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CNN poll: 52% say Obama doesn't deserve reelection in 2012

USA-1 said:
It wasn't just that. The economy was in horrible shape, inflation was out of control and we had just gone through the first Arab oil embargo. Carter inherited a mess, but not as big a mess as Obama.
Do you people really believe a republican would be doing any better right now? After all they did get us into this recession.
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Yes, I do believe a Republican would be doing better for no Republican I know would have surrounded himself with the leftwing elite booksmart, street stupid liberal economists whose vision of this country is a European socialist model that is a failure.

The "mess" that Obama "inherited" is the mess he helped create in the Congress. I am tired of this inherited argument. Obama has made the problem worse by implementing a stimulus plan that stimulated nothing but bigger govt. and pet Democratic constituent groups.
 
Conservative said:
Yes, I do believe a Republican would be doing better for no Republican I know would have surrounded himself with the leftwing elite booksmart, street stupid liberal economists whose vision of this country is a European socialist model that is a failure.

The "mess" that Obama "inherited" is the mess he helped create in the Congress. I am tired of this inherited argument. Obama has made the problem worse by implementing a stimulus plan that stimulated nothing but bigger govt. and pet Democratic constituent groups.
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That's funny. The economy was on the verge of collapse when Obama took office. The housing and financial sectors were in ruins. The standard republican response of cutting taxes for the rich would not have helped one bit. I am glad you let Bush off the hook for the disaster he helped create. More so than Obama who was just a lowly senator.
 
USA-1 said:
That's funny. The economy was on the verge of collapse when Obama took office. The housing and financial sectors were in ruins. The standard republican response of cutting taxes for the rich would not have helped one bit. I am glad you let Bush off the hook for the disaster he helped create. More so than Obama who was just a lowly senator.
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You will never get it, by personal design. For to admit you are wrong would force you to admit that the ideology that you support has been wrong. Your ego will never allow you to admit you are wrong on any issue.

We have three equal branches of govt. as created by our Constitution. Now it is easier placing blame on the Executive Branch vs. putting the blame on your own Representatives. Obama was in the Senate, thus the Legislative Branch, and helped create this "mess' that you claim he inherited. That is intellectual dishonesty on your part. One would think that a person carrying the standard for the Democratic Party wouldn't be called a lowly Senator and would carry much more weight than that.

Obama and the Democrat Congress was more concerned about regaining the WH than doing their job. We are paying the price for that today.
 
USA-1 said:
It wasn't just that. The economy was in horrible shape, inflation was out of control and we had just gone through the first Arab oil embargo. Carter inherited a mess, but not as big a mess as Obama.
Do you people really believe a republican would be doing any better right now? After all they did get us into this recession.
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Carter inherited a mess ??

You guys sound like a broken record.... :roll:

Carter made a shamble out of the country and Obama is following in his footsteps.
 
Gill said:
Carter inherited a mess ??

You guys sound like a broken record.... :roll:

Carter made a shamble out of the country and Obama is following in his footsteps.
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I lived through it. Inflation was so bad during Nixon's term, he implemented the Wage and Price Freeze. That was fun. Gas prices first skyrocketed during Nixon's presidency when the first Arab oil embargo occurred. And Ford tried to stop inflation by printing up WIN buttons. Whip Inflation Now. And Carter got blamed for it all. He even got blamed for high interest rates even though he had nothing to do with setting interest rates. The GDP grew every year under Carter and there was no recession. There was no financial sector collapse and no recession.

Carter won because the economy sucked.

You guys are just in denial. Nixon also tried to get universal healthcare that would have been more costly than Obamas.
Inflation by month
1968 3.6 4.0 3.9 3.9 3.9 4.2 4.5 4.5 4.5 4.7 4.7 4.7 4.2
1969 4.4 4.7 5.2 5.5 5.5 5.5 5.4 5.7 5.7 5.7 5.9 6.2 5.5
1970 6.2 6.1 5.8 6.1 6.0 6.0 6.0 5.4 5.7 5.6 5.6 5.6 5.7
1971 5.3 5.0 4.7 4.2 4.4 4.6 4.4 4.6 4.1 3.8 3.3 3.3 4.4
1972 3.3 3.5 3.5 3.5 3.2 2.7 2.9 2.9 3.2 3.4 3.7 3.4 3.2
1973 3.6 3.9 4.6 5.1 5.5 6.0 5.7 7.4 7.4 7.8 8.3 8.7 6.2
1974 9.4 10.0 10.4 10.1 10.7 10.9 11.5 10.9 11.9 12.1 12.2 12.3 11.0
1975 11.8 11.2 10.3 10.2 9.5 9.4 9.7 8.6 7.9 7.4 7.4 6.9 9.1
1976 6.7 6.3 6.1 6.0 6.2 6.0 5.4 5.7 5.5 5.5 4.9 4.9 5.8
1977 5.2 5.9 6.4 7.0 6.7 6.9 6.8 6.6 6.6 6.4 6.7 6.7 6.5
1978 6.8 6.4 6.6 6.5 7.0 7.4 7.7 7.8 8.3 8.9 8.9 9.0 7.6
1979 9.3 9.9 10.1 10.5 10.9 10.9 11.3 11.8 12.2 12.1 12.6 13.3 11.3
 
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Reno J said:
Yuk it up Conservatives and have a great time. What will happen in latter 2012 might just surprise you. Certainly you don't have any bright stars in your offstage assortment of perennial politicians.
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Says you, its a long time until 2012 my left wing friend.........
 
