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Thread: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

  1. #91
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    Re: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    I find it interesting to watch how people justify taking what they have no right to take. "I don't want to pay for music, so...the laws are stupid."
    Yeah - it's the same thought process behind people stealing gas, food, clothing, cars.
    "I can't afford it . . . I don't like the laws . . . so I'll just take it . . . because I *want* it"

    Yet people don't consider it theft when it's entertainment.
    But it is defined as theft when it comes to any othe product.

    Wool for your eyes, anyone?
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    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
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    Re: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Well - then make it right. Calculate what you feel the artist truly deserves . . . and cut them a check to cover your theft.

    Surely you don't feel that artists and actors are purely there to entertain and embrace the whole starving artist personae?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    I find it interesting to watch how people justify taking what they have no right to take. "I don't want to pay for music, so...the laws are stupid."
    I guess you guys haven't been paying attention.

    For me, I won't buy the DVD of movies I watch unless I like the movie.
    I can't justify spending money on something that I have no clue as to, whether or not, I will like it.

    If I like the movie I'll buy it, if not, they didn't earn my money.
    I have never burned a DVD in my life.

    Your also missing another point, you don't own what you can't control.
    Ideas, images, sounds, anything intangible is impossible to control, once released to the public.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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    Re: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Yeah - it's the same thought process behind people stealing gas, food, clothing, cars.
    "I can't afford it . . . I don't like the laws . . . so I'll just take it . . . because I *want* it"

    Yet people don't consider it theft when it's entertainment.
    But it is defined as theft when it comes to any othe product.

    Wool for your eyes, anyone?
    Not the same thing, it requires a person to work to create every car, food, clothing item, etc.
    While on the other hand, creating the music, movie, book etc, requires one occurrence that can be reproduced at practically zero cost infinitely.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  4. #94
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    Re: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Yeah - it's the same thought process behind people stealing gas, food, clothing, cars.
    "I can't afford it . . . I don't like the laws . . . so I'll just take it . . . because I *want* it"

    Yet people don't consider it theft when it's entertainment.
    But it is defined as theft when it comes to any othe product.

    Wool for your eyes, anyone?
    Again, it's defined differently because it is different. Taking a car/food/clothing deprives the owner of their property and is a criminal offense. Downloading a CD infringes the owner's copyright and is a civil offense. It doesn't make it right, but it's different.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Well - then make it right. Calculate what you feel the artist truly deserves .
    So because I / we argue that it isn't robbery/theft that means we think artists deserve nothing/less?

    Are you trying to be a troll, or is this all accidental, because I assure you logic dictates your premise to be false.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    . . and cut them a check to cover your theft.
    Which begs the question of whether or not any theft has occured in the first place. Not making money does not mean money you had was taken from you, so arguing it on that grounds is faulty.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Surely you don't feel that artists and actors are purely there to entertain and embrace the whole starving artist personae?

    I'm doubting you are capable of intellectually honest debate, since your post doesn't address the points we've made, and attacks strawmen you created.
    Nationalism in high dosages may be hazardous to your health. Please consult a psychiatrist before beginning a regular regimen, and if feelings of elitism and douchbaggery continue, discontinue immediately before you become unable to do so on your own.

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    Re: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Your also missing another point, you don't own what you can't control.
    Ideas, images, sounds, anything intangible is impossible to control, once released to the public.

    Well, they don't give up their ownership of the IP simply by making it available for sale.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

  7. #97
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    Re: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    I guess you guys haven't been paying attention.

    For me, I won't buy the DVD of movies I watch unless I like the movie.
    I can't justify spending money on something that I have no clue as to, whether or not, I will like it.

    If I like the movie I'll buy it, if not, they didn't earn my money.
    I have never burned a DVD in my life.

    Your also missing another point, you don't own what you can't control.
    Ideas, images, sounds, anything intangible is impossible to control, once released to the public.
    I've been paying attention to you.
    Please note that I'm constantly discussing the general masses of people who engage in piracy - not just you.

    I don't buy what I don't like before I view it, either - most people don't. I have no problem renting, borrowing from a friend or watching on TV something to see if you're interested in adding it to your collection.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Not the same thing, it requires a person to work to create every car, food, clothing item, etc.
    While on the other hand, creating the music, movie, book etc, requires one occurrence that can be reproduced at practically zero cost infinitely.
    Just like trinket jewelry, yeah?
    Someone designs it - once - makes a few prototypes. Then someone programs a machine . . . and off it goes - mass production.

