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Lavoy Finicum Was Not Murdered. He Forced Oregon Police to Shoot Him.

Beaudreaux said:
I support the 2nd Amendment, unconditionally (which is another way of saying "shall not be infringed").

Finicum got what he deserved, and from what I can tell, what he wanted. The police officers that shot him did not murder him. It was a good shoot.

Edit - forgot to add this since you brought it up - the Tamir Rice shooting was also a good shoot on the exact same grounds.

What else do you want to know?
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Yeah, but ignoring "well-regulated militia." We know how the selective reading of the 2d by you guys works. As far as Finicum's concerned then what's your beef aside from wanting to make this thread about the second amendment which it in no way is?
 
digitusmedius said:
Yeah, but ignoring "well-regulated militia." We know how the selective reading of the 2d by you guys works. As far as Finicum's concerned then what's your beef aside from wanting to make this thread about the second amendment which it in no way is?
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Wow. Read your own OP... see who brought up what, when.
 
ReverendHellh0und said:
So you post a page 3 of a thread and think that proves anything?


Please quote me saying finnicum was murderd or retract the lie.
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So you admit that you have been pushing several false versions of Finicum's shooting. Thanks for giving up early rather than dragging this out just to end up in the same place.
 
digitusmedius said:
So you admit that you have been pushing several false versions of Finicum's shooting. Thanks for giving up early rather than dragging this out just to end up in the same place.
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Check:

giant fail.JPG


and Mate:

giant fail 2.JPG



The ONLY reference involving me in that thread to murder, kid, is pointing out the stupidity of your post's claims which for some reason you thought it was a smart idea to double down with a whole thread on such fail.



You should really stop digging....
 
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Beaudreaux said:
Wow. Read your own OP... see who brought up what, when.
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It was a single sentence tucked into the middle paragraph meant to reinforce that the author of the source for the thread was no liberal. And you're trying to make that the topic of the thread. That tells us how uncomfortable you are with the truth about Finicum's shooting despite your disclaimers that he deserved what he got. You sure don't like having to face it, do you. In fact, if you were really convinced that he really got what he deserved you wouldn't have bothered commenting on this thread at all. I just love you desperate you and people like Hellh0und get when faced with facts even you can't run away from. Maybe if you dwelt in the factual world more they wouldn't be so menacing to you.
 
digitusmedius said:
Yeah, but ignoring "well-regulated militia." We know how the selective reading of the 2d by you guys works. As far as Finicum's concerned then what's your beef aside from wanting to make this thread about the second amendment which it in no way is?
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Just what do you think "welll regulated militia means", whatever you think that means, which I am sure is wrong, you then would need to explain how that would affect "the people" and not the "militia".... English 101 with a splash of time period context would go a long way for you.
 
digitusmedius said:
It was a single sentence tucked into the middle paragraph meant to reinforce that the author of the source for the thread was no liberal. And you're trying to make that the topic of the thread. That tells us how uncomfortable you are with the truth about Finicum's shooting despite your disclaimers that he deserved what he got. You sure don't like having to face it, do you. In fact, if you were really convinced that he really got what he deserved you wouldn't have bothered commenting on this thread at all. I just love you desperate you and people like Hellh0und get when faced with facts even you can't run away from. Maybe if you dwelt in the factual world more they wouldn't be so menacing to you.
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Where are the links or quotes from members saying that Finicum was murdered?
 
Beaudreaux said:
Where are the links or quotes from members saying that Finicum was murdered?
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I'm not an errand boy or a tutor for people who can't find things on their own. You asked "who" was claiming that and I gave you the names of members* to check on and now you want me to go fetch their actual comments. This is typical laziness of rightwingers. It's also a standard trolling technique by which they, i.e., you in this instance, try to protract and derail a topic that makes them squirm.

*I left out a very insistent advocate for the feds murdering Finicum calling himself "jmotivator." So now you've been given four names to ignore.
 
digitusmedius said:
I'm not an errand boy or a tutor for people who can't find things on their own. You asked "who" was claiming that and I gave you the names of members* to check on and now you want me to go fetch their actual comments. This is typical laziness of rightwingers. It's also a standard trolling technique by which they, i.e., you in this instance, try to protract and derail a topic that makes them squirm.

*I left out a very insistent advocate for the feds murdering Finicum calling himself "jmotivator." So now you've been given four names to ignore.
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don't run away. Post #29, Post #31.


:lol:
 
digitusmedius said:
I'm not an errand boy or a tutor for people who can't find things on their own. You asked "who" was claiming that and I gave you the names of members* to check on and now you want me to go fetch their actual comments. This is typical laziness of rightwingers. It's also a standard trolling technique by which they, i.e., you in this instance, try to protract and derail a topic that makes them squirm.

