Page 37 of 39 FirstFirst ... 273536373839 LastLast
Results 361 to 370 of 382

Thread: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

  1. #361
    Guru
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Last Seen
    11-03-11 @ 08:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    2,834

    Re: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I've already showed you where the UCMJ gives soldiers the right to have their grievances addressed by their commander. A soldier can even petition Congress to do so. No where does it say that gievances can't be brought against the President.
    You are wrong apdst. The eligibility issue is irrelevant to the court martial. Lakin disregarded a direct order from his superior Colonel Gordon R. Roberts. His grievance would have had to follow the chain of command. The soldier could petition congress but once again Congress has ever right to ignore it. Nowhere does it say the President personally has to address every soldier who brings a grievance.
    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post

    Because their's no question about McCain's legitimacy...

    But, now we see what you're really mad about...
    Oh there's plenty of questions one being US Military facilities overseas are not considered US Soil according to the state department thus McCain being born overseas is not natural born. However the senate did pass a resolution saying McCain is eligible. Congress did say Obama was eligible too. Lakin would have had a better case against McCain

  2. #362
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,356

    Re: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    Personal attacks? I haven't made a personal attack. You, on the other hand, have. You haven't posted any factual information thus far.
    The UCMJ isn't factual information? Since when?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  3. #363
    Guru
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Last Seen
    11-03-11 @ 08:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    2,834

    Re: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    And, you do know, from all your military experience, that if Obama was deemed illigitimate, news orders would have to be issued, voiding the old orders, thereby making the old orders illegal. Don't you?

    Weren't you in the service? You should know how the system works. Lakin's immediate commander didn't write the marching orders for his unit. The DoD did...signed off by the President i.e. The Commander in Chief.
    Once again Apdst, the President's legitimacy is irrelevant to the court martial. This will likely be deemed in the court martial. His orders came directly from his superiors and were facially valid. Even if Obama was deemed illegitimate, Lakin's orders to deploy would still have been legitimate.

    Even fox news has written Lakin off.

    FOXNews.com - Birther Army Doctor Court Martial May Yield No New Document

    “He is likely to lose everything and accomplish nothing,” one attorney lamented. “No military judge will say that (obtaining documents) of the president is necessary to prove the charges,” said Philip D. Cave, a Washington attorney and director of the National Institute of Military Justice.

    Cave said that the validity of Lakin's orders, under military law, does not depend on the president but on the chain of command. “He will be convicted and is in jeopardy of dismissal,” he said.

    Dismissal, for a military officer, is the same as a dishonorable discharge for an enlisted servicemember.

    “We all feel saddened,” said David Price, a former captain and 25-year veteran of the Navy Judge Advocate General’s office, now in private practice.

    “He was issued an order to deploy and didn’t. End of issue,” he said. He said the military has dealt with these types of cases since Vietnam, when soldiers tried to make larger political issues the basis of their trials, and is experienced at keeping the proceedings free of politics.

    Price also said that if the case does finally get to a general court-martial and a judge is asked to approve discovery requests by the defense, it is unlikely that it would be allowed to encompass the presidency. He said this wasn’t because of a conspiracy, but because the case is relatively simple and doesn’t require it.

    Gary Myers, a former military lawyer who now heads a Washington firm specializing in military law, says he "just shook my head" when he heard about the case “I think [Lakin] is out of his mind” for thinking he could challenge the president this way, he said.

  4. #364
    Guru
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Last Seen
    11-03-11 @ 08:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    2,834

    Re: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The UCMJ isn't factual information? Since when?
    Since you misinterpret it. You have shown no precedence for someone like Lakin being able to have his grievances against the president directly addressed.

  5. #365
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,356

    Re: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    Since you misinterpret it. You have shown no precedence for someone like Lakin being able to have his grievances against the president directly addressed.
    LOL...there's no need for precedence, since there's no restriction on how high up the chain of command a soldier can go to address a gievance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  6. #366
    Guru
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Last Seen
    11-03-11 @ 08:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    2,834

    Re: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    LOL...there's no need for precedence, since there's no restriction on how high up the chain of command a soldier can go to address a gievance.
    So in other words you can't point to a single situation where this has played out in your mind?

    Once again the President's eligibility is not relevant to Lakin's orders. How long were you a military lawyer and suddenly know more than David Price, Phillip Cave and Gary Myers?

  7. #367
    Guru
    ADK_Forever's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Last Seen
    05-07-11 @ 09:26 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    3,706

    Re: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    LOL...there's no need for precedence, since there's no restriction on how high up the chain of command a soldier can go to address a gievance.
    Where DO you get your info? All that matters to the court is did he get, and then disobey, a lawful order? Yes on both counts. Obama's birth certificate has no bearing here. He IS the president.

    This guy, a Lt. Colonel, does not have the pay grade to investigate, or "grieve", this issue any more than a private does.

    Just what does he think this will do?
    Thank You Barack Obama for Restoring Honor To The Presidency.
    President Obama will rank as one of our greatest presidents!

  8. #368
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,356

    Re: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post
    Where DO you get your info? All that matters to the court is did he get, and then disobey, a lawful order? Yes on both counts. Obama's birth certificate has no bearing here. He IS the president.

    This guy, a Lt. Colonel, does not have the pay grade to investigate, or "grieve", this issue any more than a private does.

    Just what does he think this will do?
    I get my information from the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Nowhere in the UCMJ does it say that a civilian court can answer to a grievance by a soldier to his commander.

    Paygrade doesn't matter. This right is extended to soldiers from E-1 to O-9.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  9. #369
    Sage

    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Huntsville, AL (USA)
    Last Seen
    12-11-17 @ 05:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    9,763

    Re: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    When are the Libbos going to get the picture? It's a soldier's right to ask those questions.

    But, instead, you all support persecuting anyone that dares question The Messiah.
    Question all you want, but once you're grievence has been heard by your immediate chain of command, the matter should be dropped. I mean, come on, apdst! You claim to be a veteran. Do you honestly believe that our servicemen and women should be so blantantly disobedient just because they don't want to follow the orders of their superiors especially when they have no proof to substantiat the claim they make? It's absord and goes against the ideals of good order and discipline.

    Lt.Col Lakin deserves to be court martialed not because his grievence may not have had any merit, but because he's a fool for disobeying orders so blindly.

  10. #370
    Guru
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Last Seen
    11-03-11 @ 08:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    2,834

    Re: Army 'showdown' at eligibility corral. Lt. Col. asks for birth cert.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I get my information from the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Nowhere in the UCMJ does it say that a civilian court can answer to a grievance by a soldier to his commander.

    Paygrade doesn't matter. This right is extended to soldiers from E-1 to O-9.
    Point to an example of someone in the military able to file a grievance personally against the president and disregard direct orders from his superiors and then have it addressed by the President. Once again you think you know more than military lawyers like Price, Myers, and Cave
    Last edited by PogueMoran; 04-25-10 at 04:05 PM.

Page 37 of 39 FirstFirst ... 273536373839 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •