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Unions threaten Business

You mean walmart? The company that wraps themselves in the flag while encouraging suppliers to move their production to China?

No I mean 99.99% of businesses in the United States.

Nobody wants THE MOB running their business..........

.....perhaps if there was ONE EXAMPLE IN WORLD HISTORY of a Union not running a business it infected into the ground......business owners might feel different.
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Walmart doesnt have to encourage US Businesses to relocate to China..........The end of a Democrat Whip is doing the job for them.
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any proof of that?

so when unions kill people or beat them up that is no worse than the police arresting union goons who are blocking business driveways or vandalizing the cars of workers trying to work?

Proof

Heck I thought we were all making up stories in this thread.

I didnt think we were looking for proof of anything. Just the most exagerated things a person can think off
 
Nope. I didn't say that. I am though trying to figure out why not going to a top 10 school makes you the "bottom of the barrel". If people want to be teachers, they will likely go to a place that has a pre-education major even if they were the smartest student in high school.

Although when I went to the University of Chicago (where pre-education, pre-law and pre-med are not majors), there was a philosophy major who was pretty much a genius and scored a perfect on LSAT - she said she wanted to be a kindergarten teacher...


yeah and a Marshall Scholar I went to Yale with dropped out of Yale Law to go teach at a yeshiva after he had some major life crisis that caused him to become an Orthodox jew after being non-observant most of his life but he was a rather rare exception. My three years of living in 8 man suites featured 9 who became Lawyers including one of Bush II's Attorney Generals, 6 who became doctors, one a chess International Master is a computer programmer and executive, another an actor and the one teacher teaches astrophysics in the top university Israel now. One guy died early (colon cancer at 29!) while working on wall street as an investment banker, and two I lost track of-both were premed. I can only think of a couple that were teachers-and one did that common two year stint at a prep school before going on to Cornell Law School
 
Proof

Heck I thought we were all making up stories in this thread.

I didnt think we were looking for proof of anything. Just the most exagerated things a person can think off

feel free to establish I have made up anything

fascism is much closer to many unionistas than you probably would like to believe
 
yeah and a Marshall Scholar I went to Yale with dropped out of Yale Law to go teach at a yeshiva after he had some major life crisis that caused him to become an Orthodox jew after being non-observant most of his life but he was a rather rare exception. My three years of living in 8 man suites featured 9 who became Lawyers including one of Bush II's Attorney Generals, 6 who became doctors, one a chess International Master is a computer programmer and executive, another an actor and the one teacher teaches astrophysics in the top university Israel now. One guy died early (colon cancer at 29!) while working on wall street as an investment banker, and two I lost track of-both were premed. I can only think of a couple that were teachers-and one did that common two year stint at a prep school before going on to Cornell Law School

Great. I'm happy for you, but my anecdote about the UofC was MEANT to be an exception to the rule (I'm glad we agree). Nonetheless, my actual criticism of your assumption still stands:

theplaydrive said:
I am though trying to figure out why not going to a top 10 school makes you the "bottom of the barrel". If people want to be teachers, they will likely go to a place that has a pre-education major even if they were the smartest student in high school.

In other words, why would you go to a school (top 10 or not) if it doesn't have the major you want?
 
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How about the IBEW? And BTW auto companies hurt themselves. The unions didn't do it. There are less union workers in the auto industry and it's still having issues. But executive pay has risen ten fold. But I know its PC these days to blame unions for bad management
No I mean 99.99% of businesses in the United States.

Nobody wants THE MOB running their business..........

.....perhaps if there was ONE EXAMPLE IN WORLD HISTORY of a Union not running a business it infected into the ground......business owners might feel different.
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Walmart doesnt have to encourage US Businesses to relocate to China..........The end of a Democrat Whip is doing the job for them.
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How about the IBEW?

What about it?

Surely you hired Union Electricians to work on or install the electrical system in your home right?

