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Thread: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-energy

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    Re: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-ener

    *wipes hands clean of this thread*

    Well, if you're going to nitpick one sentence and just say "propaganda" I can tell this will lead to a well-thought out and logical debate. Good luck Jetboogie, but something tells me there's nothing anyone could ever say to convince him otherwise.
    “The more you know, the harder it is to take decisive action. Once you become informed, you start seeing complexities and shades of gray. You realize that nothing is as clear and simple as it first appears. Ultimately, knowledge is paralyzing.” - Bill Watterson
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    Re: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-ener

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBook View Post
    *wipes hands clean of this thread*

    Well, if you're going to nitpick one sentence and just say "propaganda" I can tell this will lead to a well-thought out and logical debate. Good luck Jetboogie, but something tells me there's nothing anyone could ever say to convince him otherwise.
    I'm bored and he responds, I know there will be no victory here.

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    Re: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-ener

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    There's only so much oil in this world
    The earth up-n-stopped making oil one day? That makes as much sense that the water shortage scare back in the 90's, which caused the government to mandate smaller toilet tanks, that cause people to have to flush twice, thereby using 50% more water, every time someone took a dump.



    and only so many places in can be produced and transported around this world, with countries like China gaining more and more affluence, and the world in general, more and more oil is going to be consumed....
    That's why it doesn't make any sense to impose drilling bans.

    Demand will eventually go above production and thats where you get your energy crisis. Come now, this is grade 5 **** we're talking about. There will not be enough oil to last us forever, and when the **** hits the fan, what wil you do then? Everyone will cry to gubmit to save them, as they ALWAYS do.
    I agree with that--with reservations. The objective should be, to employ all sources of energy, simaltaneously: wind, solar, bio-fuels and yes, fossil fuels. The idea that killing the oil and gas industry and suddenly replacing it with green energy is assinine, at best; plumb ****ing stupid at the worst. When the government intentionally bans an industry, in favor of another industry, it has the stench of, "political agenda", all over it, not to mention; how much of their own money do these politicians have invested in these programs?



    Government has NOTHING to do with it. I don't care about no Global Warming Legislation.
    The government has NOTHING to do with drilling moratorium? I bet you would **** a brick, if the government came in and placed a moratorium on using food products to produce bio-fuels.



    Yes, because there's enough oil in the gulf to take you off foriegn oil tommorow...

    What kind of an argument is this?

    Enough natural gas? Yes. Some of the largest natural gas reserves in the world are in the GOM. And you know what they say..."where there's gas, there's oil".

    But, hey, keep believing that we're going to run out of oil, next week. Go buy some imaginary stocks from Al Gore and see how that goes for you.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-ener

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBook View Post
    *wipes hands clean of this thread*

    Well, if you're going to nitpick one sentence and just say "propaganda" I can tell this will lead to a well-thought out and logical debate. Good luck Jetboogie, but something tells me there's nothing anyone could ever say to convince him otherwise.
    Care to prove that the oil companies have supressed electric cars? Ever think about there that electricity is going to come from?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-ener

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Care to prove that the oil companies have supressed electric cars? Ever think about there that electricity is going to come from?
    There is a great documentary out there called "Who Killed the Electric Car". If not, I think it would be fair to at least view something like that before you dismiss it. Here is a link to a streaming version of it:

    Who Killed The Electric Car : Free Download & Streaming : Internet Archive

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    Re: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-ener

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Classic head in the sand.

    There's only so much oil in this world, and only so many places in can be produced and transported around this world, with countries like China gaining more and more affluence, and the world in general, more and more oil is going to be consumed....

    Demand will eventually go above production and thats where you get your energy crisis. Come now, this is grade 5 **** we're talking about. There will not be enough oil to last us forever, and when the **** hits the fan, what wil you do then? Everyone will cry to gubmit to save them, as they ALWAYS do.

    Government has NOTHING to do with it. I don't care about no Global Warming Legislation.



    Yes, because there's enough oil in the gulf to take you off foriegn oil tommorow...

    What kind of an argument is this?
    I told you we'd need more coffee.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-ener

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    There is a great documentary out there called "Who Killed the Electric Car". If not, I think it would be fair to at least view something like that before you dismiss it. Here is a link to a streaming version of it:

    Who Killed The Electric Car : Free Download & Streaming : Internet Archive
    Is this the best evidence you have?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-ener

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    So no need to ever try anything new. Sometimes you gotta spend money to make money and it doesn't always work.
    Well considering Democrats are 0-845....in terms of spending money to make money......

    Sometimes you gotta elect the most inexperienced president in history.....who couldnt run a lemonade stand much less a candy store.....

