Father says son was suffering psychotic episode during shooting spree

Ikari said:

It's an expression.

Dogs come and go, they are property. You can easily replace a "comfort dog", you cannot easily replace a human being.

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What in the name of god are you posting all this to me for? I really don't care.

Ikari said:

5 people were hurt, but we just get pictures of the dogs. Who cares about the dogs....dime a dozen. People were hurt, that's were the major damage lies.

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Ahem.

Ikari said:

It's an expression.

Dogs come and go, they are property. You can easily replace a "comfort dog", you cannot easily replace a human being.

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I guess it all depends on the human...

djl

Glen Contrarian said:

One is a group of civilians, and the other is one of the two major candidates for president of the United States. One is a group that protests the historic and ongoing racism against blacks in America...and the other is the titular leader of ALL Republicans and most conservatives in America.

BLM has posted on its website: "Black Lives Matter is an ideological and political intervention in a world where Black lives are systematically and intentionally targeted for demise. It is an affirmation of Black folks’ contributions to this society, our humanity, and our resilience in the face of deadly oppression."

On the other hand, Trump has called for all Muslims to be registered with the government...because they are Muslim.

In other words, you presented a false equivalency.

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The candidates are civilians also.

And...........believing anything off of the "Animals are US" website is being very naive.

Glen Contrarian said:

False equivalency. The accusations against BLM and especially against Muslims have been far, far more common than those against the Right. You're comparing a molehill to a mountain...or need I remind you of the strong support Trump has for requiring all Muslims to register with our government? Hm?

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And the lefts habit of calling all whites racist is a molehill? Puhleeze. :roll: The point is that neither side is "innocent". The very fact that the race card was played in the 2nd post of this thread shows the hypocrisy of your statement.

Glen Contrarian said:

And you don't even consider the possibility that the ease of access to firearms by all and sundry IS a very real part of the problem - heck, I'm sure you've seen for yourself the guidance terrorists give to each other about America, about how easy it is to get firearms here!

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Irrelevant to what we're talking about.

Glen Contrarian said:

Let me see here: you excuse the assumptions about the Dallas shooter because of the calls for violence by some (and CERTAINLY not the majority) of those marching with BLM...but you decry the assumptions made about the Right after the Gabby Giffords shooting when the "target" ads about here were put out by the your candidate for the vice presidency of the United States! Molehill, meet mountain!

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Yes, I do excuse the assumptions about the Dallas shooter. Because the BLM is actually calling for deaths of police officers. No where did Palin call for the death of anyone. And fyi, Palin was not my candidate of choice. I consider her to be an idiot and always have.

Glen Contrarian said:

That wasn't the point of the cartoon and you know it.

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It was attempting to claim that if you're a white shooter then whites will just claim it was a mental illness. If you're of darker skin then whites will claim thuggery. Yeah, i know the point of it. A point which was invalid because that article was about the parents claim and had nothing to do with race. The picture presented in post 2 was most certainly used at the wrong time. If it had been made later if the majority of whites were taking up that stance it would have been valid. But it wasn't. Therefore, race card played inappropriately.

Glen Contrarian said:

Yeah, just like NINE freaking investigations ALL found zero wrongdoing by Hillary Clinton when it came to Benghazi...but the mother is still convinced (as, it seems, are most conservatives even now) that she caused that woman's son's death. But what you forgot to mention was that what happened to Brown was the proverbial straw that broke the camel's back, that the blacks of Ferguson had been the victims of endemic racism by the police and courts there for decades. THAT - and not the killing of Brown - was what caused the rioting. Brown's killing was only the spark that lit all the fuel that had been building up for decades.

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What's really ironic here is that you're talking about an investigation done on a white person. However all that you're doing is proving my point. Both sides do this crap and both sides are being idiots. And what happened to Brown was justified. It being the "straw that broke the proverbial camels back" is just an excuse to excuse what happened. Another example of the idiocy that we're talking about here btw.

Glen Contrarian said:

How many times have we seen even here on DP how conservatives (and certain 'independents') are quick to point out that Brown was no angel, that the cop's actions may have been understandable...but at the same time, they pointedly ignore - and even deny - the endemic racism by Ferguson's police and courts for decades, and somehow convince themselves that the police and courts and their long-standing and documented racism had nothing to do with the riots there!

