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Thread: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

  1. #161
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    Re: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    I know I am correct on this. Thank you for your quick concession.
    Has it ever occurred to you that if you have to keep telling yourself you've won you must be insecure, not to mention you lack a grasp on reality?

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    The remainder of your post was just idiotic sputtering and blathering with appeals to the absurd. As such, I simply disregard it.
    Now that is subjective! Not the location of a building!
    Last edited by EnigmaO01; 08-23-10 at 08:22 PM.

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    Re: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

    Quote Originally Posted by EnigmaO01 View Post
    Has it ever occurred to you that if you have to keep telling yourself you've won you must be insecure, not to mention you lack a grasp on reality?
    Has it ever occurred to you that sarcasm is a fun way to deflect the mindless rantings of certain enigmas?

    Now that is subjective! Not the location of a building!
    Never claimed it wasn't subjective. However, I also never claimed that the exact location of the building was a subjective thing either. You might want to spend more time paying attention to your level of comprehension and less time trying to play forum psychologist in the future.

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    Re: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

    Quote Originally Posted by EnigmaO01 View Post
    Oh really? So the following are subjective opinon? if you trully believe that, you need to get out a dictionary and look up the word subjective.
    No those are both just out and out lies.

    The building IS ground zero, it was struck by a huge piece of one of the actual planes that hit the towers.

    This is not a Community Center. They will not be offering religious services for any non-Muslim members of the community, they will be offering religious services to only Muslims, non-Muslims will be allowed entry the same as anyother Mosque so that they may receive Dawa.

    Mosque - any place of Muslim worship. A jami-masjid or Friday Mosque is a major mosque where weekly prayer services are performed and a sermon or khutbah is given.

    It's literally the textbook defintion of a Mosque.

    This is a community center like Evangelical Mega-Churches are community centers.

  4. #164
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    Re: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Ferris View Post
    No those are both just out and out lies.

    The building IS ground zero, it was struck by a huge piece of one of the actual planes that hit the towers.

    This is not a Community Center. They will not be offering religious services for any non-Muslim members of the community, they will be offering religious services to only Muslims, non-Muslims will be allowed entry the same as anyother Mosque so that they may receive Dawa.

    Mosque - any place of Muslim worship. A jami-masjid or Friday Mosque is a major mosque where weekly prayer services are performed and a sermon or khutbah is given.

    It's literally the textbook defintion of a Mosque.

    This is a community center like Evangelical Mega-Churches are community centers.
    * outstanding recreation spaces and fitness facilities (swimming pool, gym, basketball court)
    * a 500-seat auditorium
    * a restaurant and culinary school
    * cultural amenities including exhibitions
    * education programs
    * a library, reading room and art studios
    * childcare services
    * a mosque, intended to be run separately from Park51 but open to and accessible to all members, visitors and our New York community
    * a September 11th memorial and quiet contemplation space, open to all

    Yeah, doesn't sound like a community center at ALL.

    And two blocks away is NOT ground zero. It's - get this - two blocks AWAY from it. You can't even see ground zero from the building. Not that it even ****ing matters.

  5. #165
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    Re: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Ferris View Post
    No those are both just out and out lies.

    The building IS ground zero, it was struck by a huge piece of one of the actual planes that hit the towers.

    This is not a Community Center. They will not be offering religious services for any non-Muslim members of the community, they will be offering religious services to only Muslims, non-Muslims will be allowed entry the same as anyother Mosque so that they may receive Dawa.

    Mosque - any place of Muslim worship. A jami-masjid or Friday Mosque is a major mosque where weekly prayer services are performed and a sermon or khutbah is given.

    It's literally the textbook defintion of a Mosque.

    This is a community center like Evangelical Mega-Churches are community centers.
    The aim of the building as a whole is not 'Muslim worship'. It will have an area within it for Muslim worship, but that's it - and to call anywhere with a prayer room a 'mosque' is outright dishonest - for example, many schools in the UK have a prayer room. To quote: "The facility's design includes a 500-seat auditorium, theater, performing arts center, fitness center, swimming pool, basketball court, childcare area, bookstore, culinary school, art studio, food court, September 11th memorial, and prayer space that could accommodate 1,000–2,000 people.[7][8]"

    Actually, that sounds quite a lot like the various buildings at the University I went to. I never knew I was at a mosque all that time...

    EDIT: Dammit, beaten by rivarrt. *fist-shakey*
    The truth may be out there, but lies are in your head. ~Terry Pratchett

  6. #166
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    Re: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    * outstanding recreation spaces and fitness facilities (swimming pool, gym, basketball court)
    * a 500-seat auditorium
    * a restaurant and culinary school
    * cultural amenities including exhibitions
    * education programs
    * a library, reading room and art studios
    * childcare services
    * a mosque, intended to be run separately from Park51 but open to and accessible to all members, visitors and our New York community
    * a September 11th memorial and quiet contemplation space, open to all

    Yeah, doesn't sound like a community center at ALL.