And BTW auto companies hurt themselves. The unions didn't do it. There are less union workers in the auto industry and it's still having issues. But executive pay has risen ten fold. But I know its PC these days to blame unions for bad management

Right.....the fact that Auto Companies are spending more on Pensions/Health Plans than actually producing their product..........has nothing to do with their downfall.


GM sales in 2007: 9,370,000
Toyota sales in 2007: 9,366,418

GM profit/loss in 2007: -$38,730,000,000
Toyota profit in 2007: +$17,146,000,000

They both sold the same number of cars.........one made a profit......one had the UAW.
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Great. I'm happy for you, but my anecdote about the UofC was MEANT to be an exception to the rule (I'm glad we agree). Nonetheless, my actual criticism of your assumption still stands:



In other words, why would you go to a school (top 10 or not) if it doesn't have the major you want?

dozens of news programs have noted that the teaching profession is not drawing the best and the brightest of our highschool and college students.

Kihn & Miller: Why aren't America's teachers the best and brightest?

So why do top U.S. college students have so little interest in teaching careers compared with their counterparts in the world's best-performing nations

A teaching career does not offer our nation's top college graduates a compelling peer group, opportunities for continued learning or the prestige of other professions
 
Why didn't the companies invest the money if they knew they were going to agree to legacy costs? That is like working all week and at the end the boss says you cost too much. They knew the costs going in and agreed with them. And by that way I have had IBEW guys work for me.
What about it?

Surely you hired Union Electricians to work on or install the electrical system in your home right?



Right.....the fact that Auto Companies are spending more on Pensions/Health Plans than actually producing their product..........has nothing to do with their downfall.


GM sales in 2007: 9,370,000
Toyota sales in 2007: 9,366,418

GM profit/loss in 2007: -$38,730,000,000
Toyota profit in 2007: +$17,146,000,000

..........one made a profit......one had the UAW.
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What about it?

Surely you hired Union Electricians to work on or install the electrical system in your home right?



Right.....the fact that Auto Companies are spending more on Pensions/Health Plans than actually producing their product..........has nothing to do with their downfall.


GM sales in 2007: 9,370,000
Toyota sales in 2007: 9,366,418

GM profit/loss in 2007: -$38,730,000,000
Toyota profit in 2007: +$17,146,000,000

They both sold the same number of cars.........one made a profit......one had the UAW.
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One had exceptional American management

One had good Japanese management
 
BTW the graph doesn't give a breakdown of costs. From what I understand Toyota executives don't make what GM execs did. Especially in 2007. And the other thing is GM built ugly ass cars. That isn't the unions fault either.
What about it?

Surely you hired Union Electricians to work on or install the electrical system in your home right?



Right.....the fact that Auto Companies are spending more on Pensions/Health Plans than actually producing their product..........has nothing to do with their downfall.


GM sales in 2007: 9,370,000
Toyota sales in 2007: 9,366,418

GM profit/loss in 2007: -$38,730,000,000
Toyota profit in 2007: +$17,146,000,000

They both sold the same number of cars.........one made a profit......one had the UAW.
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Why didn't the companies invest the money if they knew they were going to agree to legacy costs? That is like working all week and at the end the boss says you cost too much. They knew the costs going in and agreed with them.

Well here is the negotiation that takes place between Unions and GM/Any business............

"Put the Money In the Bag, or Were Gonna Shut You Down"

.......what would you do if you were GM?
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And by that way I have had IBEW guys work for me.

Of course you have..........and the crowds at EVIL Walmart are all Black Republicans.........
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dozens of news programs have noted that the teaching profession is not drawing the best and the brightest of our highschool and college students.

Kihn & Miller: Why aren't America's teachers the best and brightest?

So why do top U.S. college students have so little interest in teaching careers compared with their counterparts in the world's best-performing nations

A teaching career does not offer our nation's top college graduates a compelling peer group, opportunities for continued learning or the prestige of other professions

I agree with this - most people who go to top tier schools or who are the top in non-pre-education majors don't become teachers (which is why our stories are the exception). I'm still failing to see that teachers are the "bottom of the barrel". Why aren't they just average as people in other professions with a few being extremely smart or stupid? What makes them the "bottom of the barrel"?

