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Thread: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

  1. #161
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    Re: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    and derivatives are exactly what is being targeted in this bill.
    But not the main originators of those derivatives, hello! Targeting a financial instrument for regulation and not the party primarily responsible for their origination and distribution is kind of stupid, don't you think?

    my institution didn't make sub prime loans, as many banks didn't.

    of course the sub prime mortgages had some effect. however, no one forced any institution to make those loans, despite what you might believe.
    SOME effect!? Holy crap, what are you smoking?

    The bundling of subprime mortgages with good mortgages is what allowed the contagion to spread throughout the system. How clueless are you!?

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    Re: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    and derivatives are exactly what is being targeted in this bill. my institution didn't make sub prime loans, as many banks didn't.

    of course the sub prime mortgages had some effect. however, no one forced any institution to make those loans, despite what you might believe.
    If you are in the business do you know who Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are and what they do?

    How can there be financial reform without including those agencies? Are you telling me that Barney Frank and Chris Dodd supported financial reform of Fannie and Freddie when Bush proposed it?

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    Re: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    If you are in the business do you know who Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are and what they do?

    How can there be financial reform without including those agencies? Are you telling me that Barney Frank and Chris Dodd supported financial reform of Fannie and Freddie when Bush proposed it?
    we are discussing the current bill and why you believe it's garbage. by your own admission, misuse of derivatives was a big part of the problem, and yet you discount that the bill addresses that issue.

    yes, i know who they are, and i know what happened. they should be reformed, but they are not banks, and as such need a different set of regulations.

    Originally Posted by johnny_rebson:

    These are the same liberals who forgot how Iraq attacked us on 9/11.


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    Re: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    we are discussing the current bill and why you believe it's garbage. by your own admission, misuse of derivatives was a big part of the problem, and yet you discount that the bill addresses that issue.

    yes, i know who they are, and i know what happened. they should be reformed, but they are not banks, and as such need a different set of regulations.
    Because it doesn't solve anything when it leaves out two of the biggest contributors to the problem. You don't see that? Why does the govt. feel a need to regulate private industry when they cannot regulate their own? This is nothing more than a show bill where your Representatives are diverting from their own involvement.

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    Re: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    we are discussing the current bill and why you believe it's garbage. by your own admission, misuse of derivatives was a big part of the problem, and yet you discount that the bill addresses that issue.

    yes, i know who they are, and i know what happened. they should be reformed, but they are not banks, and as such need a different set of regulations.
    Here is more proof that the current legislation for financial reform that doesn't include Fannie Mae is a piece of garbage

    Fannie Taps Treasury for $15.3 Billion More After a 10th Loss - Bloomberg.com


    Are you starting to wake up yet?

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    Re: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Less government spending. They should reduce taxes to increase investment and allow struggling businesses to keep some extra money to get through. If anything government spending ultimately hurts the nation.
    You do realize that's what happened right before the Great Depression? I mean, the steep tax cuts.

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    Re: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post

    Are you starting to wake up yet?
    Interesting coming from you.

    Want to explain to me how we'd have this mess if the mortgages weren't securitized and then purchased with leverage?

    I'd love to see an argument showing how 1% of the economy caused a credit crisis.

    This outta be good. I await total fail by you.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

    Quote Originally Posted by 1984 View Post
    The bundling of subprime mortgages with good mortgages is what allowed the contagion to spread throughout the system. How clueless are you!?
    Not quite. Buying them with debt is the real problem. With pure cash purchases, it would hurt, but there wouldn't be future cash flow obligations on them. Their balance sheets would see real devaluation in equity to balance to decline in assets, but liabilities as a total function of the balance sheet wouldn't materially change in terms of solvency.

    I take it you are for cracking down on Moody's and S&P?
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Here is more proof that the current legislation for financial reform that doesn't include Fannie Mae is a piece of garbage

    Fannie Taps Treasury for $15.3 Billion More After a 10th Loss - Bloomberg.com


    Are you starting to wake up yet?
    If you would wake up, you would realize that it was under Republican leadership in 2004, that Fannie and Freddie were forced to put high-interest high-risk loans as applying toward their mandate to meet mandated goals of helping low-income families obtain housing.

    While, in 2000, (see same link) under Clinton's administration instructed Fannie and Freddie NOT to purchase high-interest subprime loans as it was against the initiative to help people buy homes.

    Once again, in 2004, that was overturned and the mandate to help low-income people own homes supported PRIVATE INDUSTRY subprime high-interest loans was re-instituted.

    NOW - before you go off, I'm not letting Democrats wipe their hands clean of this crisis. They played a big part in it as well and Fannie and Freddie should probably be addressed in this bill. However, the TARP (if I understand it correctly) took a lot of the shareholder responsibilities away from them and basically turned them back into public entities. So hasn't that already been addressed?

    However, I want the facts clear: in 2000, under Clinton (and to give credit - a Republican Congress) - Fannie and Freddie were instructed NOT to support the subprime loans that killed our economy. It was in 2004, under Bush (and to give blame - a Republican Congress) that they were given credit for these crappy loans once again.

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    Re: Financial Reform Talks Near Collapse, Some GOPers Threaten To Defect

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    If you would wake up, you would realize that it was under Republican leadership in 2004, that Fannie and Freddie were forced to put high-interest high-risk loans as applying toward their mandate to meet mandated goals of helping low-income families obtain housing.

    While, in 2000, (see same link) under Clinton's administration instructed Fannie and Freddie NOT to purchase high-interest subprime loans as it was against the initiative to help people buy homes.

    Once again, in 2004, that was overturned and the mandate to help low-income people own homes supported PRIVATE INDUSTRY subprime high-interest loans was re-instituted.

    NOW - before you go off, I'm not letting Democrats wipe their hands clean of this crisis. They played a big part in it as well and Fannie and Freddie should probably be addressed in this bill. However, the TARP (if I understand it correctly) took a lot of the shareholder responsibilities away from them and basically turned them back into public entities. So hasn't that already been addressed?

    However, I want the facts clear: in 2000, under Clinton (and to give credit - a Republican Congress) - Fannie and Freddie were instructed NOT to support the subprime loans that killed our economy. It was in 2004, under Bush (and to give blame - a Republican Congress) that they were given credit for these crappy loans once again.
    You seem to have a basic understanding of civics and how our Congress works. It takes 60 votes to get legislation passed in the Senate. Don't really care who controlled the Congress at the time because the GOP didn't have 60 votes to get regulation of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

    Obviously it doesn't matter what Barney Franks said about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac nor do the comments of Chris Dodd, Franks in the House and Dodd in the Senate. partisan rhetoric is what most are good at here.

    How can there be any Financial Reform bill without including Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and that remains the point that is being ignored here. Do you honestly believe it was the Republicans and Bush that wanted to give loans to low income people who had no hope of paying the mortgage? That is quite a stretch and out of touch with reality. Who said owing a home is a civil right?

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