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Thread: Unions threaten Business

  1. #541
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Examples?
    I'm not going to search for examples for someone who knows how they behave.

    Having the state supreme court intervene in your school system indicates to me that it was a dismal failure. Maybe that's what should happen in every state. But throwing more money at the problem is not the answer.
    Again bringing up arguments that have nothing to do with my post. Also, Chicago faces lawsuits on education all the time. It's just a matter of when it'll be taken care of.

    Yes, increased money does do good things when it is spent appropriately. So does the same amount of money. Spending money appropriately is the answer...not an endless supply of it.
    What you're not understanding/admitting is that 1. This "endless supply point" is a straw man because NO ONE has brought it up. It neither takes away nor adds anything to the arguments being made here or anywhere else on this board by anyone. 2. "The same amount of money" point would be relevant if we were talking about rich schools who were not underfunded. The problem is when most people talk about increased funding they are referencing underfunded schools (i.e. schools that get less than rich school) in low-income areas where more funding is needed. ----In other words, nobody ever brings up increasing money for places that have adequate money and are just using it poorly.

    We bring it up for places that don't even have enough money to use in the wrong ways.

    NY is a beautiful example that more money doesn't mean better educations. New York spends far more per student than Massachusetts yet has absolutely dismal statistics. Proves my point exactly. It's not MORE money that's needed. It's more money spent the right way.
    You have still failed to show how NY is a good example of how increased funds does not help because you have not acknowledged these three things:
    1. Whether NY's money spent was excess - (Every state spends different amounts of money because every state has different needs. Why is $17,000 too much for NY specifically?)
    2. Whether NY spent its funds appropriately - maybe it is spending enough, just not in the right places. Where is NY spending its money?
    3. Time - I'll repeat it again since you ignored it - MA took 10-12 years to reap the benefits of its plan. NY has not had as much time, at all, to see the effects of its reform so you have no idea if it worked.

    And your last point: there's no need to argue against an argument that I never made.
    Last edited by ThePlayDrive; 03-20-11 at 04:43 PM.

  2. #542
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I came back into this thread because of your ridiculous comparison of education v military as % of GDP. I am not specifically addressing Wisconsin. Neither were you. However, now that you mention it, by eliminating the teachers' unions jackboot control over administrators and school boards, we just might see some reallocation of funding.

    That's what I thought, there are no proposals except to cut funding and end collective bargaining.



    When you cite a link, at least let it corroborate your ascertain that nonunion schools don't have special ed classes. Jeesh.
    I thought you wanted to learn what inclusion/mainstreaming was since it sounded like you had never heard of it.

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  3. #543
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by Badmutha View Post
    .....because its easier and safer to just let THE MOB take it isnt it. Should you object, they send men with guns to your door.
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    mob? what mob? still no one here holding me at gunpoint...try again?

  4. #544
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by randel View Post
    mob? what mob? still no one here holding me at gunpoint...try again?
    Try not paying The Mob.......see what happens.
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  5. #545
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by Badmutha View Post
    Try not paying The Mob.......see what happens.
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    what mob? you have created an imaginary boogeyman...

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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by randel View Post
    what mob? you have created an imaginary boogeyman...
    Look at the paystub from your government allowance........

    .......you must be imagining those taxes.....
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  7. #547
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by Badmutha View Post
    Look at the paystub from your government allowance........

    .......you must be imagining those taxes.....
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    mmmm...nope...the government is not the mob....keep trying though, as this is amusing

  8. #548
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by Badmutha View Post
    Look at the paystub from your government allowance........

    .......you must be imagining those taxes.....
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    Darn republicans I always knew they were crooks and theives
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  9. #549
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    I'm not going to search for examples for someone who knows how they behave.
    Then pretty much another personal attack from TPD. No problem. I couldn't care any less.

    What you're not understanding/admitting is that 1. This "endless supply point" is a straw man because NO ONE has brought it up. It neither takes away nor adds anything to the arguments being made here or anywhere else on this board by anyone. 2. "The same amount of money" point would be relevant if we were talking about rich schools who were not underfunded. The problem is when most people talk about increased funding they are referencing underfunded schools (i.e. schools that get less than rich school) in low-income areas where more funding is needed. ----In other words, nobody ever brings up increasing money for places that have adequate money and are just using it poorly. We bring it up for places that don't even have enough money to use in the wrong ways.
    I don't understand this post. Address MY point. NY spends considerably more per student than MA yet is a dismal failure.

    1. Whether NY's money spent was excess - (Every state spends different amounts of money because every state has different needs. Why is $17,000 too much for NY specifically?)
    2. Whether NY spent its funds appropriately - maybe it is spending enough, just not in the right places. Where is NY spending its money?
    3. Time - I'll repeat it again since you ignored it - MA took 10-12 years to reap the benefits of its plan. NY has not had as much time, at all, to see the effects of its reform so you have no idea if it worked.
    Jeesh. Bolded phrase above? That's my whole freakin' point. As to ignoring your #3, I ignored it because I don't know whether or not NY just increased its funding....do you?
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by randel View Post
    mob? what mob? still no one here holding me at gunpoint...try again?
    That's how Fox News like to portray the union teachers and street cleaners. Like a fictional 1940's mafia movie.

    They use visuals and music to reinforce the image with their audience. It's called getting ratings with the FEAR factor.

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