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Thread: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

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    Re: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

    The Republicans had every chance to propose viable changes to health care.

    All they wanted to do was protect doctors and insurance companies and make incremental changes which would have cost more in the long run than Obama's comprehensive change will.

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    Re: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    The Republicans had every chance to propose viable changes to health care.

    All they wanted to do was protect doctors and insurance companies and make incremental changes which would have cost more in the long run than Obama's comprehensive change will.
    Bah, they didn't even want to do that, or they would have... I know, medicare part D, but wasn't that really just a giveaway to big pharma?

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    Re: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

    Quote Originally Posted by NoJingoLingo View Post
    Bah, they didn't even want to do that, or they would have... I know, medicare part D, but wasn't that really just a giveaway to big pharma?
    Moreso than the current proposal?

    Part D was called a giveaway because it would be boosting consumption of prescription drugs. I don't see how the current proposals wouldn't have the same effect, but on steroids.
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    Re: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Wait, so what you're saying is the Democrats knew the Republicans wouldn't vote for the bill, but gave into them repeatedly anyway because they didn't want sole responsibility for a disastrous bill.

    But also that Democrats think it's the greatest thing ever and WOULD want sole credit.

    I'm confused.

    HR3200, the original bill with a public option, was decent. It wouldn't fix all of our problems, but it wouldn't cause many either. The latest one, I believe, just isn't going to accomplish its goals. Worse, it will probably make things harder for families in certain income bands.

    But then again, I'm against this bill because it's too far to the right, not too far to the left. So take that as you will.

    edit: And if this bill truly is "catastrophic," as you think it will be, it will be the noose that the Democratic Party hangs itself with regardless of the number of Republican votes. Do you really think two or three GOP votes is going to make people think this was a Republican bill that screwed things up? This is Obama's legacy, for good or for bad.
    Nope. Democrats have the votes to do what they want. They have no need for an opposition party to sign on. The problem they have right now is some of their own party are not willing to screw the american people.

    If it was so great they would not have this issue.
    Thank you

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    Re: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    The Republicans had every chance to propose viable changes to health care.

    All they wanted to do was protect doctors and insurance companies and make incremental changes which would have cost more in the long run than Obama's comprehensive change will.
    This tells me you did not see or hear or ignored the recent "healthcare summit". They came with their game on and eroded much of the uninformed support by simply reading whats in the current bill and proposing alternatives.
    Thank you

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    Re: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    Moreso than the current proposal?

    Part D was called a giveaway because it would be boosting consumption of prescription drugs. I don't see how the current proposals wouldn't have the same effect, but on steroids.
    That's not the only reason it is a giveaway.
    At least there is an attempt to pay for the current Bill. Medicare part D is a complete and total giveaway. So yes, more so than the current Bill. That's not to say that the mandate isn't a giveaway to insurance but I suspect that will be taken out or overturned...

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    Re: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

    Quote Originally Posted by akyron View Post
    Nope. Democrats have the votes to do what they want. They have no need for an opposition party to sign on. The problem they have right now is some of their own party are not willing to screw the american people.

    If it was so great they would not have this issue.
    So you don't believe the fear-mongering by the repubs has anything to do with it? If it's not effective then why is fear-mongering used (by both parties)?

    If you can scare the dems who got elected in conservative districts, and if those dems are more concerned with re-election in those districts than doing what's right then do you think that might have an impact on their vote for the Bill?

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    Re: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

    Quote Originally Posted by akyron View Post
    This tells me you did not see or hear or ignored the recent "healthcare summit". They came with their game on and eroded much of the uninformed support by simply reading whats in the current bill and proposing alternatives.
    And where the alternatives are reasonable they are being used but still no repubs...

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    Re: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

    *cough* PUBLIC OPTION NOW
    Vote John Schnatter (Papa John) 2012!

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    Re: Kucinich willing to cast the vote that kills health reform

    Quote Originally Posted by NoJingoLingo View Post
    That's not the only reason it is a giveaway.
    At least there is an attempt to pay for the current Bill. Medicare part D is a complete and total giveaway. So yes, more so than the current Bill.
    What does the question of whether a program is funded via general revenues have to do with the question of how much money it funnels to an industry? It's entirely irrelevant to whether the program is a "giveaway."

    That's not to say that the mandate isn't a giveaway to insurance but I suspect that will be taken out or overturned...
    Why on earth would they remove one of the last few "cost containment" provisions in the bill? Unless progressives pick up another 50 seats and win the presidency, I don't see it happening.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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