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Armed bystander almost shot hero that disarmed AZ shooter

and not having a firearm can lead to massive deaths

such as Fort Hood among others

Fort Hood probably has more small arms and weapons per person than anywhere else in the US except for other military installations.
 
Technically - he wasn't AT the shooting - at the time of the shooting he was checking out and paying for his items.
He showed up AFTER it was over with and already under control...he just didn't realize it.
 
Both tragic situations could have been diverted or avoided completely if they pursued MENTAL HEALTH intervention.
Arizona - in fact - has more legal means than Texas to intervene in this area.

What makes a person like this tick and break?
What are the warning signs?

A mentally imbalanced person is a mentally imbalanced person - whether he as a gun or a toothpick - sooner of later he'll use it (usually on himself) but sometimes on others.

The only true prevention is knowledge - and a damned crystal ball.

you know if some whack job starts busting caps at me or mine I am gonna kill him as fast as I can and maybe a week later start worrying about what caused him to go bezerk, not when he's gunning down people.

I am not a health care professional but I am a highly trained pistol shot
 
Fort Hood probably has more small arms and weapons per person than anywhere else in the US except for other military installations.

I guess you didn't know that the soldiers shot down were disarmed

fail
 
you know if some whack job starts busting caps at me or mine I am gonna kill him as fast as I can and maybe a week later start worrying about what caused him to go bezerk, not when he's gunning down people.

I am not a health care professional but I am a highly trained pistol shot

I think he's talking about before the individual is actively killing people. But you're gung-ho ness is noted
 
He had the wrong weapon. He should have had a knife handy. A knife doesn't riochet.

I think some of the Barney Fifes here would have gotten so excited they would have been shooting like a sprinkler. This kid knew he didn't need to shoot at someone already on the ground with several wrestling with him. It was pretty obvious.


There are others here that would have coward in fear, hoping that the killing stopped before it was their turn to die, not lifting a ****ing finger to save themselves, much less their fellow human beings.
 
And being there a minute earlier he could have used that fire arm to shoot the nutjob and it might have only been a couple of people shot. It seems the OP as well as the OP's link are trying to use a story of a gun owner exercising control to fuel some anti-2nd amendment agenda.
Not at all, however I do believe arming everyone is complete nuts. I am not anti 2nd Amendment, I believe you have the right to protect yourself. But a 33 round Glock is insane.
 
Fort Hood probably has more small arms and weapons per person than anywhere else in the US except for other military installations.

Actually - only MP's and maybe a few others are permitted to carry while in uniform / on duty.
Said individuals cannot be armed by law within the US unless under actual orders to do so - and some branches of the military cannot function armed at all while on US soil.
In the meatime - weapons are safed and stocked in an armory or other such facility.

These tragedies happen, let's face it, because these people used a rapid-fire weapon . . . in which a large amount can be expelled in a short time - before anyone else possibly present with a firearm can respond in kind.
 
I think he's talking about before the individual is actively killing people. But you're gung-ho ness is noted

its called reality
 
Not at all, however I do believe arming everyone is complete nuts. I am not anti 2nd Amendment, I believe you have the right to protect yourself. But a 33 round Glock is insane.

so where do you draw the line
 
Fort Hood probably has more small arms and weapons per person than anywhere else in the US except for other military installations.

How many hours would it take to issue weapons and ammunition to one platoon of soldiers on an Army post?
 
you know if some whack job starts busting caps at me or mine I am gonna kill him as fast as I can and maybe a week later start worrying about what caused him to go bezerk, not when he's gunning down people.

I am not a health care professional but I am a highly trained pistol shot

Wouldn't it be better if you didn't have to at all?
 
Actually - only MP's and maybe a few others are permitted to carry while in uniform / on duty.
Said individuals cannot be armed by law within the US unless under actual orders to do so - and some branches of the military cannot function armed at all while on US soil.
In the meatime - weapons are safed and stocked in an armory or other such facility.

These tragedies happen, let's face it, because these people used a rapid-fire weapon . . . in which a large amount can be expelled in a short time - before anyone else possibly present with a firearm can respond in kind.

O of course they're locked up and not in many cases readily available, especially with ammo at the same place. I was just trying to show there's more to these things than amount of weapons.

