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Thread: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

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    Re: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Still failing to do math I see? Your own link shows that only $80 billion wasn't spent. That $150 billion includes profits and returned money (as I noted earlier and as you failed as always). Since when did $80 billion = $200 billion?

    You really must enjoy the taste of fail. You so often post links disproving your own arguments.



    Still refusing to look at actual data I see. Once a partisan, always a partisan.

    Again btw, citing Obama spending money and taking control of TARP as proof that TARP isn't an Obama plan is pretty stupid. You just called me wrong...and then proved I was correct.
    Brilliant argument as usual, Bush's Administration created TARP, Bush signed TARP, left half of TARP to be spent by Obama and now it is Obama's plan because Bush left him 350 billion of which he spent 150 billion? let me remind you of what happened on Nov. 2, 2010, Obama got "shellacked" just like you with every post and here is why.

    Last Four Recessions and their Durations
    12/07 - 6/09 18 months
    3/01 - 11/01 8 months
    7/90 - 3/91 8 months
    7/81 - 11/82 16 months

    The recession ended in June of 2009 and since the stimulus plan was signed 4 million people more have lost their jobs and 3 trillion has been added to the debt. Apparently the public doesn't see the wonderful things Obama is doing for us. I am sure the majority in this country are wrong and you with your superior intelligence and ego are right.


    BLS link, create own chart
    Employment, Hours, and Earnings from the Current Employment Statistics survey (National)

    BEA links GDP and Receipts/Expense
    U.S. Department of Commerce. Bureau of Economic Analysis

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    Re: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Brilliant argument as usual, Bush's Administration created TARP, Bush signed TARP, left half of TARP to be spent by Obama and now it is Obama's plan because Bush left him 350 billion of which he spent 150 billion? let me remind you of what happened on Nov. 2, 2010, Obama got "shellacked" just like you with every post and here is why.
    Not only can you not do math, but you now being exceptionally dishonest.

    Notice I said it was both an Obama and Bush plan. Now notice you are LYING about what I said.

    And you are now changing your argument away from how much he didn't spend rather then admit you screwed up. You may be the most immature user on this forum. Completely and wholly incapable of admitting you are wrong on anything and having to resort to complete dishonesty to avoid admitting you are wrong.

    The recession ended in June of 2009 and since the stimulus plan was signed 4 million people more have lost their jobs and 3 trillion has been added to the debt. Apparently the public doesn't see the wonderful things Obama is doing for us. I am sure the majority in this country are wrong and you with your superior intelligence and ego are right.
    You are wrong. That has been made abundantly clear on this forum on every subject you talk about. And the biggest problem with the stimulus was that it was slow. But you are arguing that higher taxes and less aggregate demand would have resulted in lower unemployment. Adpst ran from that. I suspect you will pretend that doesn't exist either. Do you think the majority in this country would have liked to have paid more taxes without the stimulus? You do know you are arguing that tax cuts hurt the economy now?

    Linear Regression. Try it some time.
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    Re: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

    Hmmmmm....interesting.

    If only $70.1 billion of the total $700 billion in TARP funds have been returned, why are Republican/Convervatives so eager to end TARP per their own Pledge (page 5, 4th paragraph)? Why would a political party that claims to be so fiscally responsible and so protective of the tax payer's money be so willing to throw $549 billion away?

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    Re: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Not only can you not do math, but you now being exceptionally dishonest.

    Notice I said it was both an Obama and Bush plan. Now notice you are LYING about what I said.

    And you are now changing your argument away from how much he didn't spend rather then admit you screwed up. You may be the most immature user on this forum. Completely and wholly incapable of admitting you are wrong on anything and having to resort to complete dishonesty to avoid admitting you are wrong.



    You are wrong. That has been made abundantly clear on this forum on every subject you talk about. And the biggest problem with the stimulus was that it was slow. But you are arguing that higher taxes and less aggregate demand would have resulted in lower unemployment. Adpst ran from that. I suspect you will pretend that doesn't exist either. Do you think the majority in this country would have liked to have paid more taxes without the stimulus? You do know you are arguing that tax cuts hurt the economy now?