    But hey its ok, lets cut taxes, have "smaller Government" whatever the **** that means, stop gays from getting married, drill in Alaska and the gulf of Mexico, keep importing our oil from the Middle East, shop at mall of America, eat 40 big macs a week and wonder why nothings been done when we keep voting the same dumbasses into power over, and over, and over again.

    /facepalm
    ....hows that change you voted for working out?
    .
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    .

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    Re: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-ener

    Must we wonder why our Government is 14 trillion dollars in debt? Look at all the sound investments made in the name of progress over the past few decades. Insanity is preforming the same actions over and over EXPECTING DIFFERENT RESULTS with each attempt. The progressives have wasted 15.9 trillion on welfare over the past few decades with the net result being regulating more and more middle class citizens unto the rolls of welfare resulting in a WELFARE STATE as the poverty index has now grown past 15%, the highest in history since such stats began in the 60s. Its official, 1 in 7 Americans are now living in poverty. Now we have a budget in place that demands the expenditure of some 10.3 Trillion dollars more on WELFARE alone over the next decade?

    Why not follow the plan from the 90s when Welfare was reformed with a Contract with America and the poverty index went down for the first time in decades? Imagine that, putting people to work reduces poverty. No, all those reforms have been removed by this Administration and we have lost more middle class citizens to Welfare....kind'a makes you wonder what the real plan is...no? Why demand to have MORE MONEY (10.3 Trillion) over the next decade if the plan is to support the middle class? Looks like less money would be planned on being spent on welfare in stead of adding more to the budget. Imagine the Jobs that could be created with 10.3 Trillion...even if they were all Infrastructure Jobs.

    The same principle applies to the energy sector, they are throwing the baby out with the bath water and are attempting to blame the opposition for their failed plans. Liberalism has had a blank check over the past 2 years.....ARE WE BETTER OFF than we were 2 years ago? The ideology has been an abstract failure. Thus the grinding and gnashing of teeth....that's all we heard over the last decade, IF WE JUST HAD A CHANCE. Well?

    Obama to Spend $10.3 Trillion on Welfare: Uncovering the Full Cost of Means-Tested Welfare or Aid to the Poor | The Heritage Foundation

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    Re: Confirmed: Obama administration sunk $535 million in Porkulus funds in green-ener

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    The reason alternative energies have trouble getting off the ground is because they are trying to enter a market that has many barriers to entry (that's an economics term if you'd like to look it up). Energy markets require massive amounts of capital to enter into and it is also hard to raise demand and may be one of the hardest markets to enter. Unfortunately, we have the ability to get a ton of energy for cheap enough that we don't want to convert. However, as we all know, that will be changing in the near future.

    So, we can do two things. We can try to adapt, beat the curve, and start changing our energy infrastructure over before it is required. Or, we can wait, and then try to do it all at once. Either way, it is going to be painful. However, I think what you have shown is that if we want to make a difference, we actually need to invest more. Otherwise, it would be better not to invest at all.

    Economies of scale plays a large part in this issue since without having massive funding and the ability to mass produce, the product becomes too expensive and too scarce for the public to invest in.

    Indeed, this was highlighted at the World Future Energy Summit 2011:

    'In an address during the Opening Ceremony of WFES 2011, HE Ban Ki Moon, UN Secretary General, said, “Abu Dhabi is becoming justifiably renowned as a hub of progress. You have brought remarkable wealth from the desert sands, and used it to create a vibrant modern nation. And your Masdar Initiative speaks of something more - a vision to build on and go beyond the age of fossil fuels to a new sustainable future. The decisions we make today on energy will have far-reaching consequences.”

    On the second day of the summit, Truman Semans, Principal, Green Order, USA; Former Executive Committee Member, US Climate Action Partnership, USA, addressed Business Forum delegates saying, “The new model we need for engagement between government, business, and civil society requires changing the way we behave. Engagement to achieve a clean energy revolution requires a Culture of Innovation that fosters Trust, a spirit of Collaboration, and strong Leadership. We are entering an age of radical transparency. I urge you as leaders in this sector to ask the uncomfortable questions.... Is it just about technology, or is it also about new models of engagement to tackle the challenges of forging a sustainable energy future?”

    Speaking during the Finance & Investment Forum on the final day of WFES, Lord Nicholas Stern, Chair of the Grantham Research Institute on Climate Change and the Environment, London School of Economics, UK, and author of the acclaimed 2006 Stern Review Report on the Economics of Climate Change, suggested the scale of the opportunity for renewable energy is high. He said, “In order that climate change targets can be achieved, we face the need for a new industrial revolution. That industrial revolution needs policy change as a driver to reach the scale of change required. With fundamentally strong policy, we can also increase the pace of that change.”
    News Body | World Future Energy Summit 2011
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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