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Thread: Unions threaten Business

  1. #401
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Hey hey hey! Quit pointing out reality! Besides, the rich are special. They..umm...pay taxes (now let's not go into the uber rich who pay lower marginal tax rates than their employees) and they totally give to charities; something no other class in America does...EVER. And they supply us with jobs because they aren't moving production overseas and without those rich we could never have jobs because in America there are not droves of people waiting in the wings to take over who could do a better job. None in the least. Leave the rich alone!
    I like free market capitalism, we do not have it. I would like to drive us into the free market state. Being part of the problem doesn't achieve those ends.
    Shheezz I see you are for the free market and capitalism, as long as it fits your idea of what it should be huh? Guess the idea of moving a company to a place where they can increase profits..... and still keep prices low, doesn't meet with your idea of free market capitalism

    So why don't the two of you go into business, employ others paying them that great middle class wage, and keep your profits and your own pay down to where you think it should be ??

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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    They should be taxed equally. The rules are not set up that way, however. Nor did I call the evil rich. I said they are not special. They're the same as us all. Yet they can get the government to set up specialized tax brackets and breaks to reduce their marginal tax rate to be below the rest of ours. Why should they pay less in taxes? Being rich doesn't make one special, it merely makes them rich.

    But continue with your penis jokes because it's doing wonders for your argument.
    So tell me...you REALLY want the people to be taxed evenly? Because honestly...Im ALL FOR a flat tax-kill off the earned income credit...no exemptions...across the board one flat tax rate. You bet. Or by 'even' do you mean a progressively higher tax rate where the 'poor' pay nothing (and continue to get the EIC and receive money they didnt pay in the first place), middle income pay more, and high income pay progressively more. Which would you prefer? The fact is that the rich DO pay more than the poor or the middle income. Always have and always will.

    And if you dont like being shown THAT you display penis envy of the rich then stop WHINING about them and putting it on display for all the world to see.

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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    So tell me...you REALLY want the people to be taxed evenly? Because honestly...Im ALL FOR a flat tax-kill off the earned income credit...no exemptions...across the board one flat tax rate. You bet. Or by 'even' do you mean a progressively higher tax rate where the 'poor' pay nothing (and continue to get the EIC and receive money they didnt pay in the first place), middle income pay more, and high income pay progressively more. Which would you prefer? The fact is that the rich DO pay more than the poor or the middle income. Always have and always will.

    And if you dont like being shown THAT you display penis envy of the rich then stop WHINING about them and putting it on display for all the world to see.
    I don't know if I'd go with the poor paying nothing. However, regressive taxe schemes can be a bit shady. I would get rid of things like capital gains taxes as all income should be treated as income and if I'm getting taxed a certain rate on my income, then so should everyone else. In the end, I wonder if the US government ever took the Cayman islands I wonder how many people would be running for the hills.

    But good job keeping on your penis jokes, glad to see debating like and adult isn't in your repertoire.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    There is no benefit to the country for rich people taking their tax savings and investing it in tax free accounts overseas. It just makes it harder on the middle class and increases our national debt. We have 30 years of experience that shows that Reaganomics (trickle down theory) never worked. The rich get richer and more and more of he middle class are turned into the poor.
    We are losing our middle class, because we are losing our middle class jobs. I agree we are losing our middle class, the gap between rich and poor is widening.... But if you think for one minute, that those earning below 100.000 a year, is going to help to build the jobs in this country, you are nuts. Like it or not, it's the wealthy and only them, that can create jobs. Now you might no like that, but again, it's just the facts.

    What we need to be doing is trying to create an atmosphere that makes it economically attractive for corporations and businesses to want to come here and prosper. You don't have to like the fact that basically we have waged ourselves out of the global marketplace, (wages including benefits) Until we can figure out how to do that, nothing is going to change.

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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    We are losing our middle class, because we are losing our middle class jobs. I agree we are losing our middle class, the gap between rich and poor is widening.... But if you think for one minute, that those earning below 100.000 a year, is going to help to build the jobs in this country, you are nuts. Like it or not, it's the wealthy and only them, that can create jobs. Now you might no like that, but again, it's just the facts.

    What we need to be doing is trying to create an atmosphere that makes it economically attractive for corporations and businesses to want to come here and prosper. You don't have to like the fact that basically we have waged ourselves out of the global marketplace, (wages including benefits) Until we can figure out how to do that, nothing is going to change.
    There's a simple fix to that, pay more. We have labor and environmental laws which will cost us money. But green policies and fair labor policies probably aren't the worst thing in the world. However, it's much cheaper to produce in countries without those laws. There's nothing wrong with the laws themselves, I think responsible environmental and labor laws are good and necessary in a system. But there's no such thing as a free lunch and if we want these things, we have to pay for these things. The fact is that the rich aren't special, and they aren't going to get us out of this mess (who do you think drove us to this place anyway?). There are tons of people who can do the job, for every rich person there are thousands who would like to be rich. And they'll play by the rules too. Instead of thinking that we have to prop up corporations whenever they fail, why don't we focus on promoting small, local business instead? You don't need to be a billionare to start one of those.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I don't know if I'd go with the poor paying nothing. However, regressive taxe schemes can be a bit shady. I would get rid of things like capital gains taxes as all income should be treated as income and if I'm getting taxed a certain rate on my income, then so should everyone else. In the end, I wonder if the US government ever took the Cayman islands I wonder how many people would be running for the hills.

