginal and effective tax rates

learn from Judge Learned Hand:
Obama is entitled to exploit the loopholes like any other taxpayer
if we want the exploitation ended, then we must convince the congress to close those loopholes. as Obama has requested

Sorry, anyone who gets on national TV and says he is not paying enough in taxes has an obligation to voluntarily pay more. He's worse than Al Gore flying around in private jets.

Henrin · Apr 23, 2011

Morality Games said:
Political gestures are only worth it if somebody cares. Neither conservative, liberal, or moderate opinions of Obama will transform because he acted against his advantage on taxes.

Yes, it would be worthless if it was a political gesture. If however he is serious about wanting to pay more he would of been paying more for years and have no political gesturing going on.

Barbbtx · Apr 23, 2011

Wiseone said:
I got a feeling if he had paid more, you'd be saying something about how he must think we are all dumb, how else would he think we'd all follow the 'messiah' and do something as idiotic and give more money than we had to to the government.

That or some other BS.

I'd say, Damn! I'm shocked. Good for him. Now can we get Gore out of his mansions and private jets?

Wiseone · Apr 23, 2011

Henrin said:
Why does it matter what the law states? If he wants to pay more like he says he can do so and not change a thing. If he is only running on what is required than I can only assume he isn't serious about his claims of wanting to pay more himself.

I'm a service member and I think as part of a general gov't reduction in spending my pay should be frozen at its current rate or even cut back a little come next year, hopefully as part of a wider reform of military pay policy. My issue with this pay is way more than simply how much I get.

So do you think because of my opinion I'm now morally obligated to return some of my pay somehow to the goverment?

Wiseone · Apr 23, 2011

Barbbtx said:
I'd say, Damn! I'm shocked. Good for him. Now can we get Gore out of his mansions and private jets?

What the hell does Gore have to do with any of this? O I see you're doing that thing were you pull up an example of a liberal being hypocritical and even though you don't say it, the guy/issue is so unrelated to the actual topic(you know the one in this thread, the one we're supposed to be talking about?) that there's no other reason to bring it up other than to group all liberals into one easily generalization and bash them all at once.

But dispite all that, you're right about Gore he's a hypocrite and his movie is crap. But thats not the topic.

Barbbtx · Apr 23, 2011

Badmutha said:
But HusSame said the rich want to pay higher taxes........

.........so whats stopping that pile of Kenyan excrement?.....besides his glaring hypocrisy.

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I wonder how much extra the other "Tax Me More" crowd paid?
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Barbbtx · Apr 23, 2011

justabubba said:
what is stopping him is a tax code laden with tax loopholes. the ones he wants closedit appears you ignored the statement of Judge Learned Hand

Really? So does Ryan and the Republicans. What's stopping them?

Barbbtx · Apr 23, 2011

justabubba said:
if Obama had paid taxes above what was required then those of your ilk would have begun a thread insisting Obama proved he was was stupid, by paying more than he was obligated

You can't possibly believe that.
My ilk would be glad to see him doing something to show that he is willing to sacrifice along with the rest of the country.
Haven't seen that yet.

justabubba · Apr 23, 2011

Barbbtx said:
Really? So does Ryan and the Republicans. What's stopping them?

special interests with lots of money, offered to politicians of both parties to do what is best for the special interests, instead of the American citizen

Morality Games · Apr 23, 2011

Yes, it would be worthless if it was a political gesture. If however he is serious about wanting to pay more he would of been paying more for years and have no political gesturing going on.

The question here is whether someone should voluntarily act against their advantage if they are promoting a policy whereby certain individuals would be compelled to the same disadvantage for the public good.

For leaders of a polity, I would say that depends on the values of the body politic they preside over. Since the American people would not value such behaviors, such an action would be irrational. There's no reason for Obama to act against his family's interest when nobody would appreciate the symbolic significance of his action.

Henrin · Apr 23, 2011

Wiseone said:
I'm a service member and I think as part of a general gov't reduction in spending my pay should be frozen at its current rate or even cut back a little come next year, hopefully as part of a wider reform of military pay policy. My issue with this pay is way more than simply how much I get.

So do you think because of my opinion I'm now morally obligated to return some of my pay somehow to the goverment?

If you feel you are getting paid too much feel free to give some back to your employer.

Barbbtx · Apr 23, 2011

Wiseone said:
I'm a service member and I think as part of a general gov't reduction in spending my pay should be frozen at its current rate or even cut back a little come next year, hopefully as part of a wider reform of military pay policy. My issue with this pay is way more than simply how much I get.

So do you think because of my opinion I'm now morally obligated to return some of my pay somehow to the goverment?

If you are in the military you are getting screwed in your pay. I wish we could get our fiscal house in order, so you guys could get a big fat raise.
You're worth a hell of a lot more than our congress, for example.
We need to get the waste and fraud out of our defense spending, not paychecks to our military.

justabubba · Apr 23, 2011

Barbbtx said:
You can't possibly believe that.

i absolutely believe that

My ilk would be glad to see him doing something to show that he is willing to sacrifice along with the rest of the country.
Haven't seen that yet.

your ilk is the one blaming Obama for not taking action in libya and then ranting when he did
for not taking immediate action to rachet up the troop numbers in afghanistan and then complaining when he did
... you always want it the way other than Obama acted ... even if you previously advocated the actions he adopted

Morality Games · Apr 23, 2011

Henrin said:
If you feel you are getting paid too much feel free to give some back to your employer.

