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Thread: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

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    Re: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Well said from someone's idea if real danger is jay walking. Only a dumb kid, who don't know **** from shinola would say something like that.

    Ya know, I don't mean to be such a smartass, but you can't place your moral tone above the lives of other Americans.
    Actually, I can and do. If we do not have ideals and morals, we have nothing of value. If we did not have people wining to place their morals ahead of their personal safety, we would not have an armed force to defend our country.

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    Re: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    "There were young knights among them who had never been present at a stricken field. Some could not look upon it and some could not speak and they held themselves apart from the others who were cutting down the prisoners at My Lord's orders, for the prisoners were a body too numerous to be guarded by those of us who were left. Then Jean de Rye, an aged knight of Burgundy who had been sore wounded in the battle, rode up to the group of young knights and said: 'Are ye maidens with your downcast eyes? Look well upon it. See all of it. Close your eyes to nothing. For a battle is fought to be won. And it is this that happens if you lose."
    Froissartís Chronicles, 14th century
    I'm not looking to look away or lose a war. I'll observe all with eyes unclouded by hate. The point is that if we lose ourselves in the battle, it doesn't matter. If we abandon our base, our ideals, it's over. Terrorists win. If we become enslaved to a larger and ever intrusive government which grew bloated on the excuses of terrorism and home safety we've lost. If our freedom and liberty are suppressed and usurped, we've lost. People want to look at this as though it's a one way street. You're with us or you're against us sort of thing. That's dumb "logic" (lack thereof). Let's get the terrorists! Without forethought to what it is that we're doing, why we're doing it, and how it's going to get us to a solution. Fight fight fight. But a blind fight, a fight which goes against the foundations of our Republic is not a fight worth fighting. Even if we win, we lose.

    As to the torture stuff which spawned all this. All I said was own up to what you want to do. Other people made the dumb and intellectually devoid comments that saying that means I want people to die. I don't want people to die, it's why I am against the Iraq war. But I want people to man up and call a spade a spade. Quit hiding behind semantics and words so that you don't feel so bad about what you want to do. Be a man about it and own up. I think many issues could be debated more honestly with people actually striving to come up with a solution if everyone was honest and up front with what we are doing.
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    Re: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

    Quote Originally Posted by formerroadie View Post
    I would rather die in a terrorist bombing attack than torture an individual which is against the law. Sorry folks but some things are worth dying for. One of those things are the integrity, honor and principles of our nation. To lie and beat around the bush (no pun intended) is to spit on the graves of every soldier that has died in the Iraq/Afghanistan wars. They go to fight for the ideals of this nation and then the people back here are going about doing things they know are illegal and frankly beneath us. You can try to justify it all you want, but there is no way that will ever be properly moral or ethical.



    When and where have you fought again, hero?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    It's tough explaining things to a cherry.



    A "cherry" is someone who signed on the lined and made an effort to begin a warriors path....



    I don't think Formerroadie, is of this descriptor.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

    Bush and Cheney shamed every victim of 9-11..Many young soldiers joined at that point to fight back against the terrorists who attacked our nation.

    From that instant forward Bush and Cheney used that moment to fullfill their political motivations.

    Young soldiers who followed their orders to torture people in the name of America. Orders that were nothing but insane kneejerk reactions in response to the 9-11 attacks. No forthought what so ever. Just torture used to fullfill political desires and ambitions and our soldiers were used for such things.

    Now Bush and Cheney are acting like the cowards we know they are. Hiding behind the soldiers who were following their insane orders.

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    Re: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

    Reading over the reports there is not exact information on what information was gleaned from torture and what was from regular interrogation. The points listed above seem to rotate between interrogation and "enhanced interrogation". What information was gotten before and after how does it compare. In the report there were no ticking time bomb scenarios which was the whole justification for the "enhanced interrogation" in contravention of standard CIA protocols. With this we have no idea if we couldn't have gotten the same information through standard interrogation. Do keep in mind the fallacy of post hoc, ergo propter hoc

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    Re: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Actually, I can and do. If we do not have ideals and morals, we have nothing of value. If we did not have people wining to place their morals ahead of their personal safety, we would not have an armed force to defend our country.
    No matter how many of your people get killed. Right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    No matter how many of your people get killed. Right?
    Doing the right thing is rarely cheap and easy. It still should be the goal.

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    Re: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Doing the right thing is rarely cheap and easy. It still should be the goal.
    Good thing you're not in any kind of leadership position.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: CIA enhanced interigation docs released. Cheney responds

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Good thing you're not in any kind of leadership position.
    Yeah. Good lord we would not want morality in our leaders.

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