    But good job keeping on your penis jokes, glad to see debating like and adult isn't in your repertoire.
    Have you ever seen or read a book called the fair tax?? If not you should find an read it. It's basically a consumption tax... all other federal taxes are dropped including SS and Medicare. There is no filing for anything at the end of the year. Those below the poverty level are actually send checks every month to cover their tax.

    If I remember it right, it would be around 20%, and those supporting it say, (Ican't prove it) that prices would drop in the marketplace by about 15% within a year, because of the existing taxes that are one all goods sold.

    That is just one way of making our tax system fairer to all. But I think that anything near or like it would be better, and it's what is needed, our existing tax system is failing.

  7. #407
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    There are many various debatable forms of taxation which in the end would probably produce better results than what we currently have. There's no reason for such a complicated tax system as we have. I'm not opposed to having serious debate over types of taxation.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    There's a simple fix to that, pay more. We have labor and environmental laws which will cost us money. But green policies and fair labor policies probably aren't the worst thing in the world. However, it's much cheaper to produce in countries without those laws. There's nothing wrong with the laws themselves, I think responsible environmental and labor laws are good and necessary in a system. But there's no such thing as a free lunch and if we want these things, we have to pay for these things. The fact is that the rich aren't special, and they aren't going to get us out of this mess (who do you think drove us to this place anyway?). There are tons of people who can do the job, for every rich person there are thousands who would like to be rich. And they'll play by the rules too. Instead of thinking that we have to prop up corporations whenever they fail, why don't we focus on promoting small, local business instead? You don't need to be a billionare to start one of those.
    I agree with everything you just said, I never have said the rich were special. I just get tired of the blame Bush game. I was also in favor of letting the tax cuts just expire.

    The only problem with your idea is, as long as we retain “free” trade, it can't happen. Those countries that don't have our laws will produce those goods as a much cheaper price, send them here, and be able to sell them cheaper then we can produce them. I'm sorry to say, but most Americans will by the cheaper item … talk is a great thing, but when it comes to balancing your home budget, and having a little extra left over.... the less expensive item often is the one brought.

  9. #409
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I don't know if I'd go with the poor paying nothing. However, regressive taxe schemes can be a bit shady. I would get rid of things like capital gains taxes as all income should be treated as income and if I'm getting taxed a certain rate on my income, then so should everyone else. In the end, I wonder if the US government ever took the Cayman islands I wonder how many people would be running for the hills.

    But good job keeping on your penis jokes, glad to see debating like and adult isn't in your repertoire.
    Well...you know...debating someone that incessantly whines about successful people...well...it gets a little wearisome. Like I said...stop whining about people that are more successful than you and you wont come across as being envious of people that got something you are obviously lacking.

    I'm fine with a flat tax and eliminating tax breaks. If the federal government demonstrated responsible spending, hell Id be fine with paying more in taxes. AFTER congress demonstrates legislatively mandated fiscal responsibility. However when a 'progressive' congress progressively spends more and more, it makes no sense to just let them. And blaming the ills of the world on people that demonstrate an ability to succeed is simply weak. Almost as weak as the idiots that blame the problems of the country on one party or the other. Or those that blame their own failure in life on others and whine because congress isnt doing more to take from the successful and give it to them.

  10. #410
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    Re: Unions threaten Business

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    I agree with everything you just said, I never have said the rich were special. I just get tired of the blame Bush game. I was also in favor of letting the tax cuts just expire.

    The only problem with your idea is, as long as we retain “free” trade, it can't happen. Those countries that don't have our laws will produce those goods as a much cheaper price, send them here, and be able to sell them cheaper then we can produce them. I'm sorry to say, but most Americans will by the cheaper item … talk is a great thing, but when it comes to balancing your home budget, and having a little extra left over.... the less expensive item often is the one brought.
    Haha, I've recently toyed with the idea of pissing off China and putting up tarrifs. But at the same accord, we are responsible too for this because our consuming habits also promote this sort of behavior. There was a time when a business was concerned with their employees. They would do everything in their power, including taking pay cuts or short term losses of profit, to keep people hired on and things running. That commitment and resolve is gone, it's now all Harvard Business types who look only at the bottom line. When the worker becomes nothing more than a line item in a spreadsheet. Their goal is to maximize profit, and that's it. And if they can look more profitable by laying off a bunch of people, then so be it. It would be hard to get that resolve back, but we need to understand as well our roll in the entire system and begin to consume in intelligent and researched manners.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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