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All of which has nothing to do with the fact that the race card was played inappropriately here.

Glen Contrarian said:

So yeah, race card played for GOOD reason...and the fact that you're trying to downplay its relevancy doesn't surprise anyone in the slightest.

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No, it actually wasn't. For the simple fact that I don't see the majority of whites claiming that the guy was mentally ill. I see one parent making the claim.

Kal'Stang said:

And the lefts habit of calling all whites racist is a molehill? Puhleeze. :roll: The point is that neither side is "innocent". The very fact that the race card was played in the 2nd post of this thread shows the hypocrisy of your statement.

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Hyperbole much? You know doggone well that the left has no such "habit" - that's you blowing things way the heck out of proportion and thinking it does you a bit of good. I talk about racism probably more than any other person on here, and I have NEVER "called all whites racist"...neither has any other person on the Left on DP. I remember seeing one that did so online - count 'em, ONE - who did so, and that was way the heck back in 1994, back when there were no "browsers", but it was on a debate page on Prodigy - if you're old enough to remember that.

Irrelevant to what we're talking about.

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YOU are the one who brought up guns first, guy - if you considered them irrelevant to the subject, then you shouldn't have brought them up!

Yes, I do excuse the assumptions about the Dallas shooter. Because the BLM is actually calling for deaths of police officers. No where did Palin call for the death of anyone. And fyi, Palin was not my candidate of choice. I consider her to be an idiot and always have.

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When a politician uses dog-whistle calls for violence or racism or any other crime, I excuse that candidate NOT AT ALL. Y'all pretend like the politician didn't mean anything untoward...but y'all - and we - know better. The Dallas shooter was in no way affiliated with BLM...and if you'll recall, quite a few of the BLM marchers were open-carrying - did they attack anyone? No. But the crazy guy did.

It was attempting to claim that if you're a white shooter then whites will just claim it was a mental illness. If you're of darker skin then whites will claim thuggery. Yeah, i know the point of it. A point which was invalid because that article was about the parents claim and had nothing to do with race. The picture presented in post 2 was most certainly used at the wrong time. If it had been made later if the majority of whites were taking up that stance it would have been valid. But it wasn't. Therefore, race card played inappropriately.

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Look at your first two sentences - if that wasn't the case so many times, you'd have a point...but that IS the case way too many times. You've seen it yourself on DP, with the conservatives claiming 'thuggery' - with the clear intent of that being a racist dog-whistle - and claiming in plain English that it's all because of black culture. And you've also been here long enough to have seen - as I have - a significant increase in the racism on DP...nearly all of it against blacks. The really sad point is that too many people on here - perhaps even including yourself - seem to think that pointing out racist statements or acts by others is in itself racism!

What's really ironic here is that you're talking about an investigation done on a white person. However all that you're doing is proving my point. Both sides do this crap and both sides are being idiots. And what happened to Brown was justified. It being the "straw that broke the proverbial camels back" is just an excuse to excuse what happened. Another example of the idiocy that we're talking about here btw.

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I suggest you go take some courses in psychology, then...because when a people are downtrodden for so long, it doesn't take much for them to lose their collective temper. What, are you going to claim that "Well, the people of Ferguson should have waited until yet another racist act was committed by their police or courts, and THEN started rioting"? Hm? Oh, wait - I forgot - they're supposed to just sit and take it, forever and ever...since they had zero ability to get it through the courts and no one else seemed to listen to them. Ferguson was a freaking powder keg waiting to blow - it was only waiting for a spark. Whether that spark was right or wrong does NOT nullify all the racism that had enabled that powder keg to be ready to blow up in the first place!

All of which has nothing to do with the fact that the race card was played inappropriately here.

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That's your opinion...and you're welcome to it.

No, it actually wasn't. For the simple fact that I don't see the majority of whites claiming that the guy was mentally ill. I see one parent making the claim.

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If the guy had been black or Muslim, you know doggone well what a lot of whites - and particularly conservative whites - would have been saying. You KNOW this. Don't even try to deny it. And that's the whole issue that the picture was bringing up.

