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Thread: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

  1. #21
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    Re: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

    If the tea party is really the Tea Party then tell me where they were on the ballot. Every other Party was.

    How can you be a political party in the USA when you
    1- do not compete on the ballot
    2- do not have candidates running under the label of your party
    3- have no regular organization to promote your candidates
    You can call something anything you want to call it but that does not make it so.

    A Boston cream pie is still a cake and not a pie. Any baker can tell you that.
    You can call it a Tea Party if it pleases you but it is clearly not one.


    Look, I get it.... I get that the name is what is it and people use it knowing what it is. Its just not a proper usage of the term and belies what it is. Its a pet peeve of mine. there is no freakin' Tea Party. Maybe I feel so strongly about this because I dearly wish there were a functioning and real Tea Party instead of a faux polulist movement on the rightwing of the actual Republican Party
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    Re: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

    Alright, maybe I need to make it more blatant for you that you need to actually address what people are saying, not what you're imagination is telling you erroniously is fact.

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    If the tea party is really the Tea Party then tell me where they were on the ballot. Every other Party was.


    How can you be a political party in the USA when you
    1- do not compete on the ballot
    2- do not have candidates running under the label of your party
    3- have no regular organization to promote your candidates
    You can call something anything you want to call it but that does not make it so.


    A Boston cream pie is still a cake and not a pie. Any baker can tell you that.
    You can call it a Tea Party if it pleases you but it is clearly not one.


    If you have no got the message yet...you are strawmaning. Its a personal pet peeve of yours. Wonderful, great, deal with it. Until you can show some kind of definition or rule that clearly states that the use of the world "Party" as a capitalization in ALL cases refers to a nationally identified political party your pet peeve is nothing but your own inability to deal with your opinion not being fact.

    It became known as the "Tea Party" movement as a throwback reference to the Boston Tea Party (note, the Boston Tea Party was not a political party either). It is capitalized as it is a formal, organize...albiet loosely...group and as such gets formal recognition. However, there is few...if any...that are part of said group that actually suggest that its the "Tea Party" Party, as in a political party.

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    Re: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

    And if I tell you that I have heard what you are saying, dismiss what you are saying and don't give a flying crap about what you are saying - do you get that?

    I can just as easy turn it around on you and scream at you with cute little posters that mean nothing demanding that you come on my turf and deal with what I am saying.

    get over yourself.
    Last edited by haymarket; 11-29-10 at 02:49 PM.
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    Re: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Where is healthcare related language in the Constitution?
    The basis of regulation of healthcare is in terms of interstate commerce. Duh. Most of the things we make rules about are not explicitly mentioned in the constitution. All rules about airplanes, or trains, or cars, or radio, or television, or a thousand other little bits of our daily lives are not mentioned in the constitution. A comprehensive healthcare reform (which the new law really isn't, it's a tiny one) certainly falls within the bounds of interstate commerce. Actually, pretty much all commerce is interstate these days...

    But I counter with this question. Why is it terrible to reform healthcare, but totally cool to routinely ignore the 4th amendment and engage in searches without warrants or probable cause in pursuit of terrorists or drugs?

    On the topic of parties, however. You can be of any size and be a party so long as you call yourself one.
    Liberté. Égalité. Fraternité.

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    Re: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    What's Obama done that's unconstitutional?
    oh gosh. where to begin.....

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    Re: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

    from Zyphlin

    It became known as the "Tea Party" movement as a throwback reference to the Boston Tea Party (note, the Boston Tea Party was not a political party either)
    this is what you are hanging your hat upon?!?!

    The Boston Tea Party was not a reference to a political party OR a political movement but the word PARTY was a descriptive term of the activity taking place as an event.

    So is the Tea Party a political party like its name implies or the event like in the Boston Tea Party?
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    Re: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    And if I tell you that I have heard what you are saying, dismiss what you are saying and don't give a flying crap about what you are saying - do you get that?
    Well no, I don't get it...not if you don't actually give some reasoning behind it other than "Just because".

