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Thread: Republican or Democratic Party's Waterloo?

  1. #11
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    Re: Republican or Democratic Party's Waterloo?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    1) Lots of young, healthy people deliberately skip health insurance because they think they are invincible or something. They get sick or injured, and you end up paying for it in higher premiums and higher taxes. The mandate makes them chip something in.

    2) The poor use the ER as a safety net. The ER is very expensive. A GP visit is cheaper than an ER visit. Wouldn't you rather pay $200 for a bottle of pills for the "welfare queen" who gets pneumonia instead of $3000 when that person's condition deteriorates into a serious condition and they go to the ICU? I know, you don't want to pay for anything, but the alternative is to swipe credit cards before you treat people and turn them away or let them bleed out if it declines.

    3) You can make arguments about "abusing" welfare, but it's a lot harder to make that argument about health care. Do you think people go to the doctor just for kicks? Get random organ transplants for fun? No, they go when they're sick.

    4) A healthier workforce is a more productive workforce.

    You may not agree with the reasoning, but saying there isn't a reason is intellectually dishonest.
    And more and more businesses will be forced to close because they cannot afford the new higher costs!! Effectively killing the private sector.


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  2. #12
    Sage

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    Re: Republican or Democratic Party's Waterloo?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    This bill is expected to reduce the deficit. So, it's a tiny dent in the financial problem. What most people just assume is that paying for the healthcare of the poor will cost more money, but that isn't necessarily true. You already pay for the healthcare of the poor. Your insurance company gets overbilled to help cover uninsured patients who hit the ER. (the ER can't turn them away) We also spend a fair number of tax dollars helping prop up hospitals. This method is inefficient, the ER is a really expensive way to care for anything. Health insurance is cheaper, so now we're buying the poor some of that.

    Magic bullet? Nope. A hundred billion-ish saved over a decade isn't exactly going to turn this ship around, but I wont be complaining.

    The deficit will come down some when unemployment comes down. People will eventually be getting back to work and start paying taxes instead of collecting unemployment. Again, just another dent.

    We've also got two wars to end and a lot of waste to cut out, but we can do that without cutting out programs that can literally be life-or-death sometimes.

    And whose idea was this massive corn subsidy, anyway? We grow so much corn that we've started trying to turn it back into fuel, and I wonder what incalculable sum has been spent on healthcare due to the corn syrup we put in everything.



    .
    I think a lot of people think that the numbers being thrown around about the cost of this problem are off by a lot. An example is the point you mentioned, that the poor already have insurance we pay in another way. That is only true when people go to the emergency room. Also subsidies in this bill go to people who make up to $88K per year, hardly poor.

    It is also intellectually dishonest in my view for congress to say that tax increases go to pay for a specific program. We need to raise more taxes in general, so if these taxes are a good idea they should have been passed to reduce the deficit.

    As to the two wars, I was strongly opposed to adding troops to Afghanistan and we will be out of Iraq by next year.

    Farm subsidies is just another way we spend money we do not have. Congress is unable to fix the problem because reducing spending means taking away someone's goodies.

    My sense is that the public has finally woken to the fact that we can't afford all this stuff, even if individually you would like to be able to spend for it.

    The anger may be a frustration that we are in a mess and don't seem to have a way to get out of it. So whether it is the coffee party or the tea party it is telling both sides this isn't working!

  3. #13
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    Re: Republican or Democratic Party's Waterloo?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bassman View Post
    And more and more businesses will be forced to close because they cannot afford the new higher costs!! Effectively killing the private sector.
    When that happens you be sure to come back here to report on it for us, ok? This seems a stretch since businesses with less than 50 employees will not be forced to buy health insurance.
    Thank You Barack Obama for Restoring Honor To The Presidency.
    President Obama will rank as one of our greatest presidents!

  4. #14
    Sage

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    Re: Republican or Democratic Party's Waterloo?

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post
    When that happens you be sure to come back here to report on it for us, ok? This seems a stretch since businesses with less than 50 employees will not be forced to buy health insurance.
    Did you stop and think about the firm that has 55 employees today. Just a guess that they will figure out how to turn that into 49.

  5. #15
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    Re: Republican or Democratic Party's Waterloo?

    Quote Originally Posted by Politics101 View Post
    Unfortunately, I think you're right. Entitlement programs are almost impossible to cut once they've been provided. Liberty lost is freedom very difficult to regain. Socialism won big time after ObamaCare passed into law. And America will be crippled because of it.
    ACtually its more Facism. They did NOTHING to lower the COST of health care.

    What they DID do is RAISE the cost of health care and gave everyone insurance ...... thus raising the stock price for insurance companies. They will STILL rape all of us.

    They did the OPPOSITE of what was needed.
    CORPORATE GREED AND UNION GREED
    DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS
    DESTROYING THE BEST OF AMERICA ONE DAY AT A TIME

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