    And two blocks away is NOT ground zero. It's - get this - two blocks AWAY from it. You can't even see ground zero from the building. Not that it even ****ing matters.
    Actually, Ground Zero itself is a subjective designation. The site of the old WTC is a 16 acre area with specific boundaries but the term Ground Zero isn't restricted by objective boundaries. Two blocks is not far enough away to reasonably state that it isn't the ground zero area. Two blocks from what, exactly?
    Last edited by jallman; 08-23-10 at 08:43 PM.

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    Re: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    Indeed.

    I've been doing a little research on the basis that I knew nothing more than what the anti-mosque people have been saying, and my opinion of Rauf is rising with everything I find. He wrote a book called "What's right with Islam" - you can read an excerpt from it here. In it, he argues that Armerica best represents "Islam's true values", refers to "the waging of peace" as the greatest Jihad, argues that the 9/11 bombers were breaking Sharia law and that Muslim troops in the US army are justified in fighting against other Muslims, and argues for a pluralistic, multi-religious society. To quote directly from the book: "We strive for... a time when Jews, Christians, Muslims, and all other faith traditions will live together in peace, enjoying a renewed vision of what the good society can look like. In this good society all religious voices are welcome and given maximum freedom, and no one religion (or even atheism) is allowed to inhibit any other. Towards this dream we aspire"

    But noooooooooo, it's a 'victory mosque' and he's an anti-American Islamist, because some right-wing bloggers have quotemined him and you shouldn't question something that which confirms your own biases. Seriously?
    lol this guy says that the U.S. has more blood on its hands than Al Qaeda, that the U.S. was an accessory to 9-11, that OBL was made in the USA, refuses to condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization, and advocates Sharia law.

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    Re: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    The aim of the building as a whole is not 'Muslim worship'. It will have an area within it for Muslim worship, but that's it - and to call anywhere with a prayer room a 'mosque' is outright dishonest - for example, many schools in the UK have a prayer room. To quote: "The facility's design includes a 500-seat auditorium, theater, performing arts center, fitness center, swimming pool, basketball court, childcare area, bookstore, culinary school, art studio, food court, September 11th memorial, and prayer space that could accommodate 1,000–2,000 people.[7][8]"

    Actually, that sounds quite a lot like the various buildings at the University I went to. I never knew I was at a mosque all that time...

    EDIT: Dammit, beaten by rivarrt. *fist-shakey*
    Will they be offering religious services to other members of the community? Non-Muslims will be allowed in so that they may receive Dawa the same as any other Mosque.

  9. #169
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    Re: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    The aim of the building as a whole is not 'Muslim worship'. It will have an area within it for Muslim worship, but that's it - and to call anywhere with a prayer room a 'mosque' is outright dishonest - for example, many schools in the UK have a prayer room. To quote: "The facility's design includes a 500-seat auditorium, theater, performing arts center, fitness center, swimming pool, basketball court, childcare area, bookstore, culinary school, art studio, food court, September 11th memorial, and prayer space that could accommodate 1,000–2,000 people.[7][8]"

    Actually, that sounds quite a lot like the various buildings at the University I went to. I never knew I was at a mosque all that time...

    EDIT: Dammit, beaten by rivarrt. *fist-shakey*
    So wait...the prayer space is nearly 4 times that of the auditorium and you don't see how some people might view the function of the building to be more mosque oriented than community center oriented?

  10. #170
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    Re: The 911 Hard Hat Pledge

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    * outstanding recreation spaces and fitness facilities (swimming pool, gym, basketball court)
    * a 500-seat auditorium
    * a restaurant and culinary school
    * cultural amenities including exhibitions
    * education programs
    * a library, reading room and art studios
    * childcare services
    * a mosque, intended to be run separately from Park51 but open to and accessible to all members, visitors and our New York community
    * a September 11th memorial and quiet contemplation space, open to all

    Yeah, doesn't sound like a community center at ALL.
    No it doesn't, will they be offering religious services for other members of the community? This is a community center like Evangelical Mega-Churches with similar facilities are community centers IE they're not.

    And two blocks away is NOT ground zero. It's - get this - two blocks AWAY from it. You can't even see ground zero from the building. Not that it even ****ing matters.
    English not your first language? This building is ground zero, it was struck by a huge piece of landing gear from one of the planes that struck the towers. That's ground zero by any reasonable definition of ground zero.

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