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Thread: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

  1. #41
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    Re: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Unless we begin to get serious about alternative energy, that fertilizer will be flying pretty fast and fairly soon.
    THAT is a subject I know a lot about. Wind power, solar power are not alternatives, but supplements, and will remain so for a very long time. Plus, the really important issue is oil to make gasoline for transportation needs. We have plenty of really good ways to make electricity, but at best electricity can only help our transportation needs over very short distances.
    We had a lot of success since the 70's on making our cars and trucks burn fuel more efficiently, and cleaner. Congress mandated it, but neglected to do the same for buildings. That is finally changing with Architecture 2030, which is new building codes.
    That will save a lot of electricity and some natural gas, and gas can be used for transportation needs...
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    Re: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Now that you mention it, I have read that before. So, what do we do, keep using Saudi oil til it is all gone and then use our own low grade stuff? I really don't think that is wise, not if it costs more American lives. But I hope to live long enough to see it.
    When the Saudis run out of oil, there will be a lot of fertilizer hitting the ventilator.
    As long as that's the cheapest energy source available, yeah, we'll continue to use it and the Saudis will continue to get fat and fund terrorism around the world. IMO the fertilizer will quit flying when the Saudis run out of oil and go back to molesting camels for entertainment. And at that point, we would be well advised to have our own resources ready to go.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Unless we begin to get serious about alternative energy, that fertilizer will be flying pretty fast and fairly soon.
    Alternative energy initiatives like ethanol, wind and solar **ARE** the fertilizer hitting the fan. There isn't a one of those ideas that can can compete with coal and/or oil on cost or reliability for commercial application.
    "We the people are the rightful masters of both Congress & the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution, but overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution."
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  3. #43
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    Re: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

    Quote Originally Posted by Diogenes View Post
    As long as that's the cheapest energy source available, yeah, we'll continue to use it and the Saudis will continue to get fat and fund terrorism around the world. IMO the fertilizer will quit flying when the Saudis run out of oil and go back to molesting camels for entertainment. And at that point, we would be well advised to have our own resources ready to go.



    Alternative energy initiatives like ethanol, wind and solar **ARE** the fertilizer hitting the fan. There isn't a one of those ideas that can can compete with coal and/or oil on cost or reliability for commercial application.
    Brazil has the perfect climate, plenty of water, land, to make plenty of sugar cane to make alcohol based fuels. Possibly sugar cane can be grown economically in the swampier parts of the southeast, where snakes and alligators live.
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    Re: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

    Quote Originally Posted by Mickey Shane View Post
    We need to add the right to refuse X-ray security checks to the Bill of Rights.
    There's no law that says you have to submit to an x-ray security check. Just like there's nothing in the Constitution that says you have to be allowed to fly on that aircraft instead of driving you ass to where you need to go.

    Don't like the security checks? Don't fly! There, problem solved.
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    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  5. #45
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    Re: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

    Quote Originally Posted by Diogenes View Post
    As long as that's the cheapest energy source available, yeah, we'll continue to use it and the Saudis will continue to get fat and fund terrorism around the world. IMO the fertilizer will quit flying when the Saudis run out of oil and go back to molesting camels for entertainment. And at that point, we would be well advised to have our own resources ready to go.



    Alternative energy initiatives like ethanol, wind and solar **ARE** the fertilizer hitting the fan. There isn't a one of those ideas that can can compete with coal and/or oil on cost or reliability for commercial application.
    How about natural gas? We have plenty of that right here at home. All we need is the infrastructure to distribute and market it. Cars and trucks can already run on it.

    Natural gas, nuclear energy, and very soon, solar will be able to meet a large part of our energy needs. All we need is the will to become energy independent.

    Did anyone catch the 60 minutes episode Sunday about natural gas and how much we have available?
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    Re: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    How about natural gas? We have plenty of that right here at home. All we need is the infrastructure to distribute and market it. Cars and trucks can already run on it.

    Natural gas, nuclear energy, and very soon, solar will be able to meet a large part of our energy needs. All we need is the will to become energy independent.

    Did anyone catch the 60 minutes episode Sunday about natural gas and how much we have available?
    Arizona did an alt-fuel thing, converting cars to natural gas. You could even get a compressor to boost the pressure of the natural gas delivered to your home furnace, so that you can fill your own gas tank....
    We have so much natural gas that we use to just burn it off at the wells. It took some time for the technology to be developed so that it can get collected,shipped, etc.
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    Re: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Arizona did an alt-fuel thing, converting cars to natural gas. You could even get a compressor to boost the pressure of the natural gas delivered to your home furnace, so that you can fill your own gas tank....
    We have so much natural gas that we use to just burn it off at the wells. It took some time for the technology to be developed so that it can get collected,shipped, etc.
    It seems to me that LNG is the best way to energy independence in the short term. I wonder why no one pushing for it?
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    It seems to me that LNG is the best way to energy independence in the short term. I wonder why no one pushing for it?
    It is being pushed, but it takes time to modify infrastructure.
    Personally, I don't like it for the added danger. Gasoline is bad enough, but LNG in the hands of our average drivers is a disaster in the making....
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    Re: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    It is being pushed, but it takes time to modify infrastructure.
    Personally, I don't like it for the added danger. Gasoline is bad enough, but LNG in the hands of our average drivers is a disaster in the making....
    Yes, safety is a concern, no doubt.

    Technology has been able to make modern automobiles safer than their predecessors, despite the insanity of the "average drivers." Maybe it can do the same to adding LNG tanks to cars.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Nader unites us all in the fight against ‘federal fondlers’

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Brazil has the perfect climate, plenty of water, land, to make plenty of sugar cane to make alcohol based fuels. Possibly sugar cane can be grown economically in the swampier parts of the southeast, where snakes and alligators live.
    Very true, at least about Brazil, and they are busily eliminating Amazon rain forest to plant sugar cane to meet world demand. They can produce it and ship it to New Orleans much cheaper than we can produce it here, so we have imposed prohibitive import taxes on it to subsidize our own ethanol producers. In fact, the price of sugar would drop dramatically if we allowed free trade in it from the Caribbean but our own producers have too strong a political lobby to allow it.

    Ethanol, however, is a very low energy fuel. Also it has to be trucked wherever it goes because it is alcohol and absorbs water, so it can't go by pipeline. Here in the mountain west, it is still possible to buy gasoline that has no ethanol in it and that's what I buy whenever I can. The E10 gasoline is nominally a few points higher in octane and often a few percent cheaper than regular, but it costs me 10% of my mileage and is thus more expensive to use. Reports from folks who have paid several thousand dollars more for AFE vehicles are that E85 fuel costs them 25% of their mileage (e.g., 28 mpg on regular gas becomes 21 mpg on E85).

    IMO ethanol is a scam, and all government subsidies for it should be dropped.
    "We the people are the rightful masters of both Congress & the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution, but overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution."
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