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Thread: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

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    Re: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

    A desperate move and a bad mistake, Degreez.
    Your biased source only acts to provide basis for the validity of the recordings by approving that the voice of one of the recorded passengers was real. (His wife)
    That she wasn't on the Mavi Marmara absolutely does nothing to prove that the recording wasn't real, at most it was a mistake to label this as a recording from the Mavi Marmara specifically and not from the flotilla as a whole.
    And if you haven't noticed it earlier, the wife not being on the Mavi Marmara, according to the article, is the only thing that they have that questions its validity, and even that doesn't question the validity of the recording.
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    Re: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    A desperate move and a bad mistake, Degreez.
    Your biased source only acts to provide basis for the validity of the recordings by approving that the voice of one of the recorded passengers was real. (His wife)
    That she wasn't on the Mavi Marmara absolutely does nothing to prove that the recording wasn't real, at most it was a mistake to label this as a recording from the Mavi Marmara specifically and not from the flotilla as a whole.
    And if you haven't noticed it earlier, the wife not being on the Mavi Marmara, according to the article, is the only thing that they have that questions its validity, and even that doesn't question the validity of the recording.
    The source for the audio is the IDF, so if you are going to discount biased sources, we have absolutely nothing here. Got to be consistent you know.
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    Re: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    The source for the audio is the IDF, so if you are going to discount biased sources, we have absolutely nothing here. Got to be consistent you know.
    Are you saying that I've based my entire comment on the fact that his source is biased?
    Read my comment again.
    I've explained that the source provides no real basis for the claim that the audio was forged.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

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    Re: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    Are you saying that I've based my entire comment on the fact that his source is biased?
    Read my comment again.
    I've explained that the source provides no real basis for the claim that the audio was forged.
    But you are missing the point. What they printed is not proof that the tape is phony, but there is no proof that the tape was not doctored either. Both sources are biased. We are back to square one, not knowing the truth.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    But you are missing the point. What they printed is not proof that the tape is phony, but there is no proof that the tape was not doctored either. Both sources are biased. We are back to square one, not knowing the truth.
    I've never said that there is a proof that this tape is completely valid.
    What I did say however is that his article does not support the claim that it was forged.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

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    Re: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

    The unedited video that showed the first Israeli descending unto the deck of the ship and the immediate swarm of armed attackers he faced SHOULD give people a clue as to the relative veracity of statements. Unfortunately, though, there are a good number of people who support this lynching -- a lynching supported despite, or perhaps because of the political views of those engaging in it -- and another group indulging in posturing. That posturing claims to be motivated by a desire for neutrality, but it is so forced as to represent the same sort of denial offered by the actual supporters. It's like walking down the street while watching one person coming up to another and stabbing them, only to claim "Well, I can't say that the person was stabbed" while the person stabbed lies bleeding in the gutter. In the case of Israel, such posturing may be calculated to make the poster feel better by appearing non- -judgmental, but the extremes people go through to AVOID making a value judgment are just as suspect as those indulging in the Orwellian newspeak by calling the attackers "humanitarians".


    The philosophical end point of such lines of thought are nihilistic in nature. Nothing matters. There is no right and wrong. There is no truth. We can't take a side. I don't know about others, but if I were to see a hundred members of the KKK beating the sh!t out of a black man, I WOULD take a side. I would take the side of the target because I have an understanding of the motivations behind the attack, and feel a natural empathy for the victim. Why others who should know better insist that their inability to indulge in moral reasoning is a GOOD thing is beyond me -- especially as they ridicule those who do.

    Those who sponsored this particular ship are part of the Muslim Brotherhood, an organization bent upon the establishment of a totalitarian Islamist state, and the thugs involved in the lynchings most certainly share those views. Good grief, when are otherwise reasonably intelligent people ever going to get a grip, anyway? Yeah, right, we can't display any value judgement. We sure wouldn't want to say something that isn't politicaly correct, would we?
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    Re: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    If you can find a reputable source showing this recording to be fake, by all means, please bring it to our attention.

    If you cannot, then we must accept this recording as legitimate.
    Until we know whether or not it's real we should admit that we don't know.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

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    Re: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    Until we know whether or not it's real we should admit that we don't know.
    I'm going to assume the IDF isn't lying, because the PR Blowback from FAKING the tape far outweighs the positive gained from the tape accepted as legitimate. Sorry, if the FBI Released tapes in a similar situation I wouldn't doubt the validity of the tapes until there is given good reason to doubt the tape.

    I think the doubt is because it Israel...
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    Re: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    I'm going to assume the IDF isn't lying, because the PR Blowback form FAKING the tape far outweighs the positive gained from the tape accepted as legitimate. Sorry, if the FBI Released tapes in a similar situation I wouldn't doubt the validity of the tapes until there is given good reason to doubt the tape.

    I think the doubt is because it Israel...
    I have no doubt regardng the tape since I know how the IDF operates, but I can understand people who question its validity.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

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    Re: Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

    Here's a useful post from Ido about this subject:

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/middle...post1058789753

    It actually fits the earlier source from Degreez that was claiming the voice of the woman was identified as an activist from one of the small ships.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

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