    Is it ok to steal jewelry off of a rack because it took relatively little labor on someone's part?

    What about a book?
    Author writes it, a company refines it - into a machine it's put and then off it goes - multiple copies, instantly.
    Does that mean it's ok to steal it off the shelf?
    But you can check it out at the library and read the entire thing for free if it swings you.

    My point is that if someone wants to *own* it forever - they need to *buy* it - regardless of their opinion of the *laws, rules, regulations and corporate crap* behind it.
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  8. #98
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    Re: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    I've been paying attention to you.
    Please note that I'm constantly discussing the general masses of people who engage in piracy - not just you.

    I don't buy what I don't like before I view it, either - most people don't. I have no problem renting, borrowing from a friend or watching on TV something to see if you're interested in adding it to your collection.
    I won't give them a dollar unless they prove that it is worth buying.
    Won't do it.
    Went to the theatre and watched Toy Story 3 this weekend, same cast of actors it's been a good series.
    They won my money.

    Unknown quality movies, won't get my money until I see it first.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Just like trinket jewelry, yeah?
    Someone designs it - once - makes a few prototypes. Then someone programs a machine . . . and off it goes - mass production.

    Is it ok to steal jewelry off of a rack because it took relatively little labor on someone's part?
    It still requires materials and labor to produce.
    I don't steal things.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    What about a book?
    Author writes it, a company refines it - into a machine it's put and then off it goes - multiple copies, instantly.
    Does that mean it's ok to steal it off the shelf?
    But you can check it out at the library and read the entire thing for free if it swings you.
    I should be able to read it, before I will buy it, unless the author has a history of writing good books.
    Then I may buy it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    My point is that if someone wants to *own* it forever - they need to *buy* it - regardless of their opinion of the *laws, rules, regulations and corporate crap* behind it.
    That's the thing, you don't own it.
    IP law only allows you to rent it indefinitely or until the device it is stored on is destroyed.
    Then you have to buy another copy.

    The law allows dead people to own stuff.
    If that is allowed I think I'm being a bit more reasonable than it is.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  9. #99
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    Re: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    Well, they don't give up their ownership of the IP simply by making it available for sale.
    I understand but until IP laws move to realm of reasonable, that is my stance.
    It's current incarnation is crazily stupid, so I must take the extreme position in hopes of the law moving towards a middle ground.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  10. #100
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    Re: Obama Administration Announces Massive Piracy Crackdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    That's the thing, you don't own it.
    IP law only allows you to rent it indefinitely or until the device it is stored on is destroyed.
    Then you have to buy another copy.
    You don't own a book's content even if you've bought it
    If you *lose* a book - like - it gets blown into the water at a lake - you have to go and buy another copy
    When you buy something you buy *that one* of it - there - that one is yours. . . a book, someone's art - all these things are still under copyright laws.

    Your issue isn't with that, then, because a variety of things fall under that - and these other things don't seem to bother you.

    Your issue is with the companies - stuffing the prices and charging too much. (I agree here)
    Your issue is with the government - getting involved more and more. (I agree here)
    Your issue is with the copyright laws as they exist now - which defined how much is *yours* and how much still belongs to another person. (I agree here)

    The only thing we're not agree on is what is acceptable for you or me to do in response to these three issues.

    Like I said before - I think the government needs to tend to the kitchen where it has bigger fish to fry. . . I think that focusing on this is stupid and won't do anything. . . but I understand why they're going for it - even though it's a waste of time and there's no point.

    The only thing I have strong issues with is when the photographer comes to my children's school - takes pictures of my children - prints them off off and sends them home - and then charges me an arm and a leg for pictures of my children and then claims copyright over those photos. . . which makes it illegal for me to make my own personal copies even if I buy 1 or 10.

    Difference between this and everything else: I have a legal option...
    I can write the photographer and request permission to "put a permanent backup of this photo on file just in case something happens to the printed copy" - once they say yes (they always do) then I can put it on my computer and print it off all I like.

    So - I think options like this should be available to all other copyrighted items. . . I feel you should be able to make copies of something you purchase - sure - as long as you don't intend on selling it and as long as you've legally purchased the original.

    Whats' wrong with that? Don't know - but some people have a serious issue with that proposal (like the companies, for one)
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

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