And what evidence is there that teachers go into the profession because they aren't the "best and brightest"? We've already established that there isn't any evidence that they go in for the summer break.
 
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I think you watch too much TV. If I were GM I would have built cars people wanted. I would have stayed out of the mortgage business and a host of other side business and concentrated on my main business. Cars. But thats just me. Ford did OK with unions and all.
Well here is the negotiation that takes place between Unions and GM/Any business............

"Put the Money In the Bag, or Were Gonna Shut You Down"

.......what would you do if you were GM?
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Of course you have..........and the crowds at EVIL Walmart are all Black Republicans.........
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BTW the graph doesn't give a breakdown of costs. From what I understand Toyota executives don't make what GM execs did. Especially in 2007. And the other thing is GM built ugly ass cars. That isn't the unions fault either.

Then perhaps you misunderstood........

Executive pay is a fraction of the costs....bloated or not.
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I agree with this - most people who go to top tier schools or who are the top in non-pre-education majors don't become teachers (which is why our stories are the exception). I'm still failing to see that teachers are the "bottom of the barrel". Why aren't they just average as people in other professions with a few being extremely smart or stupid? What makes them the "bottom of the barrel"?

And what evidence is there that teachers go into the profession because they aren't the "best and brightest"? We've already established that there isn't any evidence that they go in for the summer break.

Its a fact I have heard reported for many years-I just cannot find it right now while trying to watch Butler v. VCU and posting on a couple sports boards
 
I think you watch too much TV. If I were GM I would have built cars people wanted.

I think you need to acknowledge reality......

GM sales in 2007: 9,370,000
Toyota sales in 2007: 9,366,418

They sold over 9 million cars that people wanted........

I would have stayed out of the mortgage business and a host of other side business and concentrated on my main business. Cars.

But their Main business was UAW GOLD PLATED HEALTH CARE/DIAMON INLAYED PENSIONS INC.......

.....have you not been paying attention?

But thats just me. Ford did OK with unions and all.

Famous last words......
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try this from 2006

look at the test scores for various intended professions

http://www.collegeboard.com/prod_downloads/about/news_info/cbsenior/yr2006/national-report.pdf

other than farming, home ec and vocational programs education was pretty much the lowest

Thanks. I didn't think to look there. Students intending to major in education definitely have some of the lowest - but so do business/commerce and Health/Allied Services, two groups that would likely turn out some successful businessmen and doctors and yet ones like Language and Literature/Foreign or Classical Languages which would likely turn out teachers & professors have the highest.

Inconclusive. You could definitely argue that teachers are the bottom if you look at their scores alone - but considering that they're in the same area as pre-meds and pre-business people are and that literature/language people (who will likely be teachers at some level) are the highest, the argument doesn't stand very well.
 
Thanks. I didn't think to look there. Students intending to major in education definitely have some of the lowest - but so do business/commerce and Health/Allied Services, two groups that would likely turn out some successful businessmen and doctors and yet ones like Language and Literature/Foreign or Classical Languages which would likely turn out teachers & professors have the highest.

Inconclusive. You could definitely argue that teachers are the bottom if you look at their scores alone - but considering that they're in the same area as pre-meds and pre-business people are and that literature/language people (who will likely be teachers at some level) are the highest, the argument doesn't stand very well.
health and allied sciences-nurses-physical therapists, massage therapists, nutritionists

pre med students tend to study chemistry and biology. look at the scores for physical sciences

do you understand how difficult it is to get into a medical school these days?
 
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health and allied sciences-nurses-physical therapists, massage therapists, nutritionists

pre med students tend to study chemistry and biology. look at the scores for physical sciences

do you understand how difficult it is to get into a medical school these days?

Yeah, I have friends who are either already in medical school, friends who are in residency and younger ones who just got in to med school. It's very competitive. I knew at my school pre-meds majored in Bio or Chem, but that's just because we don't have a pre-med major like many schools do - I assumed Health included the pre-med majors. My mistake.

