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Thread: Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

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    Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

    Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists - Taking Liberties - CBS News

    November 10, 2009 12:01 AM
    Posted by Declan McCullagh

    In a case that raises questions about online journalism and privacy rights, the U.S. Department of Justice sent a formal request to an independent news site ordering it to provide details of all reader visits on a certain day

    The grand jury subpoena also required the Philadelphia-based Indymedia.us Web site "not to disclose the existence of this request" unless authorized by the Justice Department, a gag order that presents an unusual quandary for any news organization.

    Kristina Clair, a 34-year old Linux administrator living in Philadelphia who provides free server space for Indymedia.us, said she was shocked to receive the Justice Department's subpoena. (The Independent Media Center is a left-of-center amalgamation of journalists and advocates that according to their principles of unity and mission statement work toward "promoting social and economic justice" and "social change.")

    The subpoena (PDF) from U.S. Attorney Tim Morrison in Indianapolis demanded "all IP traffic to and from www.indymedia.us" on June 25, 2008. It instructed Clair to "include IP addresses, times, and any other identifying information," including e-mail addresses, physical addresses, registered accounts, and Indymedia readers' Social Security Numbers, bank account numbers, credit card numbers, and so on.

    "I didn't think anything we were doing was worthy of any (federal) attention," Clair said in a telephone interview with CBSNews.com on Monday. After talking to other Indymedia volunteers, Clair ended up calling the Electronic Frontier Foundation in San Francisco, which represented her at no cost.

    Under long-standing Justice Department guidelines, subpoenas to members of the news media are supposed to receive special treatment. One portion of the guidelines, for instance, says that "no subpoena may be issued to any member of the news media" without "the express authorization of the attorney general" that would be current attorney general Eric Holder and subpoenas should be "directed at material information regarding a limited subject matter."
    The questions raised here are certainly going to be many and point of the need to be cautious about your use of the internet when it comes to voicing your opinion. Why you ask should anyone who hasn't done anything wrong be concerned? Well that is a question ignorant people ask all the time.

    What you say can easily be misinterpreted and just because someone is in the government does not necessarily them any smarter than some of those who post hear and read into things posted what they think not what is actually written.

    Have your postings ever been monitored yes they have by project CARNIVORE.

    But wait that's just a conspiracy theory promoted by wackos. If you are one who believed this you could not be more wrong.


    Carnivore as publicized intercepts only select Internet communications while Echelon is claimed to intercept all forms of communications. The US government has admitted to operating Carnivore while no official admission of Echelon has ever been made.

    The FBI Website has a section which describes Carnivore's operation with diagrams. There is no governmental site which describes Echelon, at least not in overt terms.

    This I and other portions of the Constitution believe has been under attack for a long time.
    Fourth Amendment Protection from unreasonable search and seizure.
    The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.


    Be aware that if you like to text message you need to be aware that all your texted messages like your emails can not be deleted and are being archived and are recoverable. You can delete email and you can't see it any more but it remains on the server for ever. Texting is the same.

    If you use G-mail or you can see that electronic monitoring like that used in CARNIVORE is at work because key words are picked up and advertising is then directed at you based on you thought to be private email,
    For example if you write about Health care to your friend, advertising about insurance and health care will appear on the right side of the page. I know this to be true because i see it every day.

    If you did not want to read the whole srory make note of this.
    "This is the first time we've seen them try to get the IP address of everyone who visited a particular site," Bankston said. "That it was a news organization was an additional troubling fact that implicates First Amendment rights."
    Welcome to the world of BIG BROTHER it's not a wacko conspiracy it's a proven fact of today's life.

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    Re: Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

    So what happened to this outfit now that they publicized the request?
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    Re: Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

    Indymedia has posted a number of articles related to armed resistance and revolution against the U.S. government in recent years. It's entirely possible that this search warrant is related to specific users and linkers of specific information.

    Quote Originally Posted by Councilman View Post
    Be aware that if you like to text message you need to be aware that all your texted messages like your emails can not be deleted and are being archived and are recoverable. You can delete email and you can't see it any more but it remains on the server for ever. Texting is the same.
    I've really got to stop sexting my boyfriend when I drink.
    Last edited by Catz Part Deux; 11-10-09 at 03:32 PM.

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    Re: Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

    Correct response for Indymedia.us is


    "come and get them dickwad"
    "I do not underestimate the ability of fanatical groups of terrorists to kill and destroy, but they do not threaten the life of the nation. Whether we would survive Hitler hung in the balance, but there is no doubt that we shall survive al-Qa'ida." -- Lord Hoffmann

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    Re: Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

    Can library records be subpoenaed?

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    Re: Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Can library records be subpoenaed?
    You bet. We University kids are upset with that one.

    actually, they don't even have to notify you that they're looking at your records.
    "I do not underestimate the ability of fanatical groups of terrorists to kill and destroy, but they do not threaten the life of the nation. Whether we would survive Hitler hung in the balance, but there is no doubt that we shall survive al-Qa'ida." -- Lord Hoffmann

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    Re: Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    So what happened to this outfit now that they publicized the request?
    What organization?

    (Related questions: What operator? What medical, school, birth reocrds? What little dogs, too?)
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    Re: Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

    Quote Originally Posted by Arch Enemy View Post
    You bet. We University kids are upset with that one.
    So, in your opinion, library records should not be subpoenaed, ever?

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    Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

    Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists - Taking Liberties - CBS News

    This is rather interesting. It claims the government tried to subpoena an independent newsite to get a butt load of information about people who visited the site on a particular day. It's rather off putting, and the blog makes it seem as if there was quite a bit of menace on the part of the government. I particularly liked the

    Morrison [U.S. Attorney Morrison] replied in a one-sentence letter saying the subpoena had been withdrawn. Around the same time, according to the EFF, the group had a series of discussions with assistant U.S. attorneys in Morrison's office who threatened Clair with possible prosecution for obstruction of justice if she disclosed the existence of the already-withdrawn subpoena -- claiming it "may endanger someone's health" and would have a "human cost."
    Don't know if this will be validated or not, but if true it's a bit disturbing the scope of power the government believes itself to have.
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    Re: Justice Dept. Asked For News Site's Visitor Lists

    Yes it is disturbing, I like to think they are testing the waters, I am just glad to see that at least some journalists, still exist in this country.

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