Page 18 of 25 FirstFirst ... 81617181920 ... LastLast
Results 171 to 180 of 241

Thread: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

  1. #171
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    your opinion means nothing and is not better by citing facts that do not establish one philosophy is better than another
    That's why I cited facts to back up my opinion. Something you have not done.

    NONE of you have ever demonstrated that your desire to make the rich pay more while giving most of the voters absolutely NO INCENTIVE to curb the growth of government will help what I see as the main problem-too much government spending too much money
    What you suggest by cutting revenue without cutting spending is a recipe for increasing the debt. A lesson we learned the hard way by the Reagan/Bush tax cuts. Spending needs to be cut first and then determine the amount of revenue necessary for paying the bills.

    your worry is the rich getting richer yet your tax schemes addict too many people to government and sap individual initiative

    the only facts you cite are a gap between the rich and the poor-you have never established that cutting taxes on the rich increases this and right now the tax structure is MORE PROGRESSIVE than it was 50 years ago
    You have't been paying attention than:



    so tell me-how is your opinion (which holds that the gap is the biggest problem) is more correct based on the facts you have cited than those of us who see the ever expanding government and the ever growing number of those who are dependent on government programs as the main problem
    One is an opinion based on facts and the other is an opinion not based on facts.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  2. #172
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by ptif219 View Post
    $38,000 a year and only work 9 months. Thats more than I make and I am only home 1 week a month
    So naturally you defend tax cuts for those that make 800,000 times what you do, at your expense. Sure, that makes perfect sense Ptif.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  3. #173
    Sage
    Mach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:54 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Liberal
    Posts
    11,427

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Poppycock! In order to maintain a budget, you must have enough income to pay your debts.
    #1 They NEVER maintain their budget!
    #2 Many citizens do NOT want them to maintain their budget, they want to CUT SPENDING.
    #3 You are forcing a minority to pay for this, its bad to begin with. Get that power out of government hands.

    Very few of us get through life without incurring debts.
    Until we grow up, sure. When is government going to grow up? It's regressing.

    Our two unfunded wars (over $3 trillion) and the unfunded tax cuts for the rich (almost i trillion over just two years) while we simultaneously cut our income by cutting taxes for the super wealthy are glaring examples of this new paradigm.
    Shouldn't be a problem in the first place. Cut entitlements and a broad swath of government services, phase them out to the market, and reduce taxes at the same time. No reason it can't logistically be done. Politically it's hard to do sensible things though...no doubt. That's why you should use government as a last resort, not as the primary means to enact an unrealistic fantasy of enabling people to get something for nothing.

    Seriously, why is government seen as they instrument of social change? They are already free to work on social change, to build whatever non-profit empires they want to facilitate it, to raise funds like many good institutions do, to lobby, to generate public awareness, open a volunteer soup kitchen, etc., etc. Why do they have to corrupt government and then turn around and FORCE people to pay for their idealistic nonsense? Why?

    I mean, did Bill Gates think "I want to see a PC in every home, so I should work through GOVERNMENT to force a PC into every home, and force the rich to pay for it"? No, he did it voluntarily, and made thousands of millionaires, created countless jobs, etc., etc. Why is freedom just not sufficient for some people? And low and behold some people hate the PC, so they by a ****ing MAC instead. Because they are free to choose.
    Last edited by Mach; 02-18-11 at 03:27 PM.

  4. #174
    warrior of the wetlands
    TurtleDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    180,545

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    That's why I cited facts to back up my opinion. Something you have not done.