*I left out a very insistent advocate for the feds murdering Finicum calling himself "jmotivator." So now you've been given four names to ignore.
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yes, If I were to say that you posted in support of man boy love, NAMBLA and pedophilia, would it be up to me to prove my claim, or would it be up to you to prove you were not a pedophile?


The onus is on the person who makes the claim, to prove said claim.


Even after I show, in the thread YOU posted, doing YOUR work for you, that I never said finnicum was murdered, you continue to lie, when the proof is just a few posts up.

do you think that shows integrity, honesty, honor on your part?
 
digitusmedius said:
LaVoy Finicum Was Not Murdered. He Forced Oregon Police To Shoot Him.

This source is clearly no liberal site. It gives an almost frame-by-frame analysis of the video. It's a better debunking of the Finicum "murder" lie than any official account of the episode will be.



The writer of the piece is Bob Owens whose name seems familar to me, somehow and it's not in a particular good way. I believe I've seen him scribble a lot of second amendment drivel at least once. But, apart from the standard sort of patois that all gun guys are fond of using, his account is a lucid and precise description of what's going on. He goes on:



Leaving the fact out that we didn't have a video of the Tamir Rice killing and only the cops' word for what happened and here we've got it all there to see, this is exactly what's going on.
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If Finicum had been murdered, do you really believe that the FBI would incriminate themselves by releasing the video? LOL.
 
Mr Person said:
Personal attacks on the OP don't make the OP wrong...
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True, It's the nonsensical claims he makes, which even after being proven embarrassingly wrong, continues.


You may want to read the whole thread before commenting.
 
ReverendHellh0und said:
True, It's the nonsensical claims he makes, which even after being proven embarrassingly wrong, continues.

You may want to read the whole thread before commenting.
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Erm...the post I was responding to - yours - was the third post in the thread. To judge its validity, I'm only going to read the two posts that existed before it.




What is wrong with what he said in his first post, factually speaking? I just watched the video a few times over the Finicum thread in the "polls" subforum. My read was:

Mr Person said:
I can't really tell. It looks like he had a gun out in his right hand at one point and may have been putting it back inside his jacket while he had his back to the camera (he was turning toward the cop on his left), but I just can't tell after that. I also can't be sure that it was a gun in his right hand rather than his hand waving about at changing angles to the lense. The view is just too fuzzy.

He was certainly flailing around his waist a lot, plus he was known to be armed; that alone can easily get you shot in such a situation...especially so if the cops already know about your statements of intent to go down fighting....doubly especially so if you've just tried to run a blockade, nearly hitting a cop.

The more you do, the more likely any gesture is going to be taken as a threat.
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In other words, if it wasn't deliberate suicide by cop (OP's seeming claim), then he couldn't have done much of a better job of it had he intended to.

You just don't conduct an armed takeover of property not your own, make a series of statements about how you'd prefer to die fighting, try to run a blockade, nearly hit a cop, exit your vehicle, and then start shouting and flailing your arms around your waist. Not if you mind being shot. Because they WILL shoot in that situation.
 
Mr Person said:
Erm...the post I was responding to - yours - was the third post in the thread. To judge its validity, I'm only going to read the two posts that existed before it.




What is wrong with what he said in his first post, factually speaking? I just watched the video a few times over the Finicum thread in the "polls" subforum. My read was:




In other words, if it wasn't deliberate suicide by cop (OP's seeming claim), then he couldn't have done much of a better job of it had he intended to.

You just don't conduct an armed takeover of property not your own, make a series of statements about how you'd prefer to die fighting, try to run a blockade, nearly hit a cop, exit your vehicle, and then start shouting and flailing your arms around your waist. Not if you mind being shot. Because they WILL shoot in that situation.
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seems you are having the same issue in two threads. Please review the thread for the back story.
 
ReverendHellh0und said:
seems you are having the same issue in two threads. Please review the thread for the back story.
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Seems you have serious problems actually responding to what people say. I tried to follow your intellectually dishonest invitation to "review the thread" but noted that all you did was continue to make personal attacks on him:

ReverendHellh0und said:
He's chasing windmills.
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(4th post)

Then you smeared him by accusing him of smearing "people who believe in natural rights":

ReverendHellh0und said:
I'm sure somebody has made that claim, This is his attempt to smear people who believe in natural rights, some of which are enumerated in the bill of rights.
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(5th post).