Ok that was probably a stupid thing to say I assumed turtle was thinking just about amount of weapons being the only factor, I said that to "throw a wrench" into his thought process.
 
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Just wondering is there still any confusion on what I was saying on page one about the dangers of not rightly identifying your target before you fire? And how what I'm saying is part of being an educated and responsible gun owner and nothing political?
 
Wouldn't it be better if you didn't have to at all?

yeah that' like saying it would be nice if one didn't have to wear a condom either or buy auto insurance

utopian nonsense
 
yeah that' like saying it would be nice if one didn't have to wear a condom either or buy auto insurance

utopian nonsense

No one is suggesting its possible to make the world entirely safe, but I don't think its "utopian nonsense" to suggest there could be ways decrease the need and number occurances where individuals have to defend themselves with personal weapons, without decreasing the rights of individuals to own personal weapons. Specifically in this case, was there something leading up to this where this guy could have been found out as the mental case he was and thus eliminate that future threat, in this case occurance, of a shooting.
 
No one is suggesting its possible to make the world entirely safe, but I don't think its "utopian nonsense" to suggest there could be ways decrease the need and number occurances where individuals have to defend themselves with personal weapons, without decreasing the rights of individuals to own personal weapons. Specifically in this case, was there something leading up to this where this guy could have been found out as the mental case he was and thus eliminate that future threat, in this case occurance, of a shooting.
you deal with that

I will deal with threats in the manner I have been trained
 
yeah that' like saying it would be nice if one didn't have to wear a condom either or buy auto insurance

utopian nonsense


Tell that to the dead 6 people - would it have been nonsense to them if this insane ****er was where he belonged? IN A facility? Point blank - he shouldn't have been out and about. It's obvious from the years of **** stacked up in his corner. He should have been seen as a threat and put away (yes?)

It's not nonsense if it might solve a problem or save a life.

Wouldn't they prefer to be alive right now?

Isn't it better to be a living optimist than a dead pessimist.

Obviously I don't oppose PROTECTING yourself or being adequately armed or trained to handle said situations - I think it's very important, in fact. But at the same time so is PREVENTION and INTERVENTION altogether.
 
Tell that to the dead 6 people - would it have been nonsense to them if this insane ****er was where he belonged? IN A facility?

It's not nonsense if it might solve a problem or save a life.

Wouldn't they prefer to be alive right now?

Isn't it better to be a living optimist than a dead pessimist.

Obviously I don't oppose PROTECTING yourself or being adequately armed or trained to handle said situations - I think it's very important, in fact. But at the same time so is PREVENTION and INTERVENTION altogether.

People being armed and trained is possible

reforming mental health care-good luck with that

privacy concerns will always be a major obstacle
 
you can demand better healthcare for nuts

good luck with trusting your safety to that

Well - what would happen if you weren't *there.*
Where was Christina's father? Surely he wasn't with his daughter ready to protect her.

The nutjobs don't belong out there buying guns and leveling crowds of people.

Surely you agree - you're just defensive because you think we're telling you that being able to protect yourself is bad, when it's not.

But I'd much rather you *be quite capable of* protecting yourself but never *have to do it*

If the ****wad sherrif and his stupid ****ing parents did THEIR jobs then 6 people would be alive right now.
 
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People being armed and trained is possible

reforming mental health care-good luck with that

privacy concerns will always be a major obstacle

You're opposed to it - so you're part of *that particular* problem.
 
you can demand better healthcare for nuts

good luck with trusting your safety to that

Why do you always have to see things in such absolutes? If I think prevention can be done, it must mean I think its the only thing that should be done, I'm putting all my eggs in that basket, and I'm walking around unarmed in a bunny down a dark alley, is that right? No we can do both, arm and educate ourselves, and using other means to help reduce the amount of times we have to use our arms personally.

I'm not trusting my safety to that, but I do believe it it'll help my safety, which is why I still own a weapon myself mr. 'highly trained pistol expert.'
 
How many masss shooting occur in gun free zones? I think you're forgetting the deterence factor. Do these nutjobs walk into a biker bar and shoot the place up? What about a police station? Or, anywhere else where the victims are likely to be armed and ready to shoot back?

Gun free zone? Arizona is one of the most, if not the most armed state in the union. You don't even need a permit to carry concealed in Arizona.

As to deterrence, does anybody think Jared Lee Loughton was deterrable?
 
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