Nonetheless, the business majors scored low and literature/language people scored the highest. SAT scores don't seem, in general, to correspond to what most of us assume they would be, esp. considering people who major in language or literature tend to become teachers and professors since they're isn't much else for them to do.
 
Business threatens unions. Try to start one at Walmart. ha ha

My uncle was killed....shot in the head. Driving a coal truck outside of London, KY when the union went on strike. Silly him. He needed to feed his family. My next-door neighbor had to have Pinkerton Protection Services guard his home 24/7 when the Teamsters went on strike - and after union thugs threw bricks through both his picture window and the bathroom....where a light was on. Silly him. He needed to feed his family.

You mean fascist loving bussiness

Ones with jackbooted gun totin thugs ( ie police)

Those jackbooted gun totin' thugs you talk about? They're unionized.

How about the IBEW? And BTW auto companies hurt themselves. The unions didn't do it. There are less union workers in the auto industry and it's still having issues. But executive pay has risen ten fold. But I know its PC these days to blame unions for bad management

Blame 'em both. Greedy pig unions. Greedy pig management. If management didn't cave to ridiculous uniion demands in order to avoid strikes and settle contracts smooth-as-silk, we wouldn't be in the shape we're in. A freakin' mess.

BTW the graph doesn't give a breakdown of costs. From what I understand Toyota executives don't make what GM execs did. Especially in 2007. And the other thing is GM built ugly ass cars. That isn't the unions fault either.

Here. A freebie, from 2008:

This year, Wagoner will pull down a salary of $2.2 million, in addition to other CEO perks. And last year, Wagoner's total compensation was $14.4 million. That works out to $39,452.05 per day, including weekends. (Note that in 2007, GM lost a staggering $38.7 billion).....For example, the estimated pay of Toyota's CEO in 2005 was under $1 million.
Newsvine - CEO of GM makes 14 times What CEO of toyota makes.. but we are to be outrraged the employees get double what toyota employees make. -- Now don't say I never gave ya' nothin'. ;)

I think you watch too much TV. If I were GM I would have built cars people wanted. I would have stayed out of the mortgage business and a host of other side business and concentrated on my main business. Cars. But thats just me. Ford did OK with unions and all.

Ford did okay because they were ahead of the curve getting union concessions before it was bankrupt.

Thanks. I didn't think to look there. Students intending to major in education definitely have some of the lowest - but so do business/commerce and Health/Allied Services, two groups that would likely turn out some successful businessmen and doctors and yet ones like Language and Literature/Foreign or Classical Languages which would likely turn out teachers & professors have the highest.

Inconclusive. You could definitely argue that teachers are the bottom if you look at their scores alone - but considering that they're in the same area as pre-meds and pre-business people are and that literature/language people (who will likely be teachers at some level) are the highest, the argument doesn't stand very well.

Teachers don't have to be rocket scientists. They teach from books, for God's sake. What they need to be are motivators. Those rare breeds who can reach inside a student's head and make him want to learn. Where's that in the curriculum???
 
I am a labor attorney mainly. when I was at my first job the senior partner (a chain smoking guy who did 10 years in the marines including some of the most brutal fighting as an infantry captain in Korea before graduating Magna cum laude from Harvard Law) took me to a negotiation with the Union over a class-grievance.

some of the negotiation went like this

Union boss-You best be careful counselor-we know where you and the POS who pays your fees live

Sr Partner-you think that S&% scares me you little punk-you think you are the only people who have hit men on the payroll

and that was a milder part of this little meeting
 
Teachers don't have to be rocket scientists. They teach from books, for God's sake. What they need to be are motivators. Those rare breeds who can reach inside a student's head and make him want to learn. Where's that in the curriculum???

I never said they had to be "rocket scientists". I wanted proof that they were the "bottom of the barrel" - TD did provide some proof that pre-education majors weren't the best. For the rest of your comment, it has nothing to do with anything I've argued or requested.
 
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