Then, ramblings about what you think is the purpose of the thread - again avoiding the thread's topic of whether it was suicide by cop:

ReverendHellh0und said:
It's the thrux, of the thread, by design.
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If you cannot stay on the basic topic of whether or not Finicum intended suicide by cop, then pray don't lecture anyone else on reviewing the thread.

My take on the question of whether Finicum intended suicide by cop is at the end of page four. If you would like to address that, please do. Anything else is a continuation of thread derailment.
 
Mr Person said:
Personal attacks on the OP don't make the OP wrong...
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The OP of this thread was created as a butthurt response to the beating taken as a result of the false premise behind the creation of this thread...

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...ustified-says-fbi-covering-up-real-story.html

From the OP...

I've been comparing the rightwing response to this killing to that of the outrage in the black community over the killing of Michael Brown. We remember how far the rightwing went to justify that killing of an unarmed black man and how grotesquely hypocritical those very same cop supporters are being now. But that is their usual m.o. And then they whine when their well-deserved ridicule is "awarded."
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The OP is trying to suggest that the people who defended the actions of the Ferguson police are being hypocritical by condemning the actions of the FBI in this case. There's just one problem... no one is condemning the actions of the FBI in this case. Well, maybe an isolated idiot here or there, but that isn't what he suggested. He suggested MASS outrage on the scale of the reaction to Ferguson.

Probably a good idea to get the back story first.;)
 
Jack Fabulous said:
The OP of this thread was created as a butthurt response to the beating taken as a result of the false premise behind the creation of this thread...

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...ustified-says-fbi-covering-up-real-story.html

From the OP...



The OP is trying to suggest that the people who defended the actions of the Ferguson police are being hypocritical by condemning the actions of the FBI in this case. There's just one problem... no one is condemning the actions of the FBI in this case. Well, maybe an isolated idiot here or there, but that isn't what he suggested. He suggested MASS outrage on the scale of the reaction to Ferguson.

Probably a good idea to get the back story first.;)
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Ugh.

I am trying to discuss the substantive question of whether or not Finicum intended suicide by cop, which is what the OP is about. The link you provide isn't in the OP.

I'm not interested in discussing whether or not you and Reverend have a problem with the poster who started the thread, so I'm not going to pick through every last thread on DP find out what the "backstory" of your problem with him is.

Because, again, I am trying to discuss the substantive question of whether or not Finicum intended suicide by cop.....

Since I am the only one who does seem to want to discuss that.... whatever... later...
 
Mr Person said:
Ugh.

I am trying to discuss the substantive question of whether or not Finicum intended suicide by cop, which is what the OP is about. The link you provide isn't in the OP.

I'm not interested in discussing whether or not you and Reverend have a problem with the poster who started the thread, so I'm not going to pick through every last thread on DP find out what the "backstory" of your problem with him is.

Because, again, I am trying to discuss the substantive question of whether or not Finicum intended suicide by cop.....

Since I am the only one who does seem to want to discuss that.... whatever... later...
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You could always start your own thread about it.:shrug:
 
Mr Person said:
Seems you have serious problems actually responding to what people say. I tried to follow your intellectually dishonest invitation to "review the thread" but noted that all you did was continue to make personal attacks on him:



(4th post)

Then you smeared him by accusing him of smearing "people who believe in natural rights":



(5th post).

Then, ramblings about what you think is the purpose of the thread - again avoiding the thread's topic of whether it was suicide by cop:








If you cannot stay on the basic topic of whether or not Finicum intended suicide by cop, then pray don't lecture anyone else on reviewing the thread.

My take on the question of whether Finicum intended suicide by cop is at the end of page four. If you would like to address that, please do. Anything else is a continuation of thread derailment.
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You should whine some more. I've already addressed all of your points in my previous posts.

But the really character identifying marker here is how you accuse me of being dishonest while ignoring the fact this op outright lied and proven so.

So forgive me if I am not in a rush to repeat myself for you or to acknowledge your fake outrage. *shrug*


in fact the op's lie about me actually answers your last paragraph regarding my actual position on the topic. Somehow you missed this
 
digitusmedius said:
I'm not an errand boy or a tutor for people who can't find things on their own. You asked "who" was claiming that and I gave you the names of members* to check on and now you want me to go fetch their actual comments. This is typical laziness of rightwingers. It's also a standard trolling technique by which they, i.e., you in this instance, try to protract and derail a topic that makes them squirm.

*I left out a very insistent advocate for the feds murdering Finicum calling himself "jmotivator." So now you've been given four names to ignore.
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There's at least one TV star that stated he doesn't believe you. Bob Newhart.
 
Lavoy Finicum was part of a group that pretty much declared war on the United States of America. He got what was coming to him.
 
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