Glen Contrarian said:

Hyperbole much? You know doggone well that the left has no such "habit" - that's you blowing things way the heck out of proportion and thinking it does you a bit of good....

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This is BS and you know it. Hell, there was even a poll here at DP recently asking the question "are all whites racist". Guess what, 6 people voted yes, and others in the thread said yes though they didn't vote. And I can't count the times that people have called "RACIST!" when some white guy criticized Obama on his policies.

Glen Contrarian said:

YOU are the one who brought up guns first, guy...

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Bringing up the lefts stance every single time a mass shooting happens doesn't mean that I'm talking about gun control itself. I'm talking about the lefts stance. There is a difference.

Glen Contrarian said:

When a politician uses dog-whistle calls for violence or racism or any other crime....

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Except Palin wasn't calling for violence and you know it. Crosshairs do not automatically mean gun/violence. It means "target". Palin was about targeting certain politicians based on their policies. You know that, I know that. To claim that she was calling for violence was nothing more than a leftist meme based on no fact in existence. I know, you want to downplay it, but the fact of the matter is that its the same damn rhetoric that you're trying to apply here in this thread regarding the race card being played.

And the Dallas shooter not being affiliated with the BLM does not mean that he didn't do what he did because of the BLM's rhetoric.

And if you truly do denounce violent rhetoric then you should be denouncing the BLM.

Glen Contrarian said:

Look at your first two sentences - if that wasn't the case so many times, you'd have a point...but that IS the case way too many times. You've seen it yourself on DP, with the conservatives claiming 'thuggery'...

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Yes, I've seen it many many times here at DP and other places. But again, it was the parent claiming that the son was mentally ill in the OP's article. Not the right. As such the race card was inappropriate to be playing. If the right had been doing it then I wouldn't have spoken up about that picture. But its kinda hard to prove that the right was doing it first when the race card was played right at the beginning of the conversation wouldn't you say?

Glen Contrarian said:

I suggest you go take some courses in psychology, then...

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Sorry, I don't accept this excuse. Nor your hyperbole. I don't care what group you are. Rioting over a criminal being killed is stupid no matter the excuse. If the BLM wants serious consideration then they should be holding up examples of real injustice. NOT criminals.

Glen Contrarian said:

That's your opinion...and you're welcome to it.

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Not just opinion, but fact. DL didn't even wait to see if the right would take up that meme. He just automatically played the racecard. No matter what world you live in, that is factually wrong. If he had waited and the right did take up that meme then it would have been appropriate. But he didn't.

Glen Contrarian said:

If the guy had been black or Muslim, you know doggone well what a lot of whites - and particularly conservative whites - would have been saying. You KNOW this. Don't even try to deny it. And that's the whole issue that the picture was bringing up.

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Irrelevant to what happened in this thread. I've already acknowledged that both sides do this crap. Its wrong no matter what side does it. But playing the card before it actually happens is just as wrong. You can deny that all that you want. Doesn't change the fact that it is still wrong. And last I knew, two wrongs do not make a right.

Note: Due to character limit reduced parts of what was quoted.

dimensionallava said:

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You are kidding. What's the first response in the media to a Muslim screaming Allahu Akbar and killing everyone in sight? Oh, must be a "lone wolf" with no connection to Islam and obviously mentally ill. That cartoon is nonsense. The person this thread is about should be charged with attempted murder and whatever else is possible and be punished accordingly as should anyone else who shoots innocent people, regardless of any connections to any group. Do you really think that any conservatives are going to make excuses for this guy?

Kal'Stang said:

This is BS and you know it. Hell, there was even a poll here at DP recently asking the question "are all whites racist". Guess what, 6 people voted yes, and others in the thread said yes though they didn't vote. And I can't count the times that people have called "RACIST!" when some white guy criticized Obama on his policies.

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Show me the poll. Show me who it was that voted "yes" - I want to see it...and if the votes were anonymous, it wouldn't be the first time that conservatives have pretended to be liberal in order to try to make us look bad. I'm sure the name "James O'Keefe" is known to you.

Glen Contrarian said:

Show me the poll. Show me who it was that voted "yes" - I want to see it...and if the votes were anonymous, it wouldn't be the first time that conservatives have pretended to be liberal in order to try to make us look bad. I'm sure the name "James O'Keefe" is known to you.

