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Thread: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

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    Re: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

    Moderator's Warning:
    Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick WallJust because this is not in the ME forums does not mean that you can be uncivil and constantly attack each other. Stick to the topic and cease with the personal attacks.
    Welfare (Food Stamps, WIC, etc...) are not entitlements. They are taxpayer funded handouts and shouldn't be called entitlements at all. Social Security and Veteran's benefits are 'Entitlements' because the people receiving them are entitled to them. They were earned and paid for by the recipients.

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    Re: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoplite View Post
    Originally Posted by Goobieman
    Not when the people you're fighting deliberatly hise among those inoocent people.
    So our solution is to shoot down anything that moves?
    You deliberately miss the point.
    By hiding among civilians, the terrorists enrure that civilians will die, in large numbers. This is an intentional act by the terrorists so that pro-terrorist anti-Israeli people such as yourself can try to villity the Israelis for having the nerve to defend themselves.
    Quote:
    Given that the nature of the opponent necessitates that civilians will die, there's no way to stop cvilians from dying.
    Bull****, there is no cause, NONE, which requires murder like that.
    Collateral damage is an unavoiable horror of war, especially when one side deliberatly puts civilians in harms way. The murderers here are the terrorists, not those that target the terrorists.
    Quote:
    Why havent you been discussing how terrible the terrorists are for hiding among innocent people they know will get killed?
    Because I assumed you were intelligent enough to figure out that I dont condone that and my support is with the Palestinian people, not Hamas or Hezbollah.
    You DO condine that in that you have yet to admit that the terrorists are at fault for all the civilian deaths or villify them for it.
    Instead, you cling to the idea that though the terrorists are the cause for the civilian deaths, the Israelis are to blame for it.

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    Re: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoplite View Post
    Maybe I'm just not as "with it" as to be ok with shooting unarmed people...
    Palestinian civilians are dying in droves at the hands of the IDF for no reason other than the terrorists hide among said civilians, thereby forcing the Israelis to attack them while they do so.

    Palestinians hide behind their children, and then wonder why their children die.

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    Re: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Degreez View Post
    I know what his point is, while you completely disregarded mine. The Israeli settlements are illegal under international law, that is not that difficult to comprehend.
    What tenet or particular part of 'international law' forbids settling land that you won in a war you did not start - especially once the state that lost the land officially ceded it away?

    I ask because there are a great number of Germans that would like to see the whole of Prussia restored.

  5. #45
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    Re: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    It doesn't legitimize shooting civilians, and civilians were not being shot at.
    So a thousand people just died from heart failure?

    Terrorists were being shot at as a practice of the undeniable right to self defense of the Israeli citizens living in Southern Israel.
    That the Hamas terrorists have chosen to risk their own civilians by launching rockets from their bedrooms is tragic and disgusting, but unfortunately that's an integral part of fighting terrorism in hostile lands these days, and we can only try and minimize the casualties by dropping leaflets and phoning homes, as Israel did.(=Fact)
    Israel has decades of experience with terrorism, enough to know that THIS is not how you fight an enemy like Hamas.

    So to sum that up, civilians were not shot at, they were standing next to terrorists who were legitimately shot at.
    Then why did the civilians get hit instead?

    Keep in mind, some 250 actual Hamas fighters died in the fighting, over a thousand civilians died. So even if each Hamas fighter was using two human shields, you're still short.

    Objective fulfilled, and there has been the greatest calm in decades around southern Israel in the recent months.
    Really?

    [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rocket_and_mortar_attacks_in_Israel_in_200 9]List of Palestinian rocket attacks on Israel, 2009 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
    [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rocket_and_mortar_attacks_in_Israel_in_200 8]List of Palestinian rocket attacks on Israel, 2008 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

    That doesnt seem like "great calm", that seems more like "business as usual."
    I'm Done

    See my last post

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    Re: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoplite View Post
    Then why did the civilians get hit instead?
    Instead?
    Dont you mean 'at the same time as the terrorists that were the targets of the IDF attacks'?
    THAT answer should be obvious.

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    Re: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoplite View Post
    So a thousand people just died from heart failure?
    I said:
    "civilians were not shot at, they were standing next to terrorists who were legitimately shot at."

    You didn't miss it, so the reason for the above statement of yours is unknown to me.
    Israel has decades of experience with terrorism, enough to know that THIS is not how you fight an enemy like Hamas.
    That's exactly how you maintain the defense of your civilians.
    By removing the terrroists' ability to do them harm, if only for a temporary period.
    Then why did the civilians get hit instead?
    What do you mean, instead?
    Terrorists were killed by the hundreds.
    Keep in mind, some 250 actual Hamas fighters died in the fighting, over a thousand civilians died. So even if each Hamas fighter was using two human shields, you're still short.
    Why would I keep in mind something that is not true?

    The highest the figures go reach around 950 dead civilians and more than 300 dead combatants.
    That's not really over a thousand civilians.
    The IDF's figures, the entity with the top capabilities to gather intelligence from the Gaza Strip in the entire world, places the figures at 295 dead civilians and over 900 dead combatants.

    I doubt the variety of organizations that have taken the job of collecting the required intelligence were able to separate a terrorist from a civilian when they're both wearing civilian clothes.
    Actually it seems like a great calm to me.
    Around 210 rockets in 3rd of December 2008-26th of December 2008, and 5 rockets in the entire of December 2009.

    210 sure do seem to be more than 5.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

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    Re: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Instead?
    Dont you mean 'at the same time as the terrorists that were the targets of the IDF attacks'?
    THAT answer should be obvious.
    So for every bullet that killed a Hamas fighter, that same bullet killed FOUR civilians as well?
    I'm Done

    See my last post

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    Re: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoplite View Post
    So for every bullet that killed a Hamas fighter, that same bullet killed FOUR civilians as well?
    More like the opposite.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

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    Re: Israel-Palestine Talks Run Into Brick Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoplite View Post
    So for every bullet that killed a Hamas fighter, that same bullet killed FOUR civilians as well?
    This is simple nonsense on your part; it illustrates a willful attempt to misunderstand the points put to you for the sole purpose of not having to admit that the terrorists, not the Israelis, are responsible for the 'murder' of the 'innocent' civllians in Gaza.

    -Every- civilian that died while a terrorist hid among them was 'murdered' by the terrorists, not the Israelis.

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