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Thread: Palin's reckless views on obesity

  1. #241
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    Re: Palin's reckless views on obesity

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    I think it is easy enough just to remind people...you eat at McDonalds (or fix cheap MacN cheese, or eat nothing but chips, drink soda, and eat food with no nutritional value but high in fat and calories) then you are going to get fat, develop health problems...and probably die young...and its going to be YOUR fault.
    That food is cheap and easy to prepare for people who are overworked and underpaid. Unless you're extending your argument to say that it's their fault for being poor and having lousy jobs...

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    So...choose...but we are NOT going to cover your health care and med bills.
    More people without healthcare coverage means more untreated illnesses which means more expensive indigent ER visits and more parasites living off of tax dollars. Public healthcare means that poor people are healthier. Healthier people are more productive. A more productive workforce means a more productive economy which means more wealth for everyone. It's stupid to neglect the health of the working poor until they become crippled and useless and then support them-- including their healthcare-- for the rest of their natural lives.

  2. #242
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    Re: Palin's reckless views on obesity

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    That food is cheap and easy to prepare for people who are overworked and underpaid. Unless you're extending your argument to say that it's their fault for being poor and having lousy jobs...



    More people without healthcare coverage means more untreated illnesses which means more expensive indigent ER visits and more parasites living off of tax dollars. Public healthcare means that poor people are healthier. Healthier people are more productive. A more productive workforce means a more productive economy which means more wealth for everyone. It's stupid to neglect the health of the working poor until they become crippled and useless and then support them-- including their healthcare-- for the rest of their natural lives.
    Viktyr, there might be something to that, except for certain caveats.
    1. Govenment programs tend to be far more $-wasteful than private enterprise.
    2. Government programs rarely deliver as promised; there's a reason why Brits and Canadians come to America for medical proceedures if they can afford to. Delays, poor service, etc. It is debateable whether the poor and blue-collar would really recieve better medical care than they do now.
    3. Our budget is currently 30% debt. This cannot go on indefinitely; the economy will collapse. We need to make major cuts in the budget, and failed social programs are the place to start. Adding new ones at this time just isn't feasible. Given that healthcare is 1/6th of the GDP, nationalizing it would be a good way to finish breaking the bank.
    4. Current Medicare/Medicaid schemes include price-fixing, which drives doctors and hospitals to charge much higher rates for people with private insurance. Extending this practice would likely drive many hospitals under, and many doctors out of the business. I know many healthcare professionals and docs, and this is a huge concern to them.
    Last edited by Goshin; 11-28-10 at 10:16 AM.

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  3. #243
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    Re: Palin's reckless views on obesity

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    That food is cheap and easy to prepare for people who are overworked and underpaid. Unless you're extending your argument to say that it's their fault for being poor and having lousy jobs...



    More people without healthcare coverage means more untreated illnesses which means more expensive indigent ER visits and more parasites living off of tax dollars. Public healthcare means that poor people are healthier. Healthier people are more productive. A more productive workforce means a more productive economy which means more wealth for everyone. It's stupid to neglect the health of the working poor until they become crippled and useless and then support them-- including their healthcare-- for the rest of their natural lives.
    I pretty much agree with everything you said. Its not going to be an easy overnight fix. People are going to HAVE to become a little more self sufficient...a little more feral. And yes...its going to sting. I think in the meantime charitable organizations and 'the people' are going to have to step up their efforts while the fed reduces theirs. Somewhere 'in the middle' there will be a solution. Or they will simply die...which...BTW...they are doing NOW and none of these current programs are touching that. We are having this discussion precisely BECAUSE the obesity problem is escalating.

  4. #244
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    Re: Palin's reckless views on obesity

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    Obesity is already affecting military readiness because of a shortage of able-bodied volunteers.
    Still doesn't mean extinction is on the table. Plus, it's a problem which can be solved with something far less drastic, like mandatory military service.
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  5. #245
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    Re: Palin's reckless views on obesity

    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    When people have demonstrated a pattern of making bad decisions, trusting them to make the right decisions for our future is irrational and dangerous.
    Fine. Let's start with HIV and risky sexual practices, for that costs us a fortune. That has permanent, irreversible consequences.

    If we were making the right decisions for our children in the face of the obesity epidemic, there wouldn't be any obesity epidemic for us to worry about.
    Let's use that paragraph as follows:
    It is obvious homosexual men are a major source of HIV/AIDS. If they were making the right decisions in the face of the HIV/AIDS pandemic, there would be a smaller epidemic for us to worry about.

