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Thread: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

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    Cool Re: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

    I don't know shouldn't preventing complete global economic meltdown count as a necessary cost? I don't like everything about it but when facing the alternative the price doesn't seem so bad. Also the debt to gdp ratio is less than that in many traditionally stable countries in the past and they experienced no collapse.

    Also I don't remember hearing about any feasible economic plan materializing from the current government to expand the government in order to address joblessness. Unless I am grossly misinformed that's made up.

    Concern, yes.
    Outrage, no.

    Our country is in a very different situation that during the Bush years.

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    Re: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

    Quote Originally Posted by niftydrifty View Post
    Maybe those people believe that there will be benefit to the cost, when there wasn't one before.

    It's not a matter of amount only, it's how it is being used.
    Translation:
    Liberals/Dems dont mind deficits, no matter how big, so long as their guys are charge, doing something they like.

    We knew this, of course -- good to see that someone finally admitted it.

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    Re: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

    Perspective:

    The Treasury Department said Wednesday that the February deficit totaled $220.9 billion, 14 percent higher than the previous record set in February of last year.
    This is one-month figure is more than the deficits in each of FY2001, 2002 2007 and is almost as much as in 2006

    The deficit through the first five months of this budget year totals $651.6 billion, 10.5 percent higher than a year ago.
    This five-month figure is 42% greater than the highest FY deficit under GWB (FY2008, $458.5B)

    The Obama administration is projecting that the deficit for the 2010 budget year will hit an all-time high of $1.56 trillion, surpassing last year's $1.4 trillion total.
    This two-year figure exceeds the total budget deficts for the GWB administration.

    But, the Obamanation will give Him a pass.

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    Re: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Translation:
    Liberals/Dems dont mind deficits, no matter how big, so long as their guys are charge, doing something they like.

    We knew this, of course -- good to see that someone finally admitted it.
    And conservative/republicansare any different?

    I dont recall much in the way of Republicans deploring the Reagan era deficits.

    Nor was there much complaining about the Bush II era deficits

    What I do recall is Dick Cheney stating

    "You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter"

    And they didnt for the vast majority of conservative/republicans as long as Bush was in offfice, doing stuff they liked

    Very very few people are against deficit spending period regardless of who is in office (true libertarians are one such group)
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    Re: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

    Quote Originally Posted by SE102 View Post
    I don't know shouldn't preventing complete global economic meltdown count as a necessary cost? I don't like everything about it but when facing the alternative the price doesn't seem so bad. Also the debt to gdp ratio is less than that in many traditionally stable countries in the past and they experienced no collapse.

    Also I don't remember hearing about any feasible economic plan materializing from the current government to expand the government in order to address joblessness. Unless I am grossly misinformed that's made up.

    Concern, yes.
    Outrage, no.

    Our country is in a very different situation that during the Bush years.
    What is it in the Obama economic plan that has prevented a worldwide economic collapse? What exactly is the debt to GDP ratio with the Obama spending?

    You seem to have had a outrage over the Bush deficits which until the recession hit in December 2007 were a much smaller percentage of GDP than anything Obama is proposing?

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    Re: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    And conservative/republicansare any different?
    "He did it too" isnt a defense.
    I dont recall much in the way of Republicans deploring the Reagan era deficits.
    You didnt pay attention to the right people or look in the right places.
    Nor was there much complaining about the Bush II era deficits
    See above.
    And they didnt for the vast majority of conservative/republicans as long as Bush was in offfice, doing stuff they liked
    "He did it too" isnt a defense.
    Very very few people are against deficit spending period regardless of who is in office (true libertarians are one such group)
    So you agree that the pass given thus far to The Obama by the Dems, and the Dem criticisms laid upon GWB for his (comparitively tiny) deficits were nothing but partisan in nature.
    Thanks.

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    Re: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    And conservative/republicansare any different?

    I dont recall much in the way of Republicans deploring the Reagan era deficits.

    Nor was there much complaining about the Bush II era deficits

    What I do recall is Dick Cheney stating

    "You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter"

    And they didnt for the vast majority of conservative/republicans as long as Bush was in offfice, doing stuff they liked

    Very very few people are against deficit spending period regardless of who is in office (true libertarians are one such group)

    You keep hammering what you call the Reagan deficits when the reality is it was a joint deficit between a Republican President and a Democrat controlled House of Representatives where the spending bills basically originate. Can you distinguish between what Reagan proposed and what the Congress approved?

