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Thread: Obama Socialist Health care program....

  1. #251
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    Re: Obama Socialist Health care program....

    Quote Originally Posted by Z3n View Post
    Patriotism is the easiest and most convenient way ever invented to rally people behind a cause. IE) Nazi Germany-- I'm "German" before I'm poor. People have a penchant for being part of things larger than themselves, and if you're a patriot, who's gonna mess with you? USA!USA!USA!
    Patriot is a state of being.. when it becomes either movement or excuse it is inherently dangerous.. this is why you heard so much about it from the progressives last Sunday!

    (damn you're reasonable for a lib )
    CROUCH DOWN AND LICK THE HAND THAT FEEDS YOU; MAY YOUR CHAINS WEIGH LIGHTLY UPON YOU; AND MAY PROSPERITY FORGET THAT YE WERE MY COUNTRYMEN. -SAMUEL ADAMS

  2. #252
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    Re: Obama Socialist Health care program....

    Patriotism is an ideological label that easily discredits people's stances by just dismissing them as someone who isn't pro-status quo and pro-everything nationalist
    Don't tread on me= Don't tread on my corporate masters

  3. #253
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    Re: Obama Socialist Health care program....

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    I dont know...are you willing to be respectful of other peoples opinions and respect them even if you disagree with them? I mean...the other asshole cant...but...Im willing to have a go...

    I dont know...maybe you havent seen my comments...I am NOT opposed to health care...Im opposed to giving the federal government a blank check and responsibility to manage healthcare...especially as they have done such a DISMAL job of running EVERYTHING they have been responsible for running. Im opposed to a 13.5 trillion dollar national debt and climbing. Im opposed to orchestrated bribery of government officials BY government officials. Im opposed to a 'health care bill' with hundreds of billions of dollars of non health care related garbage...more proof that the fed cant be trusted.

    State run? sure...great idea. Apparently places like Hawaii do it successfully and without a glut of federal dollars. But federally run universally healthcare? Yep...you'd have to be on the crack pipe to think thats a GOOD IDEA.

    what he said...PROPS Vance

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    Re: Obama Socialist Health care program....

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    Bill they have not won ****.......Don't give up my friend.........As a great Yankee once said, "Its not ovver until its over."
    ....It was over when the North won kid.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  5. #255
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    Re: Obama Socialist Health care program....

    Quote Originally Posted by ConservaBill View Post
    The Constitution is a list of things the federal government is ALLOWED to... so ... so your concept of the constitution dead wrong..

    1. It is not provided for in the consitution so it is a State issue.. simple enough for ya' I could dumb it down a little if necessary..

    2. General defense... gee you could at LEAST read the first paragragh!

    ...........GO FISH!
    Er, funny, I thought we had some amendments that listed things the government couldn't do?

    I'm going to assume you mean COMMON defense, which is in the same sentence as General Welfare.

    I'm going with health care easily as part of general welfare.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

  6. #256
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    Re: Obama Socialist Health care program....

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Er, funny, I thought we had some amendments that listed things the government couldn't do?
    The bill of rights protects certain rights from actions by the government in regard to powers that it may or may not have.

    The 10th amendment states that powers not granted to the government rest with the states and/or the people.
    Thus, if a power is not given to the federal government, it remains with the states/people.
    That, alone, necessitates that the federal government is limited to the powers specified in the Constitution.

    I'm going to assume you mean COMMON defense, which is in the same sentence as General Welfare. I'm going with health care easily as part of general welfare.
    Article I Sec 8:1 gives the power to tax and spend, not create legislation that provides for the common defense or the general welfare -- the 17 clauses that follow do that.
    In those clauses, there's no power to do anything with health care (or education or retirement or...)

    See:
    http://www.debatepolitics.com/govern...post1058615579
    Last edited by Goobieman; 03-25-10 at 01:26 PM.

  7. #257
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    Re: Obama Socialist Health care program....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    ^^^

    Initially I thought it was just straight ideology pushing this ... then when he pulled out the public option and rolled over so easily on it, I knew it no longer was ideology because ideology would require Obama to go to the mat for a public option. It's about destroying the system to then require it to be rebuilt. Now is the system "capitalism" or is it "free market" or is it the entire country as some of the more rabid of the Republicans / Conservatives claim? Dunno yet --- but if this was really about the people, and their health and health care costs this bill would not go through nor would Obama be pushing it.

    Only thing left is burning it to the ground and then saying, "Well, we have to rebuild it now", and he or the cronies that follow him, get to rebuild this country - which has been the ultimate wet dream of Progressives since the early 20th century.
    The majority of health care is already paid out by the government.

    Therefore we cannot with any accuracy or integrety label our system as a market system.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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