    Linear Regression. Try it some time.
    So because Bush left Obama 350 billion of the TARP fund that made the TARP fund both Bush and Obama's? What did Obama have to do with the creation of the program? Because he had the funds to spend doesn't make the program his, but it does make the spending his which is part of the deficit he claims he inherited. Guess that was just another lie too, inherited 1.3 trillion deficit, right?

    You really are a waste of time and totally out of touch with reality. Take a look at the election results on Nov. 2 to see how the American people feel about the Obama results. Results matter in real life, OC, not your theory or rhetoric and the Obama results have been a disaster. He took over an economy that saw the recession end in June 2009 and since that recession ended had higher unemployment each month of 2010 than he had in 2009 during the recession on a month to month basis. 4 million jobs have been lost since he took office and 3 trillion has been added to the debt. Today there are over 16 million unemployed Americans thus Obama got shellacked in the elections. Keep that head buried, OC, and I look forward to seeing him kicked out on his ass in Nov. 2012 along with his entire radical leftwing economic team.

    As for your tax argument that too is a waste of time. There is only one political ideology that doesn't care how much you make or pay in taxes and it isn't the liberal ideology. The only thing that matters with regards to taxes is how much is paid, not the rates. In a consumer driven economy more spendable income means higher personal income, more consumer spending, higher corporate profits, and higher excise taxes paid. It means more savings thus higher interest earned which again adds to higher taxes paid. Spending creates demand for jobs and that is what happened when Reagan and Bush both cut tax rates. Whether you believe it or not is irrelevant for all that matters are the results and the Obama results speak for themselves.

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    Re: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Hmmmmm....interesting.

    If only $70.1 billion of the total $700 billion in TARP funds have been returned, why are Republican/Convervatives so eager to end TARP per their own Pledge (page 5, 4th paragraph)? Why would a political party that claims to be so fiscally responsible and so protective of the tax payer's money be so willing to throw $549 billion away?
    Ending TARP doesn't mean ending the collection and payback, only preventing the remaining funds from being used. More than 70 billion has been repaid according to the Treasury Dept.

    Here is the latest I can find on TARP

    TARP Repayments Surpass Loans - WSJ.com
    Last edited by Conservative; 11-27-10 at 06:36 PM.

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    Re: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    One taxpayer paying $1 or two taxpayers paying .50(FIFTY CENTS) each, sorry, forgot who I was dealing with.
    This is a ridiculous argument. Can you show that tax cuts were responsible for a doubling of the workforce? If not, then your example is not bounded in reality.

    in 2008 Consumption was over 10.1 trillion dollars out of a 14.3 trillion economy showing the power of the consumer and the benefits of higher take home pay thanks to the Bush tax cuts.
    What the **** are you talking about, power of the consumer? Are you magically forgetting that economy slid into the worst recession since WWII following the actions (which you label as an absolute positive) of the Bush administration? Not that i am attributing Bush policies as a cause of the recession, only that this occured in accordance of his policies.

    Saving money reduces demand on govt. services but saving money does create interest or dividends which are taxable.
    Paying down debt is equivalent to saving money. In a consumer driven economy that is heavily indebted, interest payments will overtake income earned through saving (interest payments from a bank). Any consumer who took the proceeds from any tax cut, and spent them on equities will most likely be regretting that investment now. Investing does not equal saving.

    You continue to spout the same rhetoric while ignoring the points made.
    My so called "rhetoric" was in response to your so called "points made". Tax cuts only lead to economic growth if the money is spent on domestic goods/services. If the money is saved, it does not flow into the economy in the near term, which leads to deficits if spending is not cut in accordance with tax cuts.

    You simply cannot admit that you are wrong and the points I have made are valid.
    The validity of your points require heroic assumptions on saving and spending. You have to ignore time, leakage (do you even know what it is?), government spending, deficits, etc..., to come to those conclusions.

    Do you honestly believe any valid economic analysis ignores important factors?

    Liberals always ignore posts that refute their rhetoric and make them look bad. Facts definitely make you look bad.
    For the nth time, stop trying to turn this into a discussion about me. We are discussing topics, not each other.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
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    Re: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

    Goldenboy219;1059125530]This is a ridiculous argument. Can you show that tax cuts were responsible for a doubling of the workforce? If not, then your example is not bounded in reality.
    You really need to learn to read, but no the workforce didn't double but there were almost 18 million jobs created. Can you show me that the tax cuts didn't affect the creation of those jobs?

    What the **** are you talking about, power of the consumer? Are you magically forgetting that economy slid into the worst recession since WWII following the actions (which you label as an absolute positive) of the Bush administration? Not that i am attributing Bush policies as a cause of the recession, only that this occured in accordance of his policies.
    Instead of burying your head in an economics book you probably should have put it into a civics book and a history book. The recession of 1981-82 was worse than the 2007-2009 recession as I lived and worked during both. Home buyers loved the 20+ misery index and paying 18% for a home mortgage. There was no comparison between the recession nor in the economic policies that got us out of the 81-82 recession. Interesting fact that you want to ignore, 4 million jobs lost since Obama took office and 3 trillion added to the debt.


    Paying down debt is equivalent to saving money. In a consumer driven economy that is heavily indebted, interest payments will overtake income earned through saving (interest payments from a bank). Any consumer who took the proceeds from any tax cut, and spent them on equities will most likely be regretting that investment now. Investing does not equal saving.
    Paying down debt helps both the consumer and the company. Consumers have more money, higher savings and companies have more cash and less accounts receivable. It is a win-win situation. Investment income is taxable and increases govt. revenue so not sure you understand that concept.



    My so called "rhetoric" was in response to your so called "points made". Tax cuts only lead to economic growth if the money is spent on domestic goods/services. If the money is saved, it does not flow into the economy in the near term, which leads to deficits if spending is not cut in accordance with tax cuts.

    There was economic growth after the Bush and Reagan Tax cuts and there was job creation. You really don't seem to understand how our economy works and totally ignore corporate activity as you focus purely on individual activity. It really doesn't serve much purpose here for me to try and convince you one that I don't care how much you make and hope it is millions, nor that there is value in keeping more of what you earn. You have been brainwashed.


    The validity of your points require heroic assumptions on saving and spending. You have to ignore time, leakage (do you even know what it is?), government spending, deficits, etc..., to come to those conclusions.
    I prefer logic and common sense as well as historical data. Explain to me how govt. revenue grew AFTER the Reagan and Bush tax cuts. Your argument to tie taxes to spending is bogus. If less money is coming in, stop spending. Problem is more money was coming in and the govt. spent it. I have given you the sites to check on revenue and expenses. You choose your economics textbook.


    For the nth time, stop trying to turn this into a discussion about me. We are discussing topics, not each other.

    You are the one that wants to divert from the thread topic and thus it has become about you, your textbook education and lack of personal business experience. The facts that you continue to ignore are the 4 million jobs lost, 16 million total unemployed, and 3 trillion added to the debt all leading to the shellacking Obama took on Nov. 2. You really need to get out into the real world more.
    Last edited by Conservative; 11-27-10 at 09:20 PM.

  8. #178
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    Re: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

    From BLS.gov in case anyone is interested.

    TOTAL NONFARM ALL EMPLOYEES (in thousands), NOT SEASONALLY ADJUSTED



    Jan of 2001=130433

    Jan of=2002=128602

    Jan of=2003=128248

    Jan of=2004=128365

    Jan of=2005=130369

    Jan of=2006= 132961

    Jan of=2007= 134952

    Jan of=2008=135840
    The haggardness of poverty is everywhere seen contrasted with the sleekness of wealth, the exhorted labor of some compensating for the idleness of others, wretched hovels by the side of stately colonnades, the rags of indigence blended with the ensigns of opulence; in a word, the most useless profusion in the midst of the most urgent wants.Jean-Baptiste Say

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    Re: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

    Quote Originally Posted by donc View Post
    From BLS.gov in case anyone is interested.