    Getting this country back on track means getting people to behave correctly. If force is the only way the government can accomplish this, so be it.
    Komrade, Welcome to the USSA. Government is here to make sure you live your life correctly. We will be at the dinner table, in your bedroom, at your workplace, in your schools. We cannot trust you morons to live your lives properly.

    This message was brought to you by the Democrat Party, and we approve of this message.

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    Last edited by zimmer; 11-28-10 at 05:25 PM.
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  6. #246
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    Re: Palin's reckless views on obesity

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post
    The free market is a form of rationing. Not everyone who wants a service can have it. Instead, only those with the ability to pay can, and the rest go without. Insurance engenders a distortion of market forces, causing a "tragedy of the commons" of sorts. Except that in this tragedy, we have the skyrocketing costs, instead of depletion of resources.

    What is your solution to the rising costs? C'mon, put yourself out there, so that we can distort your ideas like your wackjobs on the right do with every idea put forth from the left.
    First we should buy some hot dogs and cook them over Pelosi's flaming HC bill.
    Then we get congress to sit down and discuss this.
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    http://rules-republicans.house.gov/M...tive3962_9.pdf
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  7. #247
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    Re: Palin's reckless views on obesity

    You know (seriously) - perhaps they should tackle the expense of the related health problems that come from junk food, smoking, drinking, etc - by taxing all foods that are deemed 'unhealthy' as well as cigarettes and alcohol (or whatever).
    Then put that into a trust-fund.
    Use that trust-fund to cover people's self-induced weight issues like diabetes or smoking problems like cancer.

    They do this for the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program - they tax the vaccines and put that into a trust fund which compensates those (individuals or their families) when one suffers illness or death due to vaccinations.

    By how the NVIC Program runs they tax different vaccines different amounts depending on the diseases it's suppose to prevent.
    "a dose of trivalent influenza vaccine is [taxed] $0.75 because it prevents one disease, whereas the excise tax imposed on a dose of the measles-mumps-rubella vaccine is $2.25 because prevents three diseases."

    Something similar could be done depending on the unhealthiness of said item - some things would be taxed more than others (like sugary energy drinks VS a box of cracker jacks)

    That way people who avoid said items aren't paying out to help people because of their personal choices.
    People who indulge and suffer - still get medical help.
    With the liquor, junk food, soda and so on being more expensive some people won't indulge quite so much.

    Win win win
    Last edited by Aunt Spiker; 11-28-10 at 07:58 PM.
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  8. #248
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    Re: Palin's reckless views on obesity

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    You know (seriously) - perhaps they should tackle the expense of the related health problems that come from junk food, smoking, drinking, etc - by taxing all foods that are deemed 'unhealthy' as well as cigarettes and alcohol (or whatever).
    Then put that into a trust-fund.
    Use that trust-fund to cover people's self-induced weight issues like diabetes or smoking problems like cancer.

    They do this for the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program - they tax the vaccines and put that into a trust fund which compensates those (individuals or their families) when one suffers illness or death due to vaccinations.

    By how the NVIC Program runs they tax different vaccines different amounts depending on the diseases it's suppose to prevent.
    "a dose of trivalent influenza vaccine is [taxed] $0.75 because it prevents one disease, whereas the excise tax imposed on a dose of the measles-mumps-rubella vaccine is $2.25 because prevents three diseases."

    Something similar could be done depending on the unhealthiness of said item - some things would be taxed more than others (like sugary energy drinks VS a box of cracker jacks)

    That way people who avoid said items aren't paying out to help people because of their personal choices.
    People who indulge and suffer - still get medical help.
    With the liquor, junk food, soda and so on being more expensive some people won't indulge quite so much.

    Win win win
    Smokers and overweight people should just pay higher premiums, if they don't already. That might be incentive enough to quit and lose weight if it means your premiums go down.
    No, let me change that. Thin, non smokers should have reduced premiums. That sounds better. OOOps, Sarah Palin's Alaska is on! You all don't wanta miss it! :-)
    Catawa is my favorite bleeding heart liberal.
    1/27/12

  9. #249
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    Re: Palin's reckless views on obesity

    Oh they are running the first and second Palin's Alaska, then the new one. I've already seen the first two.
    Catawa is my favorite bleeding heart liberal.
    1/27/12

  10. #250
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    Re: Palin's reckless views on obesity

    [QUOTE=Barbbtx;1059126868]Smokers and overweight people should just pay higher premiums, if they don't already. That might be incentive enough to quit and lose weight if it means your premiums go down.
    No, let me change that. Thin, non smokers should have reduced premiums. That sounds better. OOOps, Sarah Palin's Alaska is on! You all don't wanta miss it! :-)[/QUOTE]

    yes, go watch it, it will be off the air soon
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