    What you suggest by cutting revenue without cutting spending is a recipe for increasing the debt. A lesson we learned the hard way by the Reagan/Bush tax cuts. Spending needs to be cut first and then determine the amount of revenue necessary for paying the bills.

    your worry is the rich getting richer yet your tax schemes addict too many people to government and sap individual initiative



    You have't been paying attention than:





    One is an opinion based on facts and the other is an opinion not based on facts.

    your opinion is one that I don't care about--you whine bout the rich getting richer and i say SO WhaT

    you have not given any rational solution to what you whine about

    nor have you made a sound argument against my solution for the problem I am most concerned about--too many people wanting too much government that they demand the "rich" to pay for



  5. #175
    Sage
    Mach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:54 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Liberal
    Posts
    11,427

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    So naturally you defend tax cuts for those that make 800,000 times what you do, at your expense. Sure, that makes perfect sense Ptif.
    For someone that supports individual liberty over using government to force peopel to pay for things...yeah, they may support that even though they don't benefit. Oh my god, peopel with a concscionce should be condemned? You mean you think people should only support legislation if it pumps money from someone else and gives it to them? That's sick Catawba. Justice is supposed to be blind, ethics are supposed to apply to everyone.

  6. #176
    warrior of the wetlands
    TurtleDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    180,545

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    top marginal rates are worthless as well

    the top 5-2-1% pay more of the tax burden NOW than any time in history

    and marginal rates are not accurate reflections of EFFECTIVE rates

    so WTF did your "facts" prove?

    the top 5% pay more FIT than the bottom 95%

    and of course ALL of the federal death tax

    The Tax Foundation - Summary of Latest Federal Individual Income Tax Data



  7. #177
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    #1 They NEVER maintain their budget!
    #2 Many citizens do NOT want them to maintain their budget, they want to CUT SPENDING.
    #3 You are forcing a minority to pay for this, its bad to begin with. Get that power out of government hands.
    We had no serious debt problem until Reagan and Bush slashed the top tax rates.
    I agree with cutting spending. There is much spending of which I am not in favor. However, we need to cut spending first and then set tax rates to cover our bills. To do it in reverse order, will just add to the debt as did under Reagan and Bush.


    Shouldn't be a problem in the first place. Cut entitlements and a broad swath of government services, phase them out to the market, and reduce taxes at the same time. No reason it can't logistically be done. Politically it's hard to do sensible things though...no doubt. That's why you should use government as a last resort, not as the primary means to enact an unrealistic fantasy of enabling people to get something for nothing.
    That is one of the core differences between liberals and conservatives. We believe the health and welfare of our own people comes before unfunded and unnecessary wars, and tax cuts for the rich. We have no crisis in SS and Medicaid, all that is required is to once again make the richest pay their fair share. Simply cut any waste and fraud in the systems, raise the $106,000 cap for rich, and put the SS and Medicaid funds in a locked account that cannot be used to offset other government expenditures. Crisis solved

    Seriously, why is government seen as they instrument of social change?
    Because of the Constitutional mandate to protect the health and welfare of the people.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  8. #178
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you whine bout the rich getting richer and i say SO WhaT
    And the class war continues.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  9. #179
    warrior of the wetlands
    TurtleDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    180,545

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    We had no serious debt problem until Reagan and Bush slashed the top tax rates.
    I agree with cutting spending. There is much spending of which I am not in favor. However, we need to cut spending first and then set tax rates to cover our bills. To do it in reverse order, will just add to the debt as did under Reagan and Bush.



    That is one of the core differences between liberals and conservatives. We believe the health and welfare of our own people comes before unfunded and unnecessary wars, and tax cuts for the rich. We have no crisis in SS and Medicaid, all that is required is to once again make the richest pay their fair share. Simply cut any waste and fraud in the systems, raise the $106,000 cap for rich, and put the SS and Medicaid funds in a locked account that cannot be used to offset other government expenditures. Crisis solved



    Because of the Constitutional mandate to protect the health and welfare of the people.
    there is no such proper mandate

    "the general welfare" is not delegation of the power you claim



  10. #180
    warrior of the wetlands
    TurtleDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    180,545

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    And the class war continues.
    the rich always get richer unless the entire system collapses

    if you make more than you spend you can invest the remainder



Page 18 of 25 FirstFirst ... 81617181920 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •