Page 10 of 25 FirstFirst ... 8910111220 ... LastLast
Results 91 to 100 of 241

Thread: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

  1. #91
    Pragmatic Idealist
    upsideguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Rocky Mtn. High
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:27 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,104

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    I would have been fine if congress had allowed all of the Bush tax cuts to expire and also not lower the social security contribution by 2%. Not sure where you get this fantasy $500 billion by fixing the economy.

    You really have to be rocky mountain high to think that running a budget deficit is only a charade and not a problem.

    As to what economists say about balancing the budget all depends on many assumptions. To say we are not spending more than we can afford should be obvious.
    1) the charade is not the deficit, that is very real. Nor is the charade the problems that come with a deficit, that is very real. The charade is action. It is the contrived outrage, mostly by Conservs about the deficit being a problem that they intend to fix. If they really wanted to fix the budget, the raising taxes, if not implemented, would have received at least very serious discussion. They were summarily dismissed. Why? Because the true agenda of the Conservs is to use the deficit to stir up the masses to cut spending on social programs. They are not interested in cuts to their favorite items, such as the military or homeland security, nor will they even talk about tax increases. Its not about the deficit, its about social programs.

    2) A recession is a slow down in the economy, which lowers the base upon which taxes are collected. In 2008, the government collected $2.5T in receipts. In 2009, that number was lowered to $2.1T. The 2007 expectation for 2009 was $2.7T. In essence, the recession alone, without any change to the tax structure, lowered receipts by $400 to $600B. Restrating the economy will alone fix that. The recession also caused in increase in annual unemployment benefits paid from $50B to $150B, a difference of $100B. Again, fix the economy and these two things work automatically to close some of the deficit ($500B). That is why you spend a little bit of money to re-start the engine, as the best way to fix your revenue problem is to increase your revenue base (this can be done with expenditures, tax cuts or a mix... aka a Stimulus)
    Last edited by upsideguy; 02-17-11 at 08:07 PM.

  2. #92
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    OK so what if they know it. Now what, what changes? What would any changes to tax laws do to lower the wealth of gates or buffet. Their wealth is mostly stock. Same for the guy who created facebook.
    Since most of America remains ignorant of the situation, my guess is nothing much will change until the pain is great enough for the middle class to use their collective voting powers to restore our progresssive tax system.

    A progressive tax system does not seek to eliminate wealth, nor did it during its half century history during one of the most prosperous times in America for the most people..

    When you complain about tax rates don't forget to include Obama who signed the extension of the bush rates.
    He didn't have much choice now did he? The GOP had made it clear they were willing to sacrifice the tax cuts for the middle class in their fight for tax cuts for the rich. Obama was not willing to make that sacrifice. I am glad to see his new budget addresses that.
    Last edited by Catawba; 02-17-11 at 09:32 PM.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  3. #93
    warrior of the wetlands
    TurtleDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:23 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    180,658

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    The should be resurrected. You cannot tackle the bidget deficit without address Medicare, SS, and the military in terms of cuts, and looking at tax increases. To believe otherwise is to be disconnected from reality.
    jacking up taxes on the minority that pays most of the taxes makes political sense in the short run but will only cause more bloated government and more spending when those who want the goodies don't have to pay for them



  4. #94
    Sage
    whysoserious's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Last Seen
    12-29-16 @ 03:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    8,170

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    jacking up taxes on the minority that pays most of the taxes makes political sense in the short run but will only cause more bloated government and more spending when those who want the goodies don't have to pay for them
    By jacking them up you mean returning them to the level they were at a few years ago that was already well lower than they had been in years before that? I already showed that the top money earners in this country only pay a marginal 17%.

    Asking for more than 17% is going to far?

  5. #95
    warrior of the wetlands
    TurtleDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:23 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    180,658

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Might not be my choice, as I woudl support just letting the Bush tax cuts expire. But, the concept that there needs to be an increase in taxes is sound. It is just a matter of which ones.
    if we need to raise taxes we need to raise the taxes that will be most likely to CURB more government spending

    and that is not more taxes on the 5% that already pay more income and estate taxes than the rest of the nation



  6. #96
    warrior of the wetlands
    TurtleDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:23 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    180,658

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    You know what I think is incompetent? Continuing to give tax breaks to the rich while claiming that you want to balance the budget. Republicans have admitted they do not have a plan to balance the budget yet (Paul Ryan has admitted this), and yet they will not raise taxes. They don't want to cut Defense spending. Cutting medicare/medicaid has proven to be very difficult, especially since it was already trimmed and overhauled during the new Health Care bill that just passed. That leaves non defense discretionary spending - a category that gets picked on every time the budget comes up. Because of this, non defense discretionary spending already runs fairly efficiently and smoothly. There is not much to cut.

    So how do you balance a budget when you can't cut anything and you can't raise taxes? That's incompetent.
    raising taxes on the rich won't eliminate the cause of the massive deficit. the cause of that is politicians pandering to the majority of voters by giving them what they want without (costing themselves votes) by telling those who want the goodies have to pay for it with tax increases
    you tax hikers never want to deal with the long term issues You want to jack up taxes on the rich which only encourages more and more pandering and spending.



  7. #97
    warrior of the wetlands
    TurtleDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:23 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    180,658

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Poppycock! In order to maintain a budget, you must have enough income to pay your debts. Very few of us get through life without incurring debts. The key is having enough income to pay your bills. If your debt exceeds your income then you have a problem. You can balance your budget in two ways. Increasing income and cutting spending. Beginning with Reagan, the new paradigm in Washington has been to both increase spending and decrease income, by slashing taxes for the top income earners. Our two unfunded wars (over $3 trillion) and the unfunded tax cuts for the rich (almost i trillion over just two years) while we simultaneously cut our income by cutting taxes for the super wealthy are glaring examples of this new paradigm.
    how is someone making 300-500K a year "super wealthy"

    yet these are the people who are targeted to suffer the brunt of the dem tax hikes



  8. #98
    warrior of the wetlands
    TurtleDude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:23 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    180,658

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    By jacking them up you mean returning them to the level they were at a few years ago that was already well lower than they had been in years before that? I already showed that the top money earners in this country only pay a marginal 17%.

    Asking for more than 17% is going to far?
    that was a jacking up

    for more than half of this country's history there was not any income tax-the massive top marginal rates (which created an effective tax rate not really higher than it was under Clinton) were two huge world wars less than a generation apart.

    most of those targeted for the clinton obama tax hikes are paying more than 17% marginal rate

    but everyone ought to pay the same rate mainly so we don't have the problems that come from majority not having to pay for the stuff they want-which is why we have such massive spending



  9. #99
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    jacking up taxes on the minority that pays most of the taxes makes political sense in the short run but will only cause more bloated government and more spending when those who want the goodies don't have to pay for them
    It would not be jacking up taxes on the top income earners, it would be eliminating the tax cuts the wealthiest enjoyed for years. And your claim doesn't hold up to the light of our own history. Our major debt didn't occur until after we cut US revenue by slashing the top tax rates. While no one is arguing that wasteful govenment spending doesn't need to be eliminated, if we are serious about addressing our huge National debt, we will have to address both spending and revenue.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  10. #100
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    melbourne florida
    Last Seen
    09-24-15 @ 12:15 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    13,156

    Re: Obama budget resurrects rejected tax increases

    We need to scrap the failed tax system and get a new tax system. Income tax does not work and is not fair

Page 10 of 25 FirstFirst ... 8910111220 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •