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Thread: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

  1. #81
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    Re: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    A generalization is not the same thing as an opinion. Let me try to explain this to you again (for everyone's benefit).

    Men are taller than women.

    Generally speaking, this is fact. I need not say that "some men" are taller than "some women" AT THE SAME TIME I'm not implying that every man is taller than every woman.

    Guess what?
    SUVs are less fuel efficient than cars.
    Travel by air is faster than travel by train.
    Beef contains more fat than turkey
    and on and on and on...

    These are facts. Nonetheless, all of these are "generally true" but are not always true. This is not a difficult concept.

    Come on! You make me sad for your significant other!
    "I'm hungry for some burgers!"
    "No you're not, you're overgeneralizing"
    "Huh?! No I meant it, I want to eat a burger"
    "You say that you want to eat a burger, but what you really mean is that you only want to eat some burgers. Please don't lie to me next time, just tell me that you're generalizing your hunger preference to round, patty-shaped chopped beef of a suitable fat content that is grilled to a precise temperature."
    Bad analogy.

    Saying Americans are hungry for burgers is a generalization. This is because there are vegetarians/vegans and those who are restricted from eating them due to health concerns or religion.
    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



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    Re: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    BTW, there's lots of evidence that liberals are not as happy as conservatives:
    An interesting take on the "happy" conservatives, presented by the staff and research students engaged in psychoanalytic and psychotherapeutic studies at the University of Sheffield. *

    Psycho-Babble On...
    The world seen from psychoanalytic and psychotherapeutic perspectives
    .


    Why Are Conservatives Happier Than Liberals?

    Just to summarise, conservatives are apparently happier than liberals because they have in-built defences so that they don't feel bad about others' suffering. In Kleinian or more general object-relations terms, we might say that they are more successfully splitting; in particular, splitting feeling (and the capacity to empathise) from thought (i.e. the ideological justification for continuing to support a system that perpetrates inequality).

    This is then evidence -- now apparently backed up by appropriately 'scientific' studies -- for a long-held belief amongst a number of psycho-social thinkers that capitalism is psychopathological; schizoid, as a Kleinian might say.
    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    Liberal dogma teaches people that they've been oppressed and that they need help from government in order to make their dreams come true (external locus of control).
    Hoo-boy. Do you even know the definition of dogma?

    Dogma is the established belief or doctrine held by a religion, ideology or any kind of organization: it is authoritative and not to be disputed, doubted or diverged from.
    Would you kindly provide us with legitimate documentation about these loony established beliefs you claim liberals teach each other? Thanks.



    * The University of Sheffield is rated 8th in the UK, 24th in Europe, and 77th in the world in an annual academic ranking of the top 500 universities worldwide published in August 2008 by China's Shanghai Jiao Tong University.

    Researchers evaluated the universities using several research performance indicators, including the number of highly cited researchers, academic performance, articles in the periodicals Science and Nature, and the number of Nobel prize winners.

  3. #83
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    Re: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    Nobody claimed that. I really must be in the twilight zone.
    1. Opinions don't count here.

    2. If you can't link to a source for any statement you make, it's concidered an opinion here.

    3. Opinions don't count here.

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    Re: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    1. Opinions don't count here.

    2. If you can't link to a source for any statement you make, it's concidered an opinion here.

    3. Opinions don't count here.
    No need to be mellodramatic here.

    Opinions are fine. Presenting opinions as fact is the problem here.

    It's all in the presentation.
    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



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    Re: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    Bad analogy.

    Saying Americans are hungry for burgers is a generalization. This is because there are vegetarians/vegans and those who are restricted from eating them due to health concerns or religion.
    Huh? Wouldn't that make your analogy the bad one?

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    Re: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    No need to be mellodramatic here.

    Opinions are fine. Presenting opinions as fact is the problem here.

    It's all in the presentation.
    I must have forgotten to "[/mellodrama]" (sp).
    Last edited by Crunch; 08-31-09 at 06:29 PM.

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    Re: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    As I said earlier, I did substantiate my claims. Not as well as I would have liked, but this is a discussion board, no? Are we not allowed to discuss our thoughts until someone else has come to a conclusion? Sheesh.

    BTW, there's lots of evidence that liberals are not as happy as conservatives:
    (hopefully I can paste links in here)

    Why Are Conservatives Happier Than Liberals?
    http://isites.harvard.edu/fs/docs/icb.topic526279.files
    /Napier%20Jost%20Why%20Are%20Conservatives%20Happie r.pdf

    Why are liberals so bummed out?
    Why Conservatives Say They Are Happier Than Liberals - US News and World Report

    Smile if (and Only if) You're Conservative
    George F. Will - Smile if (and Only if) You're Conservative - washingtonpost.com

    It makes sense when you think about it. The democratic party attracts a confederacy of unhappy people: welfare recipients, people living off of social security, certain minority groups, etc. Further, Liberal dogma teaches people that they've been oppressed and that they need help from government in order to make their dreams come true (external locus of control).

    Now it may be the case that these people love their country as much as those who are generally happier and don't share that same worldview, but I doubt it.
    Your first link does not work. Your second link is to a Q & A with a guy trying to sell his book, and your third link is to an op/ed piece by George Will. So, do you have any real evidence. Considering the nature of the OP here, I would say that conservatives seem much less happy these days. I admit this is just an opinion, but at least it is based on one fact.

    While I enjoyed your misrepresentation of liberals, I do find it interesting you have yet to offer even any bad evidence on your original claim, which is that liberals don't love their country as much as "regular people".

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    Re: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    I'm trying to debate here, and you all want to ignore the thinking part and jump right in to copy what others have thought and decided to write down. If you want to debate, please provide some evidence. It need not be conclusive. The goal here is to weigh evidence from both sides.
    Debate works a couple ways. When you express your opinion, and state it as such, the most I can do is say "I disagree". When you make statements as if they are fact, then you need to show evidence or expect to get called on it.

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    Re: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    Huh? Wouldn't that make your analogy the bad one?
    It's not a generalization if it's only about one person.
    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



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    Re: 'We hate the United States': Secessionists rally in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Oddly enough, I recall a couple of liberal pundits, after the 2004 re-election of Bush, stating that "maybe we should let the red states succeed"...because they were bummed out that the aforementioned red states had given the White House to the Republicans again.

    I've said it before: Democracy works as long as the 50%-1 is willing to let the 50%+1 rule over them. When they stop being willing to suffer that rule, things start falling apart.

    I know many of you scoff, but all it would take would be the passage of one sufficiently inflammatory law to send a significant minority of the population into armed rebellion...which is how the Revolution started.

    It just might be better to consider revisiting Federalism and allowing the States more internal autonomy before we get to that point, rather than letting it all come apart at the seams.
    I don't see things coming apart at the seams any time in the foreseeable future. There are alot of unhappy people right now, but that is the case pretty much always to my mind.

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