No one seriously feels as though "they" personally are paid too much. Even Warren Buffet feels he has the moral knowledge necessary to use his wealth responsibly, he just thinks his income bracket should make less in general because he is an exception.

Amazed · Apr 23, 2011

Well....his Earth Day Travels used 53000 Gallons of fuel..I'm jus sayin...

Bruce said:
Care to prove that statement?

Barbbtx · Apr 23, 2011

Morality Games said:
The question here is whether someone should voluntarily act against their advantage if they are promoting a policy whereby certain individuals would be compelled to the same disadvantage for the public good.

For leaders of a polity, I would say that depends on the values of the body politic they preside over. Since the American people would not value such behaviors, such an action would be irrational. There's no reason for Obama to act against his family's interest when nobody would appreciate the symbolic significance of his action.

You're over looking the fact that no matter how little, his extra money would be going toward our debt or deficit..

I'm a spay and neuter fanatic. If I never get one person to see things my way, I'm still doing right and helping the pet overpopulation by spaying and neutering every animal I've ever taken in or will take in, in the future.

Obama would helping by paying more even if no one else did.

Henrin · Apr 23, 2011

Morality Games said:
The question here is whether someone should voluntarily act against their advantage if they are promoting a policy whereby certain individuals would be compelled to the same disadvantage for the public good.

If you honestly believe in it, act on it. If you are in fact like everyone else only interested in what you can get, don't. When you truly believe in something you act on it and are willing to pay for it yourself. In such a case you wouldn't need force to make you act on it as you would be doing it already.

For leaders of a polity, I would say that depends on the values of the body politic they preside over. Since the American people would not value such behaviors, such an action would be irrational.

It would be irrational to do if he was only doing it to get political points, but it wouldn't be irrational if he honestly believed in it.

Barbbtx · Apr 23, 2011

justabubba said:
i absolutely believe that

your ilk is the one blaming Obama for not taking action in libya and then ranting when he did
for not taking immediate action to rachet up the troop numbers in afghanistan and then complaining when he did
... you always want it the way other than Obama acted ... even if you previously advocated the actions he adopted

When it comes to Libya and the other wars "my ilk" is not in agreement with each other. Personally, except for being slow, I've agreed with Obama's actions in these areas.

Henrin · Apr 23, 2011

Morality Games said:
No one seriously feels as though "they" personally are paid too much. Even Warren Buffet feels he has the moral knowledge necessary to use his wealth responsibly, he just thinks his income bracket should make less in general because he is an exception.

That is what he just said. Did you not read it? He said he should have his pay frozen or "cut". Implying that he feels he is paid to much. If that is the case, he can give back the extra.

As for Warren Buffet, a very small amount of his money is considered income and that is why he talks such a big game.

Badmutha · Apr 23, 2011

Wiseone said:
If I was mod I'd thread ban Badmutha from every thread he enters, not because he violates forum rules, its not against the rules to be stupid anyway, but because he degrades every topic he enters so quickly and so thoroughly there's nothing left reading. Its almost inspiring.

What are you crying about?

I pointed out the President of Hypocrisy took every deduction he could........after preaching for 2 weeks against it.

The truth hurts.......
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Amazed · Apr 23, 2011

Absolutely, very few people actually address that issue....it's what makes the Libs arguments ring hollow....howuch "Income Tax" do the Kennedy's pay

Henrin said:
That is what he just said. Did you not read it? He said he should have his pay frozen or "cut". Implying that he feels he is paid to much. If that is the case, he can give back the extra.

As for Warren Buffet, a very small amount of his money is considered income and that is why he talks such a big game.

Slartibartfast · Apr 23, 2011

Amazed said:
Absolutely, very few people actually address that issue....it's what makes the Libs arguments ring hollow....howuch "Income Tax" do the Kennedy's pay

Personally, I fail to see why something like this is even considered an issue.

Morality Games · Apr 23, 2011

Henrin said:
If you honestly believe in it, act on it. If you are in fact like everyone else only interested in what you can get, don't. When you truly believe in something you act on it and are willing to pay for it yourself. In such a case you wouldn't need force to make you act on it as you would be doing it already.

It would be irrational to do if he was only doing it to get political points, but it wouldn't be irrational if he honestly believed in it.

I can't speak for Obama's conscience, but given his high profile Ivy League background I doubt he finds irrational actions personally meaningful. Why would you hurt your family to make a point nobody cares about? Given his duties as a father and husband, that would be irresponsible.

That is what he just said. Did you not read it? He said he should have his pay frozen or "cut". Implying that he feels he is paid to much. If that is the case, he can give back the extra.

As for Warren Buffet, a very small amount of his money is considered income and that is why he talks such a big game.

Making a statement like that gets his point across to the extent it has to be get across, actually giving back his money would be over the top.

What are you crying about?

I pointed out the President of Hypocrisy took every deduction he could........after preaching for 2 weeks against it.

The truth hurts.......
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.
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People can't be consistently expected to act against their economic self-interest.

That's why he's appealing to society to act on their economic self-interest and pass the burden of taxes to the wealthy.

Obama only paid a 26% income tax rate for 2010

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