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Thread: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

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    Re: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    C'mon Jall....Its great to be optimistic, but this is done.
    Like I said, defeatist rhetoric.

    There is not going to be any recall, the only shot is at a constitutional challenge which probably doesn't have much of a basis according to most analysis I've read.
    Not true. The mandate to buy private insurance without opening purchase across state lines nullifies the commerce clause justification. That's just one problem with it.

    Its not being "Bravado"...its called being realistic. The Republicans know this is done....its just political grandstanding.
    We've repealed amendments. I think we can get bad legislation repealed, in time.
    Last edited by jallman; 03-25-10 at 07:12 PM.

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    Re: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Student loan reform should be dealt with in a student loan reform bill, not a health reform bill. I understand that the Senate took the student loan provisions out, so all is cool...... Except that we are still stuck with the health care reform law.
    I agree...but let's not pretend that this is anything unique to this bill. This is how Congress has worked for decades, to pretend otherwise is just dishonesty by those who pretend.
    I see some people acting "shocked" that this type of thing is in the health bill. Get real, anyone who follows politics at all knows better.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Like I said, defeatist rhetoric.



    Not true. The mandate to buy private insurance without opening purchase across state lines nullifies the commerce clause justification. That's just one problem with it.



    We're repealed amendments. I think we can get bad legislation repealed, in time.

    Ok Jall....your optimism is charming....and I'm being sincere.

    However, first of all, any repeal would be at least a year off and Republicans are as much political animals as Democrats. They are not going to want to go back to their electorate and explain why children with pre-existing conditions are no longer covered, why young adults get kicked off their parents insurance, etc. It would be bad politically for them once the bill takes effect. Their only hope was in trying to stop it before.

    Second - You guys talk about the mandate to purchase insurance. That was given to us thanks to the Republicans and the Bluedogs both of who refused to even talk about reform until the public option was off the table.
    I agree that the public option would have been better. We could get rid of the mandate and allow the people to have the public option. THAT is what most Americans wanted in the first place.

    Finally, you can call it defeatist if you want. But anyone who knows politics knows that this is a done deal. The stall tactics can last a few days maybe a week, but its done and the stall tactics are not good faith efforts by the Republicans to do anything other than political posturing.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Ok Jall....your optimism is charming....and I'm being sincere.

    However, first of all, any repeal would be at least a year off and Republicans are as much political animals as Democrats. They are not going to want to go back to their electorate and explain why children with pre-existing conditions are no longer covered, why young adults get kicked off their parents insurance, etc. It would be bad politically for them once the bill takes effect. Their only hope was in trying to stop it before.
    Most of the bill doesn't even take effect for 4 years. It's not like anyone is suddenly going to be missing something if it gets repealed in a year. Plus, I don't think it will get completely repealed. I think parts of it will.

    Second - You guys talk about the mandate to purchase insurance. That was given to us thanks to the Republicans and the Bluedogs both of who refused to even talk about reform until the public option was off the table.
    I agree that the public option would have been better. We could get rid of the mandate and allow the people to have the public option. THAT is what most Americans wanted in the first place.

    Finally, you can call it defeatist if you want. But anyone who knows politics knows that this is a done deal. The stall tactics can last a few days maybe a week, but its done and the stall tactics are not good faith efforts by the Republicans to do anything other than political posturing.
    Anyone who knows politics knows that nothing is ever a done deal.

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    Re: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Like I said, defeatist rhetoric.



    Not true. The mandate to buy private insurance without opening purchase across state lines nullifies the commerce clause justification. That's just one problem with it.



    We've repealed amendments. I think we can get bad legislation repealed, in time.
    Actually, you have an excellent point. If there is no purchasing of insurance across state lines, then the Federal government is out of its jurisdiction.
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    Re: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Most of the bill doesn't even take effect for 4 years. It's not like anyone is suddenly going to be missing something if it gets repealed in a year. Plus, I don't think it will get completely repealed. I think parts of it will.



    Anyone who knows politics knows that nothing is ever a done deal.
    The parts I talked about take effect right away. That's why I doubt the Republicans will actually push repeal. The parts of the bill that are the most controversial are the parts that aren't set to take effect for 4 years, like the insurance mandate.
    You are correct though....nothing is ever a done deal. We have 4 years to get the mandate replaced by a strong public option which would better serve the people of this country. Once the first parts of the bill take effect and people see the benefits, it will be an easier sell, and I expect even some Republicans will support it.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    The parts I talked about take effect right away. That's why I doubt the Republicans will actually push repeal. The parts of the bill that are the most controversial are the parts that aren't set to take effect for 4 years, like the insurance mandate.
    You are correct though....nothing is ever a done deal. We have 4 years to get the mandate replaced by a strong public option which would better serve the people of this country. Once the first parts of the bill take effect and people see the benefits, it will be an easier sell, and I expect even some Republicans will support it.
    I don't think so. It's pretty much a given that their continued incumbency is riding on their opposition to this bill. I think they will continue to oppose it.

    I would prefer a public option but I do not want to see taxing of "cadillac plans" or forced enrollment in the public option.

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    Re: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    I don't think so. It's pretty much a given that their continued incumbency is riding on their opposition to this bill. I think they will continue to oppose it.

    I would prefer a public option but I do not want to see taxing of "cadillac plans" or forced enrollment in the public option.
    I agree that I wouldn't want to see taxing of premium plans either. But I don't think it would require that.

    I DO however, believe in what you would call "forced enrollment". Mainly because we have to find a solution to people overusing the emergency rooms for their healthcare, which is what we have now. That cost is already passed on to the rest of us.
    Give people an option to purchase a premium private insurance plan or the public option. This is not "Free healthcare". It would still require payment and the government would subsidize those making under a certain amount of money.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    How many new bribes will it take to be passed?
    It didn't take much in the way of "bribes" last time... and now that its clearly the 'will of the people', it should be a slam dunk.

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    Re: BREAKING -- Reconciliation bill will have to go back to the House

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Because it's not just a health care bill, its a budget reconciliation bill.
    Which means that student loan should be included because...?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    But you do know that the obstruction is not going to actually accomplish anything right? How does that benefit the country?
    You seem to be operating from the perspective that only the passage of legislation can benefit from the country. That's the problem. From the Republican perspective, the status quo is preferable to the proposal that the Dems have put forward. Accordingly, it's entirely sensible for them to oppose the proposal.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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