    TOTAL NONFARM ALL EMPLOYEES (in thousands), NOT SEASONALLY ADJUSTED



    Jan of 2001=130433

    Jan of=2002=128602

    Jan of=2003=128248

    Jan of=2004=128365

    Jan of=2005=130369

    Jan of=2006= 132961

    Jan of=2007= 134952

    Jan of=2008=135840
    And during that period, the population grew at about 10%


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    Re: Obama Heralds 1.1M Private Sector Jobs Created Since Jan.

    Quote Originally Posted by donc View Post
    From BLS.gov in case anyone is interested.

    TOTAL NONFARM ALL EMPLOYEES (in thousands), NOT SEASONALLY ADJUSTED

    Jan of 2001=130433

    Jan of=2002=128602

    Jan of=2003=128248

    Jan of=2004=128365

    Jan of=2005=130369

    Jan of=2006= 132961

    Jan of=2007= 134952

    Jan of=2008=135840


    Thought this was 2010, wonder why you didn't post those numbers, further why not seasonally adjusted, you have a problem with construction workers although it really doesn't matter, the Obama record is bad regardless of the chart.

    Here is the seasonally adjusted numbers showing 4 million lost jobs.

    Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
    1980 99879 99995 99713 99233 98945 98682 98796 98824 99077 99317 99545 99634
    1981 99955 100191 100571 101056 101048 100298 100693 100689 100064 100378 100207 99645
    1982 99692 99762 99672 99576 100116 99543 99493 99633 99504 99215 99112 99032
    1983 99161 99089 99179 99560 99642 100633 101208 101608 102016 102039 102729 102996
    1984 103201 103824 103967 104336 105193 105591 105435 105163 105490 105638 105972 106223
    1985 106302 106555 106989 106936 106932 106505 106807 107095 107657 107847 108007 108216
    1986 108887 108480 108837 108952 109089 109576 109810 110015 110085 110273 110475 110728
    1987 110953 111257 111408 111794 112434 112246 112634 113057 112909 113282 113505 113793
    1988 114016 114227 114037 114650 114292 114927 115060 115282 115356 115638 116100 116104
    1989 116708 116776 117022 117097 117099 117418 117472 117655 117354 117581 117912 117830
    1990 119081 119059 119203 118852 119151 118983 118810 118802 118524 118536 118306 118241
    1991 117940 117755 117652 118109 117440 117639 117568 117484 117928 117800 117770 117466
    1992 117978 117753 118144 118426 118375 118419 118713 118826 118720 118628 118876 118997
    1993 119075 119275 119542 119474 120115 120290 120467 120856 120554 120823 121169 121464
    1994 121966 122086 121930 122290 122864 122634 122706 123342 123687 124112 124516 124721
    1995 124663 124928 124955 124945 124421 124522 124816 124852 125133 125388 125188 125088
    1996 125125 125639 125862 125994 126244 126602 126947 127172 127536 127890 127771 127860
    1997 128298 128298 128891 129143 129464 129412 129822 130010 130019 130179 130653 130679
    1998 130726 130807 130814 131209 131325 131244 131329 131390 131986 131999 132280 132602
    1999 133027 132856 132947 132955 133311 133378 133414 133591 133707 133993 134309 134523
    2000 136559 136598 136701 137270 136630 136940 136531 136662 136893 137088 137322 137614
    2001 137778 137612 137783 137299 137092 136873 137071 136241 136846 136392 136238 136047
    2002 135701 136438 136177 136126 136539 136415 136413 136705 137302 137008 136521 136426
    2003 137417 137482 137434 137633 137544 137790 137474 137549 137609 137984 138424 138411
    2004 138472 138542 138453 138680 138852 139174 139556 139573 139487 139732 140231 140125
    2005 140245 140385 140654 141254 141609 141714 142026 142434 142401 142548 142499 142752
    2006 143142 143444 143765 143794 144108 144370 144229 144631 144797 145292 145477 145914
    2007 146032 146043 146368 145686 145952 146079 145926 145685 146193 145885 146483 146173
    2008 146421 146165 146173 146306 146023 145768 145515 145187 145021 144677 143907 143188
    2009 142221 141687 140854 140902 140438 140038 139817 139433 138768 138242 138381 137792
    2010 138333 138641 138905 139455 139420 139119 138960 139250 139391 139061

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