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Thread: Major reforms delayed until 2014

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    Re: Major reforms delayed until 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by jackalope View Post
    Their goal is not no implementation of the exchanges, so I'm not sure how to respond to that. Actually, I'm going to assume you don't mean that comment, it's so absurd.

    I do hope the bennies are brought forward, and not pushed further back, though!
    I'm saying that the goal is to make the bill look good in order to get the other Dems on board and convince the public that this will come in under budget. There's absolutely no other reason to delay the benefits by 4 years.

    I would love for someone to do a comprehensive analysis of how much this bill would actually cost if they were honest and tallied 10 years of revenues v. 10 years of expenditures.

    However, the list of reforms that do start earlier is significant (from you OP link).
    And are negligible in terms of costs and revenues.
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    Re: Major reforms delayed until 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    I'm saying that the goal is to make the bill look good in order to get the other Dems on board and convince the public that this will come in under budget. There's absolutely no other reason to delay the benefits by 4 years.

    I would love for someone to do a comprehensive analysis of how much this bill would actually cost if they were honest and tallied 10 years of revenues v. 10 years of expenditures.



    And are negligible in terms of costs and revenues.


    I have no idea what the goal is on that, since I've seen no reporting on it. However, I do hope it's changed, and the exchanges are implemented earlier, along with the other reforms.


    As to the true cost - I see CBO saying significant deficit reduction in the first decade, small deficit reduction in subsequent decade. That adds up to all deficit reduction, and that's good in my book.

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    Re: Major reforms delayed until 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by jackalope View Post
    I have no idea what the goal is on that, since I've seen no reporting on it. However, I do hope it's changed, and the exchanges are implemented earlier, along with the other reforms.


    As to the true cost - I see CBO saying significant deficit reduction in the first decade, small deficit reduction in subsequent decade. That adds up to all deficit reduction, and that's good in my book.
    And that assumes that the level where taxation kicks in remains the same, which will almost certainly not be the case. Again, look at the AMT or the Doctor's pay cut. If we don't have the political will to force people to take a hit once, what makes you think we're going to have the will to do it over and over again in the future?
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    Re: Major reforms delayed until 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    So the bill will only cost $849b over the first decade while reducing the deficit by $127b...but that's only because it's balancing ten years of revenues against six years of expenditures.
    I wonder what the CBO says about the second 10 year period...

    In the subsequent decade, the collective effect of its provisions would probably be small reductions in federal budget deficits if all of the provisions continued to be fully implemented.
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    Re: Major reforms delayed until 2014

    Our representatives and senators are in the wrong profession. They should be selling used cars.
    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

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    Re: Major reforms delayed until 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Our representatives and senators are in the wrong profession. They should be selling used cars.
    They may well be doing that soon...

    Washington (CNN) -- Voters disappointed over health care and other legislative efforts have now sent 5 million "pink slips" to members of Congress, the conservative Web site WorldNetDaily said Tuesday.

    Several Republican lawmakers joined WorldNetDaily figures to endorse the campaign Tuesday on Capitol Hill.

    "These pink slips are a call for fiscally responsible and constitutionally responsible Americans," said Rep. Steve King of Iowa.

    A pink slip is symbolic of job dismissal, a theme not lost on Rep. Trent Franks, R-Arizona, who said members need to vote the will of the people or be fired in the next election.

    Standing in front of posterboards on which dozens of the pink pieces of paper had been attached, Franks told reporters, "You are looking at just a sample of the 5 million pink slips that Americans have sent to Congress."

    Those Americans, he said, are "people who are saying to members of Congress that 'we are fed up with the absolute out-of-control spending, and we are going to respond and do what we can to take our country back.' "
    Organizers of 'pink slip' protest claim 5 million sent to Congress - CNN.com
    There is no such thing as a “Natural Born Dual-Citizen“.

    Originally Posted by PogueMoran
    I didnt have to read the article to tell you that you cant read.

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    Re: Major reforms delayed until 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    I wonder what the CBO says about the second 10 year period...
    But that projected deficit reduction is largely the result of two things:

    1) The additional Medicare payroll tax, and
    2) The continued cuts in Medicare reimbursements

    I think it's a near-certainty that neither of those things will actually come to pass.

    As to the first one, we can simply look at the AMT for an explanation of why it will never happen. When the AMT was passed, it imposed a minimum tax on a grand total of 155 households. However, because it was not indexed to inflation, it ended up covering a full 20% of the country. Because Congress will never let that happen, they continue to pass an AMT patch that moves the threshold upward.

    Similarly the Medicare payroll tax only kicks in on those households earning over $250k annually. Since this qualifies as "the rich" under Obama's definition, there isn't much outrage. However, that number is also not indexed to inflation, which means that assuming a standard 3% rate of inflation, the additional payroll tax will hit every household earning over $138k by the end of the projected period. There is no way they will let that happen, and as a result, revenues will not even resemble what they're projecting.

    As to the second one, just look at the doctor fix that they're trying to get through right now. As more and more people get added to the system and the number of doctors and specialists remain flat, Medicare payments will have to increase in order to keep doctors within the system. If we're already throwing a couple hundred billion at this problem already, imagine what it will be like 10 or 20 years from now.

    This whole process just makes me sad more than anything else. It's like going to a movie that you've already seen, screaming for the actors not to open the door, and then watching as they get stabbed in the balls yet again. I know how this will play out, and there isn't **** I can do to change that.

    ugh.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: Major reforms delayed until 2014

    The Medicare payroll tax doesn't bother me a bit. Medicare recipients now are not paying for all they take out in benefits. I find the prospect of a non-inflation adjusted surtax on higher incomes to be fine.

    The Medicare cuts are a problem. However, I believe that some form of Paygo will pass the Senate (ala Ryan and Feingold's proposals), and any fixes will be paid for when passed.

    I have no beef with any part of the cost structure of the Senate bill, from what I've heard so far. The narrow public option, and limited exchange access bugs me. I hope Wyden's proposal gets a hearing in the amendment process, or a more robust form of the public option gets passed.


    Edit: I've also heard of a proposed 5% surtax on plastic surgery. LOVE IT !!

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    Re: Major reforms delayed until 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by jackalope View Post


    Edit: I've also heard of a proposed 5% surtax on plastic surgery. LOVE IT !!
    Now that I like, though I think 50 % would be better.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  10. #20
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    Re: Major reforms delayed until 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by jackalope View Post
    Edit: I've also heard of a proposed 5% surtax on plastic surgery. LOVE IT !!
    Why?

    If you don't like it, don't do it.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

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