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Obama: We're still working on our democracy

Goobieman

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Obama: We're still working on our democracy
Posted By Josh Rogin Sunday, April 11, 2010 - 11:49 PM

President Obama said Sunday that the United States is still "working on" democracy and a top aide said he has taken "historic steps" to improve democracy in the United States during his time in office.

Obama: We're still working on our democracy | The Cable

The two obvious questions:
-What is/was wrong with our democracy?
-What has The Obama done to improve it?
 
No democracy is perfect. There's always room for improvement. I think America needs to scrap it's two party system, it just doesn't seem like it works.

I think proportional representation is the closest thing we can get to true democracy at this point, it allows for so many parties to get in, and get their views across, rather then having two bloated political machines that do nothing but bash eachother instead of getting **** done.
 
The two obvious questions:
-What is/was wrong with our democracy?

Perhaps if you've paid attention to what both President Obama and Nazarbajev said about "attaining democracy", you wouldn't have made this knee-jerk reaction to the headline.

-What has The Obama done to improve it?

How about getting more young adults to vote in the last Presidential election? IIRC, those who were 18-25 yrs of age came out to vote in record numbers in 2008.
 
-What is/was wrong with our democracy?
Massive influences of private interests for starters.

Real Democracy doesnt work, btw. Democratic ideas do work when correctly applied, but real Democracy with a capital "D" doesnt actually work.
 
Wait, I thought you conservatives were pissed about pretty much everything that is happening right now. Are you saying now you think everything's swell?
You arent answering the queston.
If you were only going to obfuscate and misdirect, why bother responding?
 
Perhaps if you've paid attention to what both President Obama and Nazarbajev said about "attaining democracy", you wouldn't have made this knee-jerk reaction to the headline.
Rather than simply condescend, why don't you quote the specific points you refer to and show how they answer the question.

How about getting more young adults to vote in the last Presidential election? IIRC, those who were 18-25 yrs of age came out to vote in record numbers in 2008.
Ignoring for the moment that this was before The Obama took office, this is nothing more than an increase in participation. If there is something wrong with our democracy, as apparently there is, this isnt an improvement in that it only means that more people are participating in a flawed system.
 
Massive influences of private interests for starters.
Arent 'private interests' just groups of people collectively expressing their political position? How is that 'wrong' in terms of this discussion?

Real Democracy doesnt work, btw.
If you refer to the 2 wolves and a lamb metaphor, you're correct.
 
Rather than simply condescend, why don't you quote the specific points you refer to and show how they answer the question.

You missed my point entirely, which was pointing out that you had created a loaded question that disregards the context in which Obama had said about improving democracy.

So why would I have any intention of answering such a loaded question? But I'll throw you a bone, here's the text I'm referring to:

"Both presidents agreed that you don't ever reach democracy; you always have to work at it. And in particular, President Obama reminded his Kazakh counterpart that we, too, are working to improve our democracy."

Ignoring for the moment that this was before The Obama took office, this is nothing more than an increase in participation. If there is something wrong with our democracy, as apparently there is, this isnt an improvement in that it only means that more people are participating in a flawed system.

Unless the problem was voter participation (among other things). It's a well known fact that many young adults do not vote very often, and that the older population (specifically the senior citizens) are majority of voters. This disproportionality is a problem with regards to representation. Or do you disagree?
 
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You missed my point entirely, which was pointing out that you had created a loaded question that disregards the context in which Obama had said about improving democracy.

So why would I have any intention of answering such a loaded question?
If that's what let you sleep at night...

Unless the problem was voter participation (among other things).
Show this to be one of the issues The Obama referred to..
 
If that's what let you sleep at night...


Show this to be one of the issues The Obama referred to..

I'm saying it's a problem, and it has improved in 2008. Is there something you disagree with here?
 
I'm saying it's a problem, and it has improved in 2008. Is there something you disagree with here?
YOU saying it is a problem is meaningless -- the issue here is what The Obama thnks is a problem, and how He has improved the situation, as claimed.

But, you apparently aren't interested in actually discussing THAT.
 
YOU saying it is a problem is meaningless -- the issue here is what The Obama thnks is a problem, and how He has improved the situation, as claimed.

But, you apparently aren't interested in actually discussing THAT.

Do you not think there is a problem with our type of democracy?
 
No democracy is perfect. There's always room for improvement. I think America needs to scrap it's two party system, it just doesn't seem like it works.

I think proportional representation is the closest thing we can get to true democracy at this point, it allows for so many parties to get in, and get their views across, rather then having two bloated political machines that do nothing but bash eachother instead of getting **** done.

This type of thinking is lost on some who can only see their "side" as perfect. Don't ever suggest to them anything can ever be better, except maybe to get rid of the "other" side, whoever that may be. ;)
 
This type of thinking is lost on some who can only see their "side" as perfect. Don't ever suggest to them anything can ever be better, except maybe to get rid of the "other" side, whoever that may be.
So, were -you- going to try to address the questions asked in the OP, or similarly avoid them?
 
Your point? lol I've told you outright that I have no intention of answering your ridiculously loaded question.
Yes - my point that you arent interested in discussing the issue presented here - what The Obama thnks is a problem, and how He has improved the situation, as claimed -- only avoiding it.

You've proven it. Thank you.
 
So, were -you- going to try to address the questions asked in the OP, or similarly avoid them?

I haven't been able to read the article yet, but it does seem like a lot of silliness to me so far. Seriously, it's kind of a general statement that reasonable people make. We're always working to make everything better. Seems kind of silly and poor self esteemish to try and make this an issue.
 
Yes - my point that you arent interested in discussing the issue presented here - what The Obama thnks is a problem, and how He has improved the situation, as claimed -- only avoiding it.

You've proven it. Thank you.

What about the text I quoted in the article? You've got nothing to say about that?
 
I haven't been able to read the article yet, but it does seem like a lot of silliness to me so far. Seriously, it's kind of a general statement that reasonable people make. We're always working to make everything better. Seems kind of silly and poor self esteemish to try and make this an issue.
How so?
Aren't you interested in what flaws the President sees in our democracy, especially given that he's supposedly taken great steps in fixing them?
 
What about the text I quoted in the article? You've got nothing to say about that?
You mean:
"Both presidents agreed that you don't ever reach democracy; you always have to work at it. And in particular, President Obama reminded his Kazakh counterpart that we, too, are working to improve our democracy."
Seems to me this is the impetus behind my questions...

But you aren't interested in discussing that, so...:2wave:
 
You mean:

Seems to me this is the impetus behind my questions...

But you aren't interested in discussing that, so...:2wave:

So in order to find out what Obama meant as "the problems", the only way for us to find out is if The Obama is going to tell us. So what are we going to discuss if The Obama doesn't come into this thread and tell us what it is? :roll:
 
How so?
Aren't you interested in what flaws the President sees in our democracy, especially given that he's supposedly taken great steps in fixing them?

No, it was a general statement, not dissimilar to the ones I make concerning working on improving my profession, job, institution. It seems silly to try and turn that statement into anything serious.
 
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