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Thread: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

  1. #31
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    Re: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

    Quote Originally Posted by ScummyD View Post
    Considering he was the head of the CIAs bin Laden unit, he is privy to sources well outside our ability to reach or have access to and he knows a lot about OBL.


    The Libertarians have never had much if any electoral success in the US. That doesn't mean they aren't within the mainstream.
    Well the libertarians arent in the mainstream, if they were more people would vote for them. Il ask again, if Bin Laden's views are so popular why have they not enjoyed electoral success?

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    Re: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    Well the libertarians arent in the mainstream, if they were more people would vote for them.
    Your logic is flawed.

    Of course they are in the mainstream. They are merely a minority and that doesn't mean they aren't in the mainstream. By your logic any group of people that doesn't have a political party elected to office is out of the mainstream and that's simply not true. The Democratic and Republican parties, while within the mainstream, aren't the definition of mainstream or the sole groups that define it. They are coalitions of many smaller groups.

    Il ask again, if Bin Laden's views are so popular why have they not enjoyed electoral success?
    Your question betrays your misunderstanding of OBL's position. He is against democracy.
    Last edited by ScummyD; 02-06-10 at 02:50 PM.
    "Muslims are OBLIGATED to raid the lands of the infidels, occupy them, and exchange their systems of governance for an Islamic system. . .They say that our sharia does not impose our particular beliefs upon others; this is a false assertion. For it is, in fact, part of our religion to IMPOSE our particular beliefs upon others." -bin Laden

  3. #33
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    Re: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

    Quote Originally Posted by ScummyD View Post
    Your logic is flawed.

    Of course they are in the mainstream. They are merely a minority and that doesn't mean they aren't in the mainstream. By your logic any group of people that doesn't have a political party elected to office is out of the mainstream and that's simply not true. The Democratic and Republican parties, while within the mainstream, aren't the definition of mainstream or the sole groups that define it. They are coalitions of many smaller groups.


    Your question betrays your misunderstanding of OBL's position. He is against democracy.
    'Mainstream' is described Wikipedia as 'generally, the common current of thought of the majority' thus neither the libertarian party nor Bin Laden are mainstream, but we can argue semantics all week. What i was originally questioning was whether Bin Ladens opinions were representative of the majority of the worlds Muslims.

    And just because Bin Laden and his ilk don't believe in democratic systems doesn't mean they wont participate in them. Fascist and Marxist-Leninist parties do this across the world as do Islamist parties. Again in most cases they have failed to gain the support of the majority. Pakistan has an Islamist party who's support tends to hover around 10% of the vote, why dont the rest of Pakistan's Muslims vote for them?

  4. #34
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    Re: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    Not exactly mainstream though, unless you have evidence to the contrary?
    Define the muslim mainstream.
    He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire. ~ Winston Churchill

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    Re: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    Define the muslim mainstream.
    Its one billion people, im not even sure there can be a mainstream. But in this context we are talking about whether or not the majority supports the views propagated by Bin Laden. And as i said to Scummy D if Bin Laden's views are those of the majority why do they not enjoy electoral support?
    Last edited by Red_Dave; 02-06-10 at 10:36 PM.

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    Re: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    Its one billion people, im not even sure there can be a mainstream. But in this context we are talking about whether or not the majority supports the views propagated by Bin Laden. And as i said to Scummy D if Bin Laden's views are those of the majority why do they not enjoy electoral support?
    And as I noted, you betray your misunderstanding of OBL by speaking of elections when he opposes democracy.
    Last edited by ScummyD; 02-07-10 at 12:00 AM.
    "Muslims are OBLIGATED to raid the lands of the infidels, occupy them, and exchange their systems of governance for an Islamic system. . .They say that our sharia does not impose our particular beliefs upon others; this is a false assertion. For it is, in fact, part of our religion to IMPOSE our particular beliefs upon others." -bin Laden

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    Re: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

    Quote Originally Posted by ScummyD View Post
    That would only serve to inflame the situation even further and therefore hinder our efforts and undermine our interests.

    And it would provide further fodder for the radicals to say we are waging a war against the religion of Islam, while not providing any substantive value or return on our efforts. It would do nothing to help so-called moderate Muslims gain or solidify their power, but only serve to hamper their efforts.

    We need to think strategically. And ally with the moderate forces in Islamic societies to undermine the radicals. You're position seems to be emotively derived with no concern for the overall larger picture or our national interests in the region.

    And, one last point, what would you propose the US do about Muslims living peacefully and productively within it's own communities???
    I totally agree (here we go with the agreement thing again Scummy, WTF)! The EU should allow Turkey to join, there are many reasons for them to do that, with the encouragement of Muslim participation and integration being only one of them.

    Every country has it's fringe nutjobs, Western Europe isn't free of them. Germany, one of the most dominant EU countries, has neo-Nazis etc.
    "When you're born you get a ticket to the freak show. I say enjoy the show, don't take it seriously." - George Carlin

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    Re: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    Its one billion people, im not even sure there can be a mainstream. But in this context we are talking about whether or not the majority supports the views propagated by Bin Laden. And as i said to Scummy D if Bin Laden's views are those of the majority why do they not enjoy electoral support?
    According to this pew support a minority in many tho not all muslim countries. That still leaves a great number of supporters.

    He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire. ~ Winston Churchill

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    Re: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

    Quote Originally Posted by fallenangel hermes View Post
    A 16-year old girl buried alive by his family who wanted to wash the honor, because he suspected that the teenager had sex with men, as reported by the Turkish Anatolian news agency.

    see the link
    And people wonder why Islam is so universally hated.

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    Re: A 16-year old girl buried alive in Turkey

    Quote Originally Posted by Toothpicvic View Post
    And people wonder why Islam is so universally hated.
    .....not by one billion muslims tho.....
    He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire. ~ Winston Churchill

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