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Thread: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

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    Re: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Probably as much as they spend cleaning up garbage along the roadways.
    Point being; smokers are irresponsible (not sure what garbage along the roadways has to do with this particular topic).
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Point being; smokers are irresponsible (not sure what garbage along the roadways has to do with this particular topic).
    No, the point is that SOME smokers are irresponsible just as SOME non-smokers are. So it's really irrelevant.

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    Re: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    No, the point is that SOME smokers are irresponsible
    We are not here to discuss non smokers and their irresponsible activities. The fact of the matter is, the effects of smoking are nowhere near internalized to the smoking population; and their actions spillover into the lives of others. Cigarette butt litter is an issue.

    just as SOME non-smokers are. So it's really irrelevant.
    Textbook red herring.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Cigarette butt litter is an issue.
    LITTER is an issue. Period.

    Textbook red herring.
    Nope, not at all. You can't make a blanket statement saying that "smokers are irresponsible" based on the fact that SOME smokers toss their cig butts on the ground while ignoring the fact that SOME non-smokers litter just as much, if not more, than SOME smokers do. Trying to single smokers out as litterers and paint them in a bad light while ignoring the rest of the people that litter is just intellectually dishonest.

    So, any "point" you had about some smokers littering and therefore they are evil is negated by the fact that a ****load of non-smokers litter too. Which makes them evil too. So both are evil. Big whooptie.

    If you have an issue with littering, then deal with litterers - smokers or not. Don't attempt to villify only one subset of people for it while ignoring the rest.

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    Re: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    LITTER is an issue. Period.
    So is acid rain, and smog.

    Nope, not at all. You can't make a blanket statement saying that "smokers are irresponsible" based on the fact that SOME smokers toss their cig butts on the ground while ignoring the fact that SOME non-smokers litter just as much, if not more, than SOME smokers do. Trying to single smokers out as litterers and paint them in a bad light while ignoring the rest of the people that litter is just intellectually dishonest.

    So, any "point" you had about some smokers littering and therefore they are evil is negated by the fact that a ****load of non-smokers litter too. Which makes them evil too. So both are evil. Big whooptie.
    And there you go on with your red herring. I made no reference to non smokers and their littering because it does not pertain to the proposed smoking ban, or bare any significance within this discussion. Cigarette butts do!

    If you need to use a fallacy to make a point, there really is not reason to reply.
    Last edited by Kushinator; 09-20-10 at 11:40 AM.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    So is acid rain, and smog.



    And there you go on with your red herring. I made no reference to non smokers and their littering because it does not pertain to the proposed smoking ban, or bare any significance within this discussion. Cigarette butts do!

    If you need to use a fallacy to make a point, there really is not reason to reply.
    Littering has nothing to do with the proposed smoking ban. THAT is the point.

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    Re: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Littering has nothing to do with the proposed smoking ban. THAT is the point.
    Are you stating that cigarette littering will be unaffected if the smoking ban is signed into law? It's amazing how there is little if any cigarette litter in areas that do not allow smoking.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Are you stating that cigarette littering will be unaffected if the smoking ban is signed into law? It's amazing how there is little if any cigarette litter in areas that do not allow smoking.
    In some areas, it might. In others it will not.

    What's that got to do with the ban? Unless you think they're banning smoking because littering is illegal?

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    Re: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    In some areas, it might. In others it will not.

    What's that got to do with the ban? Unless you think they're banning smoking because littering is illegal?
    It has to do with the irresponsibility of smokers in general. Obviously, there are already littering fines in place, but they are not enforced to the extent required to reduce ciggy butts from being an issue. If i remember correctly, ciggy littering skyrocketed once bar and restaurant smoking bans were put in place (people smoked outside and dropped their buts there).
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Smokers Beware! Proposed New York City Smoking Ban Targets Outdoor Facilities

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Statist. That's Bircher talk. Are you a Bircher?



    No, I am a New Yorker. Who has suffered under this tyrants Jack boot.





    You are going to need a bigger bucket.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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