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Thread: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

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    Re: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    There's no falsehood about it 97-98 is in the decade of the 90s so what I said was a true statement. So Dick Cheney also felt the same way and suddenly reversed course. The question is why what was the motivation for the change?
    Yes...but when you state the "90's" it suggests that Rumsfeld was all about toppling the dictator throughout the "90's." He did not. He whole heartedly supported Cold War prescription in 1991.

    The motivation for the change was that they recognized that containment only ensured a long and never ending mission for America. The question of WMD was also legitimate. Also, Rumsfeld was a Republican and this was a way to play politics for the ignorant masses.

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    Re: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

    Quote Originally Posted by GySgt View Post
    Yes...but when you state the "90's" it suggests that Rumsfeld was all about toppling the dictator throughout the "90's." He did not. He whole heartedly supported Cold War prescription in 1991.

    The motivation for the change was that they recognized that containment only ensured a long and never ending mission for America. The question of WMD was also legitimate. Also, Rumsfeld was a Republican and this was a way to play politics for the ignorant masses.
    No when I said 90s it suggests that it took place in the 90s. There is no inference of anything else.

    The question was not legitimate as even Colin Powell and Condi Rice stated in 2001 before the push for war in Iraq that containment of Saddam was working and that he had no WMDs.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0wbpKCdkkQ"]YouTube - Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice Tell The Truth About Iraq[/ame]

    9/11 gave them the excuse they wanted to invade contrary to their original position.

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    Re: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

    This is not breaking news. It is a partisan opinion piece. Find the stats that fit your view and put them out there.

    Lies, damn lies, and partisan hackery.

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    Re: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    This is not breaking news. It is a partisan opinion piece. Find the stats that fit your view and put them out there.

    Lies, damn lies, and partisan hackery.
    Partisan as the video may be, it does not change the fact that both Condi and Powell stated in 2001 Saddam was contained and did not have wmds

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    Re: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    9/11 gave them the excuse they wanted to invade contrary to their original position.
    Yes...because "WMD" was not the factor involved. General Zinni was skeptical about WMD when all the targets in Iraq given to him in 1998 were non WMD sites. No intel proved that he got rid of them. No intel proved that he had them. I keep telling people this. 12 years of containing and maintaining the dictator, which was exactly what we were criticized for during the Cold War. With Bin Laden using the escallating troops and the "starving children of Iraq" as an excuse for 9/11, something had to be done to correct our solutions to the Middle East's disfunctions. Leaving him alone to disrupt the region was not going to happen. Continuing the UN mission, no matter how much of a burden it was to us, wasn't going to happen forever. And ignoring the very real grievances these terrorists have was only going to exponentially create more violence upon Americans.

    It was time.
    Last edited by MSgt; 08-09-09 at 04:33 PM.

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    Re: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    Wolfowitz, Cheney, Rumsfeld the connections have been playing out since Cheney and Rumsfeld marginalized the entire Ford administration in their own coup. They were able to singlehandedly change our policies and convince presidents that the russian threat was bigger than it was. The CIA had concluded as far back as Nixon that the soviet union was on the verge of collapse in the next decade under the stress of their own weight. It was Rummy and Cheney who helped form Team B which was a counterintelligence operation that was against the CIA. They were able to convince the president that the soviet union had secret weapons that they didn't have. In the end this would play out again as the same players worked within the Bush Jr administration to go against what the CIA had originally determined.

    They had wanted to invade Iraq for years its all in their manifesto, the Project for the New American Century. They wrote a letter to Clinton even trying to get him to invade during the 90s.

    Letter to President Clinton on Iraq


    Look at the list of characters several of them should look pretty familiar to you.

    The following document calls for total global military dominance
    http://www.newamericancentury.org/Re...asDefenses.pdf

    They also called for invasions of multiple countries in the middle east.
    So, in other words, despite the fact that as far as I am aware, the conclusions reached by Team B are seen as uncertain as to the level of their accuracy (I don't necessarily defend their conclusions, just that it seems awfully difficult to argue one way or another), and that there were several non-neoconservatives in the Project for the New American Century, a grand conspiracy exists? I find it funny that you highlight Powell's right hand man in the administration for proof of a unified front. The CIA is not the end-all-be-all of policy decision-making.

    Let me guess, either Adam Curtis or Anne Cahn.
    Last edited by Fiddytree; 08-21-09 at 03:55 AM.
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    Re: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    9/11 gave them the excuse they wanted to invade contrary to their original position.
    ....and our containiment mission, which saw millions of "starving children in Iraq" gave Bin Laden his excuse for 9/11.

    Doctor it up all you want, but Hussein had to go down once and for all in order for us to move on from the mess that is the Middle East.

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    Re: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

    *Yanks back on subject*

    Quote Originally Posted by Laila View Post
    Says something about the voters *cough*

    You do not judge after 6 months. Give it a reasonable amount of time
    Try to get real about something, I know it doesn't have to be this issue but at least acknowledge to some small part of your brain that Obama literally said that his first "100 Days" (you can gasp, feint, bow down in awe right about now - I'll let you, it's a natural reaction most pseudoliberals have) would be the crowning achievement of his Presidency.

    He repeated it like mantra, every news station had their own "100 Days" section, a few others happily compared it too FDR, his YouTube channel is filled with the nonsense, everyone who stood in his path was clearly a Limbaugh Automaton or Fascist Neanderthal "Evil-Monger" (to quote Senator Reid).

    Now you turn around and say voters should ignore, forget, not only those "100 Days," but the next 100 as well? Heh, let's get real about this: voters not only can but should have an opinion on the president 6 months into his Presidency. Anything else is just delusional, self destructive, denial MSNBC spouts off. It is possible that the majority of America could somehow fathom that Obama is only mortal.

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    Re: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    This is not breaking news. It is a partisan opinion piece. Find the stats that fit your view and put them out there.

    Lies, damn lies, and partisan hackery.
    That's all they know my friend.
    It's time for a revolution in our country. Not a revolution forged with guns and bombs but a revolution forged of compassion and altruism. A revolution that extends a hand to those who don't have and who cannot. A revolution that makes Health Care available to all those in the US.

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    Re: After 6 Months, More View Obama's Presidency as a 'Failure' Than Bush's

    President Barack Oblamea....Bush screws up the country hands it over to Oblamea then the Bush/Cheney sheeples convienently forgets about the Bush legacy as they did our country while Bush and Cheney were robbing us blind.

    Thank Goodness Oblamea became president.

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