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GOP plan to extend tax cuts for rich adds $36 billion

TurtleDude said:
The people who tend to be the most reliable dem votes are.

who do you think the Obamunists were appealing to when they said they would only raise taxes on those making 200K or more?
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if you are going to raise taxes on someone(and eventually, to dig ourselves out from our mountain of debt, something both dems and repubs are guilty of creating , we will have to) where does it make sense to try and get the revenue from?? from those that don't have a pot to piss in? or from those who do? you and conservative keep screaming 'class warfare' and keep claiming that 'your jealous of the rich' ...bull....tell me, where does it make sense to try and get the revenue from? where? common sense man, common sense.
 
Conservative said:
How will an increase in taxes on those "rich" business owners affect employment and prices they charge the public? then how will that increase in prices affect sales and thus tax revenue?
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The effect will be a more stable economy. The Great Depression happened after taxes were lowered to 24%. Black Monday happened after Reagan lowered taxes and the current mess were are in was after Bush lowered taxes. The rich use the extra money from tax cuts to speculate, not to hire more people. They hire people when there is demand for their products and services.

George H.W. Bush once called supply-side economics VooDoo economics and he was correct.
 
Re: Dem vs Rep Tax Cut Plan in Graph form!

TurtleDude said:
1) it was an honest question since your posts appear to be the antithesis of the libertarian philosophy.
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I was unaware political labels were grounds for debate regarding fiscal policy.

Since I was Ed Clark's campaign chairman for New Haven in 1980 I have a fairly good understanding of what it means to be a libertarian
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That's nice.

2) You haven't demonstrated anything that would suggest that you are in a position to make such a pronouncement
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Seriously??? I mean.... Seriously? The day i begin going off topic to discuss your political lean is the day you'd have a point.

3) others have noted your perspective is one of statist or welfare socialist as well
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People caught up in labels are the first to "note". You know, the "im a libertarian because its cool" crowd. If you would like to discuss me as opposed to the topic, by all mean send me a PM. Or make a post in another sub forum.
 
Conservative said:
Amazing, isn't it, how liberals actually hurt the people they claim they want to help. The total ignorance on understanding human behavior is quite staggering.
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Most things the Dem/Liberal leadership say are lies or pretexts for lies

example

1) lib elites say their welfare socialist schemes are designed to help the poor. In reality, those schemes keep people mired in poverty and dependent on dem leaders. By doing so, dem leaders create a permanent underclass of voters who keep them in office and wealthy

2) dems claim their gun control schemes will make us safer when in reality those schemes embolden criminals and cause honest people to feel they are in danger leading citizens to abdicate more rights to the government in return for sketchy promises of more safety. Furthermore by pushing gun control dems can claim they are doing something "about crime" while actually making the lives of criminals safer

3) dems claim they want to "protect jobs" by burdening American Corporations with all sorts of rules, taxes and red tape that actually cause corporations to move off shore to remain profitable. Then Dem leader demonize those corporations in order to gain more political power from the brain dead union types who haven't figured out yet that corporations are founded to make their owners money, not to support and feed a union
 
pbrauer said:
It was the Republicans who put the expiration date on the bill, not the Democrats.
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It was a desperate attempt to pass needed cuts--you are right, they should have made them permanent but the dems would have blocked the legislation
 
Conservative said:
Amazing, isn't it, how liberals actually hurt the people they claim they want to help. The total ignorance on understanding human behavior is quite staggering.
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Is that why poverty rates increased from 2000 to 2004? Be cause republicans "cared" so much?
 
pbrauer said:
The effect will be a more stable economy. The Great Depression happened after taxes were lowered to 24%. Black Monday happened after Reagan lowered taxes and the current mess were are in was after Bush lowered taxes. The rich use the extra money from tax cuts to speculate, not to hire more people. They hire people when there is demand for their products and services.

George H.W. Bush once called supply-side economics VooDoo economics and he was correct.
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COmplete nonsense. "extra money"

why don't you stop craving the wealth of others and take care of your own needs without demanding others pay for you
 
winston53660 said:
Is that why poverty rates increased from 2000 to 2004? Be cause republicans "cared" so much?
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mainly that came from poor life choices by those "in poverty"
 
Conservative said:
Now there you go again, failure to recognize why an expiration date was put on the bill. Why do you ignore history?
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dishonesty appears to be an essential attribute to being a tax hike advocate
 
pbrauer said:
The effect will be a more stable economy. The Great Depression happened after taxes were lowered to 24%. Black Monday happened after Reagan lowered taxes and the current mess were are in was after Bush lowered taxes. The rich use the extra money from tax cuts to speculate, not to hire more people. They hire people when there is demand for their products and services.

George H.W. Bush once called supply-side economics VooDoo economics and he was correct.
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Now there you go again promoting higher taxes without any understanding of human behavior. There are 16 million unemployed Americans today which again you ignore. If you don't put them back to work there is NO stable economy. You continue to believe you know how the rich react to higher taxes but of course do not. Where is your outrage over the 47% that don't pay any taxes with many of them in the 40-50k per year pay?

