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Thread: The End of Men

  1. #201
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    Re: The End of Men

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Not talking about averages. Talking about individuals in the same positions because that's the only comparisons that matter.
    The averages are truth.
    There are always exceptions.
    There will never be a time when there aren't exceptions.

    One of the articles I posted shows that men and women in the same job, with the same skill level and the same qualifications, earn approximately the same.
    Although women may still earn less because , as the article points out, women tend not to negotiate their salary.

    Men, on the whole, work more hours than women do.
    There is nothing bad or good about it, it does not make men superior and women inferior.
    It just shows why, in general, men earn more money.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  2. #202
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    Re: The End of Men

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    It's hard to draw conclusions about male/female equality when you look at data sets which are too wide. More women than men stay home and do child-rearing duties, which skews the data on hours worked and female earning progress.

    For women who work in the same fields as men, with similar educations, women often earn more than men, particularly in large urban areas. I'd say that pay parity has almost been achieved, and that the disparity exists primarily as a result of individual choices (i.e., opting out of career for the "mommy track.")
    That's what I've been trying to say.
    I didn't say women were inferior because of it.

    My whole stance in this thread is,
    • Men and Women are different but neither is bad.
    • Men and Women are complimentary.
    • Men and Women have different career wants which influence their lifetime earnings, discrimination has a slight effect.
    • In history; most people, regardless of sex, have had it really bad.
    • In general, gender roles are from evolutionary biology.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  3. #203
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    Re: The End of Men

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    That's what I've been trying to say.
    I didn't say women were inferior because of it.

    My whole stance in this thread is,
    • Men and Women are different but neither is bad.
    • Men and Women are complimentary.
    • Men and Women have different career wants which influence their lifetime earnings, discrimination has a slight effect.
    • In history; most people, regardless of sex, have had it really bad.
    • In general, gender roles are from evolutionary biology.
    The problem is that at least items 1, 2, 3 and 5 are mostly inaccurate. There are more differences BETWeEN individuals within the same gender than there are between the genders. Typing people on the basis of their gender is ridiculously stupid.

    Historically, women HAVE had different career wants, but they didn't really have a choice in the matter. They were in the white collar ghetto (secretarial pool). As it has become possible for women to make different career choices, these differences are going by the wayside. There are more females in med school, there are more females in law school than males, and more women are entering the hard sciences.

    Lastly, telling us that our biology dooms us to the caring professions and/or wiping infant asses all day is probably going to earn you an ass chewing from any of the women who didn't choose that path, because it's simply an outdated idea. Sure, I have breasts, but those breasts aren't going to keep me from being a competent accountant, attorney, doctor, scientist, or cop. Get over your stereotypes, please. They're so 1960.
    Last edited by Catz Part Deux; 07-08-10 at 02:42 PM.

  4. #204
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    Re: The End of Men

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    The averages are truth.
    There are always exceptions.
    There will never be a time when there aren't exceptions.

    One of the articles I posted shows that men and women in the same job, with the same skill level and the same qualifications, earn approximately the same.
    Although women may still earn less because , as the article points out, women tend not to negotiate their salary.

    Men, on the whole, work more hours than women do.
    There is nothing bad or good about it, it does not make men superior and women inferior.
    It just shows why, in general, men earn more money.
    But what I'm saying is that comparing "in general" when some women do choose fields that pay less, is not an accurate comparison. It's inaccurate to say "men make more than women" unless you're comparing the same jobs to the same jobs. That some women choose lower paying jobs is irrelevant and only screws up the results in favor of femnazis trying to portray women as victims.

    In the same jobs - if a woman is not making as much as her male peer, it's HER fault.

  5. #205
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    Re: The End of Men

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    The problem is that at least items 1, 2, 3 and 5 are mostly inaccurate. Historically, women HAVE had different career wants, but they didn't really have a choice in the matter. They were in the white collar ghetto (secretarial pool). As it has become possible for women to make different career choices, these differences are going by the wayside. There are more females in med school, there are more females in law school than males, and more women are entering the hard sciences. Telling us that our biology dooms us to the caring professions and/or wiping infant asses all day is probably going to earn you an ass chewing from any of the women who didn't choose that path, because most of us didn't want to go there.
    I didn't say you were doomed to that career path.
    I said that your brain biochemistry influences you more towards some career paths.
    That doesn't mean women will only be teachers and nurses.
    It means that there will be more women in the teaching and nursing professions.
    A big difference.

    You and RiverRat haven't necessary followed that, it's not wrong if you're happy with where you are.
    I just saying, in the big picture, more women will choose the road more traveled than not.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  6. #206
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    Re: The End of Men

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    But what I'm saying is that comparing "in general" when some women do choose fields that pay less, is not an accurate comparison. It's inaccurate to say "men make more than women" unless you're comparing the same jobs to the same jobs. That some women choose lower paying jobs is irrelevant and only screws up the results in favor of femnazis trying to portray women as victims.
    Those are the folks that this is mostly directed at.
    I have always viewed intelligent women as my equals, the same as I have viewed intelligent men.


    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    In the same jobs - if a woman is not making as much as her male peer, it's HER fault.
    A lot of the time that is true.
    Though I do believe that there are some people purposefully paying women less, solely because of gender.
    That's wrong.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

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