USA-1 said:
I lived through it. Inflation was so bad during Nixon's term, he implemented the Wage and Price Freeze. That was fun. Gas prices first skyrocketed during Nixon's presidency when the first Arab oil embargo occurred. And Ford tried to stop inflation by printing up WIN buttons. Whip Inflation Now. And Carter got blamed for it all. He even got blamed for high interest rates even though he had nothing to do with setting interest rates.

Carter won because the economy sucked.

You guys are just in denial. Nixon also tried to get universal healthcare that would have been more costly than Obamas.
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I also lived through the horrible Carter days. It was impossible to buy a house because the mortgage rate was 20% in 1980. And you actually try and claim that he had no hand in it???

A WIN button??? That beats Carter advice that we should all wear sweaters in the house. :doh

And if possible, he's been a worse ex-president than he was as president.
 
1980
Announcement Date Index Month Index Value Just One Click = Current Mortgage Rate Charts





13-Jan-81 Dec-80 13.15
11-Dec-80 Nov-80 12.85
10-Nov-80 Oct-80 12.31
10-Oct-80 Sep-80 12
11-Sep-80 Aug-80 11.89
11-Aug-80 Jul-80 12.23
11-Jul-80 Jun-80 12.88
11-Jun-80 May-80 13.74
21-May-80 Apr-80 13.21
7-May-80 Mar-80 12.56
7-Apr-80 Feb-80 12.3
3-Apr-80 Jan-80 11.78
 
Gill said:
I also lived through the horrible Carter days. It was impossible to buy a house because the mortgage rate was 20% in 1980. And you actually try and claim that he had no hand in it???

A WIN button??? That beats Carter advice that we should all wear sweaters in the house. :doh

And if possible, he's been a worse ex-president than he was as president.
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Carter had no hand in setting interest rates. Absolutely none. Paul Volcker of the FED set interest rates high to defeat inflation. And mortgage rates were never 20%. It sure was a better strategy than setting mortgage rates artificially low and destroying the housing sector..
Reagans first term was worse than Carters.

table1.gif
 
liblady said:
1980
Announcement Date Index Month Index Value Just One Click = Current Mortgage Rate Charts





13-Jan-81 Dec-80 13.15
11-Dec-80 Nov-80 12.85
10-Nov-80 Oct-80 12.31
10-Oct-80 Sep-80 12
11-Sep-80 Aug-80 11.89
11-Aug-80 Jul-80 12.23
11-Jul-80 Jun-80 12.88
11-Jun-80 May-80 13.74
21-May-80 Apr-80 13.21
7-May-80 Mar-80 12.56
7-Apr-80 Feb-80 12.3
3-Apr-80 Jan-80 11.78
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So he was lying about paying 20% for a mortgage?

Typical.
 
USA-1 said:
So he was lying about paying 20% for a mortgage?

Typical.
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Your apology is accepted.

Looming Interest Rates Make You Wish For Jimmy Carter

Jimmy Carter's presidency nearly crippled this nation. With mortgage interest rates in the 20% range our economy was on the verge of collapse.
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For those who think that low interest rates will never end, the 1950's should be consulted. During August of 1955, interest rates for lending were 3.25% as well. Over time, they rose steadily to 10% in 1973 under President Nixon and topped out at over 20% at the end of President Carter's term
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.

Volcker was Carter's second appointment to the Fed. His first appointment was G. William Miller. Under Miller, the CPI went from 4.9% in 1976 to 13.3% in 1979. Miller was Carter's first mistake. His next mistake was not allowing Volcker, a Nixon holdover, to run the Fed as it should have been.

Volcker did not clamp down on the money supply until after the 1980 election. Before that, Carter wouldn't allow Volcker to implement a tight money policy.

Carter was a mistake and a knee jerk reaction by the voters, just as Obama was in 2008.
 
USA-1 said:
Reagans first term was worse than Carters.
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USA-1 said:
I will stop blaming Bush when you acknowledge the fact that Obama inherited the worst economy since the Great Depression.
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Is it necessary for me to post the definition of "hypocrisy"???

I don't, because the two quotes above define it perfectly.
 
Gill said:
Is it necessary for me to post the definition of "hypocrisy"???

I don't, because the two quotes above define it perfectly.
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Only in your world of denial.

Carter inherited a mess from Nixon/Ford and Reagan inherited a mess from Carter just as Obama inherited a mess from Bush. The facts speak for themselves.


Are you still claiming you mortgage rates were 20% under Carter?
 