Nearly half of US households escape fed income tax - Yahoo! Finance
 
randel said:
if you are going to raise taxes on someone(and eventually, to dig ourselves out from our mountain of debt, something both dems and repubs are guilty of creating , we will have to) where does it make sense to try and get the revenue from?? from those that don't have a pot to piss in? or from those who do? you and conservative keep screaming 'class warfare' and keep claiming that 'your jealous of the rich' ...bull....tell me, where does it make sense to try and get the revenue from? where? common sense man, common sense.
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Here is an article that I am sure you will ignore. If you want more revenue get it from those who don't pay any income taxes at all

Nearly half of US households escape fed income tax - Yahoo! Finance
 
Conservative said:
Personal responsibility has no place in the liberal world.
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it goes hand and hand

FOr a lib to assert that the government needs to take care of someone and run his life for him, they must also admit that the person has no personal responsibility. It comes from the malignant mindset that the liberal knows what is better for you than you yourself.
 
randel said:
so again, take from those who have nothing, so those who have everything can keep more of it? yeah, that makes sense:roll:
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you seem to miss the point

why should I have to pay the load for others when all that does is to encourage them to vote for more and more taxes and more and more government spending

what Benefits do I get FROM the GOVERNMENT by being taxed more and more?

and why do you think I have a duty to pay for those who give me NOTHING in return

for a centrist you sure sound like a welfare-socialist. IS Ted Strickland too conservative for you?
 
randel said:
so again, take from those who have nothing, so those who have everything can keep more of it? yeah, that makes sense:roll:
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Didn't read the article, I see. People making 50,000 a year and pay nothing in Federal Income taxes hardly are poor but somehow are ignored by people who want to penalize the so called rich? Noticed you ignored that many of those so called rich are business owners who actually employ people. Your class envy is an example of why liberalism is a failed ideology. You seem to care about what someone else pays in taxes while ignoring those that pay nothing. How typical!
 
Conservative said:
Didn't read the article, I see. People making 50,000 a year and pay nothing in Federal Income taxes hardly are poor but somehow are ignored by people who want to penalize the so called rich? Noticed you ignored that many of those so called rich are business owners who actually employ people. Your class envy is an example of why liberalism is a failed ideology. You seem to care about what someone else pays in taxes while ignoring those that pay nothing. How typical!
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back to the talking points i see..well, carry on, i'm sure others will continue with you.
 
randel said:
back to the talking points i see..well, carry on, i'm sure others will continue with you.
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translation--Randel cannot refute or deal with the excellent point Conservative made that the socialists don't think its fair to be rich but think its perfectly fair to vote up taxes on others while paying none yourself
 
Conservative said:
Didn't read the article, I see. People making 50,000 a year and pay nothing in Federal Income taxes hardly are poor but somehow are ignored by people who want to penalize the so called rich? Noticed you ignored that many of those so called rich are business owners who actually employ people. Your class envy is an example of why liberalism is a failed ideology. You seem to care about what someone else pays in taxes while ignoring those that pay nothing. How typical!
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A peron making $50k/year pays a greater percentage of their income in taxes than Warren Buffett. Along the lines of +30% of their income (although i am leaving out FICA and medicare). Itemized deductions allow for a lower tax bracket, but when we include FICA and medicare, it jumps back to around 30%.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
A peron making $50k/year pays a greater percentage of their income in taxes than Warren Buffett. Along the lines of +30% of their income (although i am leaving out FICA and medicare). Itemized deductions allow for a lower tax bracket, but when we include FICA and medicare, it jumps back to around 30%.
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a guy making 50K a year spends a greater percentage of his income on a chesseburger than I do. Are you claiming I should have to pay 10 times more than that guy because I make more than ten times what he does?

Buffett structures his compensation to avoid taxes and then claims that is unfair. Buffett also pays millions in taxes-do you think Buffett uses 10000 times more government services than your example

tell me-what De Jure Benefits does Buffett get from the Government in return for paying millions in taxes--
 
Goldenboy219 said:
A peron making $50k/year pays a greater percentage of their income in taxes than Warren Buffett. Along the lines of +30% of their income (although i am leaving out FICA and medicare). Itemized deductions allow for a lower tax bracket, but when we include FICA and medicare, it jumps back to around 30%.
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Your outrage over someone else pays in taxes and ignoring that 47% pay zero Federal Income taxes is quite telling. Taking advantage of many of the deductions available many in that 50,000 range pay zero in Federal Income taxes thus your argument is absolutely absurd.
 
TurtleDude said:
a guy making 50K a year spends a greater percentage of his income on a chesseburger than I do. Are you claiming I should have to pay 10 times more than that guy because I make more than ten times what he does?

Buffett structures his compensation to avoid taxes and then claims that is unfair. Buffett also pays millions in taxes-do you think Buffett uses 10000 times more government services than your example

tell me-what De Jure Benefits does Buffett get from the Government in return for paying millions in taxes--
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Outstanding post and analysis
 
Conservative said:
Your outrage over someone else pays in taxes and ignoring that 47% pay zero Federal Income taxes is quite telling. Taking advantage of many of the deductions available many in that 50,000 range pay zero in Federal Income taxes thus your argument is absolutely absurd.
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You can back this up. I am not making a judgment call, only setting the record straight. To state that a person making $50k gross/year pays zero federal taxes is of course absurd (and displays your desire to make things up to suit your ideology).
 
Goldenboy219 said:
You can back this up. I am not making a judgment call, only setting the record straight. To state that a person making $50k gross/year pays zero federal taxes is of course absurd (and displays your desire to make things up to suit your ideology).
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Of course I can back it up. Maybe if you spent less time on theory and more time focusing on what is actually happening you would have more credibility.

Nearly half of US households escape fed income tax - Yahoo! Finance
 
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