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Thread: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

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    Re: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    there's no evidence that missile defense systems don't work...LOL
    How about the 70% failure rate? How about the fact the only time we actually get an interceptor hit is when we have planned the test, we have the trajectory already programmed into the interceptor, we do not use decoys or interference and we do not test more then 1 incoming missile at any time? Note, none of that portrays a real attack in any way.

    Furthermore, it makes no sense to actually attack America with a missile.

    Missile defense only works against a country stupid enough to launch a few missiles with no decoys, no interference spending huge amounts on reliability and accuracy when they could get the same effect for 1/1000th of the price by just smuggling nukes in via cargo ships. And reduce the likelihood of a counter strike.

    Missile defense is socialist industrial policy merely existing to employ people for the sake of employment.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The Russians say that it does. I guess they got it wrong, too?
    The Russians also get their news from Pravada. You are not making a convincing argument.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

    The Russians have developed a mineshaft gap!
    Don't work out, work in.

    Never eat anything that's served in a bucket.

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    Re: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Crow View Post
    The man is a real irresponsible idiot but some people here say he is brilliant. This is another proof that I was right. This idiot wants us all killed.
    Okay, tell me how agreeing not to use launch facilities for missile defense we never planned on using in the first place makes us more insecure.

    Okay, tell me how not having inspectors in Russia doing inventory and interviewing scientists makes us more insecure.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

    Hey Albert Di Salvo,

    If Iran is so crazy, why haven't they used their huge stockpile of chemical weapons against Israel? Especially since they've had it for decades. They could wipe out Israel with that. Why haven't they done it?

    Iran's leadership is just as sane as other country's. They have no intention of dying or losing power. And everything they do shows that. Did they themselves risk their own lives in Iraq? No. Did they risk open conformation with Israel? No. they fund and train Hamas and Hezbollah. They never risk their own necks.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Crow View Post
    The man is a real irresponsible idiot but some people here say he is brilliant. This is another proof that I was right. This idiot wants us all killed.
    No. Not all of us. I've heard he's singled you out. Just you. He must have heard you'd like him assassinated. He's implementing the Bush doctrine on ya, you betcha.
    I've always felt that a person's intelligence is directly reflected by the number of conflicting points of view he can entertain simultaneously on the same topic. - Abigail Adams

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    Re: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Because he's being dishonest.

    The US is barred from using existing silos and launch pads formerly used in ICBM systems for missile defense.

    That would appear to be a problem for the ignorant but not for the educated. Especially considering the US was never planning on using those sites in the first place for missile defense. A sizable portion of the US missile defense is based off ships. Furthermore, it would be cheaper just to build specific launch sites for interceptors rather then completely renovate old systems and silos.

    Basically, you're bitching about a cost savings measure.
    Navy vet here. I was looking for this sanity. Thanks. I don't think these folks quite understand what our arsenal is, and where it is. Delivery systems are Ballistic Missile submarines and B-2 bombers. Our ICBM's are in places like Diego Garcia. Staging for Air Force nuclear ops is Alabama. Nukes themselves are in places like North Dakota. We also have drones now as well as cruise missiles which can be delivered in a myriad of ways.

    If I remember right, the silos are gone.
    I've always felt that a person's intelligence is directly reflected by the number of conflicting points of view he can entertain simultaneously on the same topic. - Abigail Adams

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    Re: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

    Quote Originally Posted by Kev316 View Post
    Navy vet here. I was looking for this sanity. Thanks. I don't think these folks quite understand what our arsenal is, and where it is.
    Indeed. Detractors appear to fall into two categories.

    1) The Dishonest. Generally those have a real vested stake in the current system or see the ability to milk the program for money. Or who simply do not want Obama to get any credit for anything good.

    2) The Ignorant. Those who can't figure out the difference between a production/maintence facility and a launch platform. Those who don't understand the demographics and geography of Russia. Those haven't the faintest clue about MAD and nukes in general. And those who don't understand the US delivery system. Pretty much every detractor here falls into this one. The GOP senators who held up the bill are dishonest.

    Delivery systems are Ballistic Missile submarines and B-2 bombers.
    And a few silos. But as I understand it, the US has seriously atrophied that arm. And it makes sense to. Silos are known. And there's nothing we can do to protect a silo against a huge nuke. Planes and subs are much harder to track and wipe out in a first strike. And then there's the rumor the US (and the USSR) put up nukes in space. A simple command to change orbit would bring down death from above. And it's not easy to figure out which satellite may be harboring a MRV.

    Our ICBM's are in places like Diego Garcia. Staging for Air Force nuclear ops is Alabama. Nukes themselves are in places like North Dakota. We also have drones now as well as cruise missiles which can be delivered in a myriad of ways.

    If I remember right, the silos are gone.
    All of them? I thought we had a few running.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Who cares?
    It can work well all it wants to - shooting down a missle in every test. But if we're under an attack just HOW effective is such a system going to be?

    If The Russians are lobbing missiles at us the last thing I'm going to be thinking is "good thing we've got that anti-missile defense silos in place!"

    It's a false comfort - and an unnecessary expense.
    Unfortunately, the only way to find that out, is to employ the system in an actual attack.

    One thing's for certain, it definitely won't work if it isn't employed. That constitutes a guaranteed 100% failure rate. I'll take a 70% failure rate over that, any day.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Vice Admiral: Obama was outmaneuvered by Russians on START

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    All of them? I thought we had a few running.
    Great post. You may be right about a few silos left. I'm not sure. All I know is you can't track a nuclear sub and a B-2 looks like a bird on radar. Besides, everyone knows one certain truth, imo: Should a nation launch first, it will be the last thing they ever do. Period.
    Last edited by Kev316; 12-25-10 at 12:02 AM.
    I've always felt that a person's intelligence is directly reflected by the number of conflicting points of view he can entertain simultaneously on the same topic. - Abigail Adams

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