    Do you realize that govt. revenue doubled during the Reagan years and that more than paid for the defense buildup? Do you realize that the President of the United States doesn't have a line item veto? How much of the spending was attached to tax cut legislation or military buildup?

    All that defense spending destroyed the Soviet Union and left us with a peace dividend in the 90's. How much more spending would there be today had the Soviet Union still be engaged in the Cold War?

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    Re: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Translation:
    Liberals/Dems dont mind deficits, no matter how big, so long as their guys are charge, doing something they like.

    We knew this, of course -- good to see that someone finally admitted it.
    Why look for Republican approval? The only fiscally responsible president in thirty years was a Democrat and he didn't receive an iota of thanks from the right. And no Republican president has ever received any real amount of blame for fiscal irresponsibility.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 03-11-10 at 06:14 PM.
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    Re: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Why look for Republican approval? The only fiscally responsible president in thirty years was a Democrat and he didn't receive an iota of thanks from the right. And no Republican president has ever received any real amount of blame for fiscal irresponsibility.
    Really? Only fiscally responsible President in 30 years was a Democrat? Now who would that be? You want to give Clinton credit for something he didn't do other than cash in the defense dividend left him by Reagan. The U.S. Treasury site gives an entirely different picture of the Clinton years as does the Congressional record. Simple question for you, Clinton shutdown the govt. a couple times. Did Clinton shutdown the govt. because the GOP increased his budgets or decreased them?

    Clinton had close to a balanced budget because of using SS funds but of course those that want to praise Clinton ignore that reality. Then when asked what legislation did Clinton propose and sign that led to any budget surplus of course we get silence because there wasn't any.

    So you can make the claim over and over again but the fact is your view of the Clinton Administration accomplishments never really happened although like all Democrats he takes credit for the work of others and places blame for his own actions or inactions.

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    Re: Obama Deficits Continue to rise

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Really? Only fiscally responsible President in 30 years was a Democrat? Now who would that be? You want to give Clinton credit for something he didn't do other than cash in the defense dividend left him by Reagan. The U.S. Treasury site gives an entirely different picture of the Clinton years as does the Congressional record. Simple question for you, Clinton shutdown the govt. a couple times. Did Clinton shutdown the govt. because the GOP increased his budgets or decreased them?

    Clinton had close to a balanced budget because of using SS funds but of course those that want to praise Clinton ignore that reality. Then when asked what legislation did Clinton propose and sign that led to any budget surplus of course we get silence because there wasn't any.

    So you can make the claim over and over again but the fact is your view of the Clinton Administration accomplishments never really happened although like all Democrats he takes credit for the work of others and places blame for his own actions or inactions.
    I'm sorry, but I don't speak hyperbole. "Shut down the government?"

    Anyway, while duty obliges me to take assertions that Clinton's economic policy was not the catalyst for the mid-late 90s economic boom seriously, you'd have to make a stronger argument for it; what you have now are vague generalizations.

    I'm also not going to argue whether or not Clinton had a surplus, so you can stop right there; I believe he did, but if you want to say he didn't, I don't care. I said he was fiscally responsible in that the economic bills he passed did not exceed fundamental limits on available capital.

    Let's see what fact check has to say:


    FactCheck.org: Were Clinton's policies responsible for the 1990s' economic growth?



    Hm. Doesn't mention Reagan. However:

    Clinton's major contribution was pushing through the 1993 budget bill, which began to reduce what had become a chronic string of federal deficits. Republicans denounced it as the "largest tax increase in history," though in fact it was not a record and also contained some cuts in projected spending. Republican Rep. Newt Gingrich predicted: "The tax increase will kill jobs and lead to a recession, and the recession will force people off of work and onto unemployment and will actually increase the deficit." But just the opposite happened. Fears of inflation waned and interest rates fell, making money cheaper to borrow for homes, cars and investment. What had been a slow economic recovery turned into a roaring boom, bringing in so much unanticipated tax revenue from rising incomes and stock-market gains that the government actually was running record surpluses by the time Clinton left office.
    Reducing deficits. Interesting.

    Almost sounds like fiscal conservatism.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 03-11-10 at 06:36 PM.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

    St. Benedict

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