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USA-1 said:
Only in your world of denial.
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Gotcha....

Reagan is responsible for Carters economic mess, but Obama is not responsible for the one we have now....

Yeah, keep telling yourself that. You might find someone to buy it.
 
Gill said:
Gotcha....

Reagan is responsible for Carters economic mess, but Obama is not responsible for the one we have now....

Yeah, keep telling yourself that. You might find someone to buy it.
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I never said Reagan was responsible for the mess he inherited, just as Carter was not responsible for the mess Nixon/Ford handed him. Understand now?
 
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Gill said:
Your apology is accepted.



.

Volcker was Carter's second appointment to the Fed. His first appointment was G. William Miller. Under Miller, the CPI went from 4.9% in 1976 to 13.3% in 1979. Miller was Carter's first mistake. His next mistake was not allowing Volcker, a Nixon holdover, to run the Fed as it should have been.

Volcker did not clamp down on the money supply until after the 1980 election. Before that, Carter wouldn't allow Volcker to implement a tight money policy.

Carter was a mistake and a knee jerk reaction by the voters, just as Obama was in 2008.
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really? prove 20% rates.
 
liblady said:
really? prove 20% rates.
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I was off one year. It took Reagan and Volcker a couple of years to get it down and I bought my first house for 12% in the mid 1980s.
The federal funds rate, which had averaged 11.2% in 1979, was raised by Volcker to a peak of 20% in June 1981. The prime rate rose to 21.5% in '81 as well.
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[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volcker]Paul Volcker - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]



Any more questions???
 
USA-1 said:
I never said Reagan was responsible for the mess he inherited, just as Carter was not responsible for the mess Nixon/Ford handed him. Understand now?
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Now who's lying ??
 
liblady said:
really? prove 20% rates.
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As Jimmy Carter stepped before the television cameras in the East Room of the White House last Friday, his task was not just to proclaim another new anti-inflation program but to calm a national alarm that had begun to border on panic. Inflation and interest rates, both topping 18%, are so far beyond anything that Americans have experienced in peacetime—and so far beyond anything that U.S. financial markets are set up to handle—as to inspire a contagion of fear. Usually confident businessmen and bankers have begun talking of Latin American-style hyperinflation, financial collapse, major bankruptcies, a drastic drop in the American standard of living.
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Jimmy Carter vs. Inflation - TIME

Led by Volcker, the Federal Reserve raised the discount rate from 10% when Volcker assumed the chairmanship in August 1979 to 12% within two months.[24] The prime rate hit 21.5% in December 1980, the highest rate in U.S. history under any President.[25] Carter admitted in February 1980 that inflation had reached a "crisis stage."[21] Investments in fixed income (both bonds and pensions being paid to retired people) were becoming less valuable. The high interest rates would lead to a sharp recession in the early 1980s.[26]
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[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidency_of_Jimmy_Carter]Presidency of Jimmy Carter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

You can apologize now.
 
USA-1 said:
He can't. Because it didn't happen. Neo-cons are great are writing their own history.
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Chew on this history.... The interest rates were dropping dramatically BEFORE Carter even took office, then rose dramatically during his presidency. As I already said, after Carter lost the 1980 election, Volcker was able to tighten the money supply, which Carter hadn't allowed. The interest rates then dropped throughout the Reagan presidency.

640px-Federal_Funds_Rate_1954_thru_2009_effective.svg.png

File:Federal Funds Rate 1954 thru 2009 effective.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'm still waiting on the apology you owe me.
 
Gill said:
Chew on this history.... The interest rates were dropping dramatically BEFORE Carter even took office, then rose dramatically during his presidency. As I already said, after Carter lost the 1980 election, Volcker was able to tighten the money supply, which Carter hadn't allowed. The interest rates then dropped throughout the Reagan presidency.

640px-Federal_Funds_Rate_1954_thru_2009_effective.svg.png

File:Federal Funds Rate 1954 thru 2009 effective.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'm still waiting on the apology you owe me.
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The president has absolutely nothing to do with interest rates, anyway.
I suppose you blamed the high gas prices on Carter, too.:roll:
 
liblady said:
or possibly YOU could apologize to me.....the prime rate is not equivalent to a mortgage rate:

Primary Mortgage Market Survey Archives - 30 Year Fixed Rate Mortgages - Freddie Mac

in 1980, the year in question, rates were not at 20%. and, as a matter of fact, the rates were higher in 1984 than they were in 1980. thanks.
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You actually think that banks loaned money for mortgages at a lower interest rate than they had to pay for it????

Please tell me you are not serious. Banks don't typically loan money at a loss, at least not in the real world.

original.jpg
 
Gill said:
You actually think that banks loaned money for mortgages at a lower interest rate than they had to pay for it????

Please tell me you are not serious. Banks don't typically loan money at a loss, at least not in the real world.

original.jpg
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Banks did not charge 20% for mortgages in the 70s. Period. The Fed funds rate peaked close to 20% but it was short lived and banks don't pay that rate for all their money anyway. They get most of their money from depositors.
 
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