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Still on the first page of the poll section of the forums.

Link

And its not a private poll. Cute how you tried to already make an excuse to dismiss the poll results. I'm sure you'll try to continue to make excuses.

Kal'Stang said:

Still on the first page of the poll section of the forums.

Link

And its not a private poll. Cute how you tried to already make an excuse to dismiss the poll results. I'm sure you'll try to continue to make excuses.

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So why is it that I can't see the names of who voted for what? Maybe you can see as a moderator, but I can't.

Perhaps you should pay attention to what 'countryboy' said in reference to 'dimensionallava' saying "Sure, why not?" 'Countryboy' stated (in #22): "Of course he knows how absurd that is. Nobody making such claims believes it to be true. It is nothing more than a political narrative."

'Countryboy' called it right - he knew not to pay too much attention to dimensionallava's apparently facetious comment. You, on the other hand, blew it way the heck out of proportion - 6 out of a total of 80 votes. Considering the fact that probably 40% of all DP'ers are liberal or at least somewhat left-leaning (though the majority are certainly conservative and libertarian), even if every single one of the votes were seriously cast by a liberal, that still leaves the ones who voted thus as a small minority of the liberals.

In other words, you blew it way the heck out of proportion. You said the left had such a "habit"...but - and this is even allowing for ALL the votes 'for' to be liberal AND serious - when the "habit" can in reality only be attributed to a small minority of a group, you canNOT honestly attribute that 'habit' to the group as a whole. That's a classic example of the 'broad-brush' logical fallacy.

Hyperbole much? Yeah, it strongly appears that you do.

Glen Contrarian said:

So why is it that I can't see the names of who voted for what? Maybe you can see as a moderator, but I can't.

Perhaps you should pay attention to what 'countryboy' said in reference to 'dimensionallava' saying "Sure, why not?" 'Countryboy' stated (in #22): "Of course he knows how absurd that is. Nobody making such claims believes it to be true. It is nothing more than a political narrative."

'Countryboy' called it right - he knew not to pay too much attention to dimensionallava's apparently facetious comment. You, on the other hand, blew it way the heck out of proportion - 6 out of a total of 80 votes. Considering the fact that probably 40% of all DP'ers are liberal or at least somewhat left-leaning (though the majority are certainly conservative and libertarian), even if every single one of the votes were seriously cast by a liberal, that still leaves the ones who voted thus as a small minority of the liberals.

In other words, you blew it way the heck out of proportion. You said the left had such a "habit"...but - and this is even allowing for ALL the votes 'for' to be liberal AND serious - when the "habit" can in reality only be attributed to a small minority of a group, you canNOT honestly attribute that 'habit' to the group as a whole. That's a classic example of the 'broad-brush' logical fallacy.

Hyperbole much? Yeah, it strongly appears that you do.

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As far as I can tell there is no reason that you should not be able to see who voted what. I am no more privy to polls that are not set to public than you are. I even double checked to make sure.

As for the rest of what you said...yeah, not surprised. As I said previously, I'm sure you'll continue to make excuses. Ignoring the calls of the left calling whites racist when there is no racism is what the left DOES. You know it. And I know it. Hell, the Democratic Party prolly wouldn't even exist if it wasn't for them playing the race card all the time. We'd probably have a better party in its place and whooping Republicans up one side and down the other.

Kal'Stang said:

As far as I can tell there is no reason that you should not be able to see who voted what. I am no more privy to polls that are not set to public than you are. I even double checked to make sure.

As for the rest of what you said...yeah, not surprised. As I said previously, I'm sure you'll continue to make excuses. Ignoring the calls of the left calling whites racist when there is no racism is what the left DOES. You know it. And I know it. Hell, the Democratic Party prolly wouldn't even exist if it wasn't for them playing the race card all the time. We'd probably have a better party in its place and whooping Republicans up one side and down the other.

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You're not debating. You appear to not be interested in serious discourse. When someday you do become interested in serious discourse - the kind in which you're not afraid to find out that maybe you're not right about everything and maybe your opponent is not wrong about everything - let me know. You can have the last word.