    I'm dismissing yours specifically with reasons. There is no grammatical rule nor definition that says that anything refered to as a party with a capital "P" must be a national political party. The fact a groups designated description is capitalized due to referencing the group in a formal sort of way doesn't mean it must be a political party. I'm dismissing yours because you're stating opinion as if its fact.

    You're dismissing mine because...you don't like it.

    I can just as easy turn it around on you and scream at you with cute little posters that mean nothing demanding that you come on my turf and deal with what I am saying.
    I am dealing with what you're saying...or at least, I did. And instead of addressing my counter to your point you continued to beat upon your strawman, demanding I show you things I never claimed existed as if that somehow proves your point.

    You could just as easily turn around and do it...but unlike my doing it, yours wouldn't make sense and would be worthless.

    get over yourself.
    Get over the fact that you made a statement on a debate board, I countered it, and rather than address that you decided to fall back on a classic debate fallacy and continually try to state opinion as fact?

    Look, you made a statement and I debated it...welcome to a debate forum.

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    Re: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

    Can you give me an additional example of a modern American political party who does not operate as a party and does not and has not ever fielded candidates in elections but still has the proper title of a formal Party?
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    Re: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    from Zyphlin

    this is what you are hanging your hat upon?!?!
    Yes, how dare I hang my hat upon reality and facts. Silly me. I should hang it upon ridiculous opinion that I prop up as fact.

    The "TEA" in the Tea Party Movement name is actually an acronym for "Taxed Enough Already". That was combined with the "Party" statemented to form "Tea Party", acting as a literary device to harken back to the Boston Tea Party which could be construed as an act of wanting less government involvement, in its case with taxes. Thus, the label of the "Tea Party" was placed on the original tax day protests and the group that spurred from it due to their own self labeling as such.

    The Boston Tea Party was not a reference to a political party OR a political movement but the word PARTY was a descriptive term of the activity taking place as an event.
    But you stated:

    The capitalization of both letters confers upon it the status of an ongoing formal organization in the same category as every single other political party operating
    The Boston Tea Party is capitalized, therefore under your strange definition it MUST be a Political Party in line with the Republican Party, Democratic Party, etc because it uses "Party" with a capitalized P!

    Or do you just get to pick and choose when your opinion becomes fact?

    The true FACT is that one can capitalize the word "Party" without it meaning that the thing being referenced is a political party.

    So is the Tea Party a political party like its name implies or the event like in the Boston Tea Party?
    Its name DOESN'T imply that, unless someone is judging it based on their OPINION and chooses to ignore reality of what its members have actually stated.

    The Tea Party Protests were a grouping of individuals coming together to protest increasing government encroachment into peoples live.s The Tea Party Protests spawned a movement whose name derives from the protests designations, thus the Tea Party Movement. The Tea Party is not, and has not ever been, a National Political Party and you simply restating it again, and again, and again doesn't make it true.

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    Re: Poll: Tea Party GOP, Obama nearly tied for leader of choice

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Can you give me an additional example of a modern American political party who does not operate as a party and does not and has not ever fielded candidates in elections but still has the proper title of a formal Party?
    Once again, strawman.

    Why would I give you such an example when I'm not arguing that there's a modern political party that doesn't operate as a political party? I'm not making that argument. NO ONE IS MAKING THAT ARGUMENT.

    No one...not a single solitary poster...has stated that the Tea Party is a Political Party. The only person on this thread that has been making that claim is yourself, to then turn around and beat up on that notion.

    know what that's called? Say it with me...Strawman.

    See, here's the really funny thing. I agree with you. There is NOT a national political party known as the "Tea Party", or more accurately the "Tea Party Party". There is no political group out there that is the Political Party of "Tea's" like the Republican Party is the party of Republicans or the Democratic Party is the party of Democrats. There's not a group of people going around stating "I'm a Tea'er" or "I vote Tea". There's absolutely no national political party for "Tea" or for the "Tea Party". When people...typically liberals...try to suggest that there is I am always happy to inform them their wrong.

    Where we split is the fact that YOU seem to think anyone that uses the capital P in Party is magically in "code words" stating that its a political party. Where as I look at those people stating "its not a political party" and don't make believe that they're actually lying and stealthily trying to really say that its a political party.

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