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Union Posts Names of Non-Members, Urges Shunning

stonewall50 said:
Oh. So it doesn't need to be treated as a problem if it is the union hm?




How about not providing those individuals with a hit list?
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I have asked you for evidence that this allegation of union violence is true and factual. You have NOT provided the information requested.
 
haymarket said:
I have asked you for evidence that this allegation of union violence is true and factual. You have NOT provided the information requested.
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I did. You ignored it. Are you saying it doesn't happen?
 
haymarket said:
I have asked you for evidence that this allegation of union violence is true and factual. You have NOT provided the information requested.
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c'mon
get with it!

you know if someone who was a member of the first baptist church became violent it would only be because he was a Christian

now replace the words in bold font with "union" and "union member" and we have the same, infallible principle
 
stonewall50 said:
I did. You ignored it. Are you saying it doesn't happen?
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Neither you nor anyone else in this discussion has presented any verifiable evidence that union sanctioned criminal activity is being engaged in on a scale which would constitute any national problem.

Of course we have isolated incidents of individuals taking things too far and engaging in behavior which they should not have. Given that we have millions upon millions of people in the unions - that is possible just like there are unacceptable behaviors in any large group like that.

But that does NOT constitute a problem with unions.
 
justabubba said:
c'mon
get with it!

you know if someone who was a member of the first baptist church became violent it would only be because he was a Christian

now replace the words in bold font with "union" and "union member" and we have the same, infallible principle
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You are pretending like only one side is prone to extremism. I'm not the one who worships the grounds that mobsters, I mean unions walk on. I'm not pretending that unions are these infallible God given defenders of freedom for the working man. I'm fully aware of their history. Are you?

'Donnie Brasco' says Mob controls construction via unions - Montreal - CBC News

Now you really expect me to defend tactics that resemble mafia intimidation tactics?
 
haymarket said:
Neither you nor anyone else in this discussion has presented any verifiable evidence that union sanctioned criminal activity is being engaged in on a scale which would constitute any national problem.

Of course we have isolated incidents of individuals taking things too far and engaging in behavior which they should not have. Given that we have millions upon millions of people in the unions - that is possible just like there are unacceptable behaviors in any large group like that.

But that does NOT constitute a problem with unions.
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Who controls the unions? A small number. You want my "sympathy?" Stop extorting and intimidating the little guy. Stop trying to force him to line your pockets and the pockets of your favorite politicians.

'Donnie Brasco' says Mob controls construction via unions - Montreal - CBC News

We all know how bad unions get. So when they start posting up the names of people who don't want to be a part of those extortion rackets...they have a good reason to fear them.

Infiltrated Labor Unions | CRIMINAL-OCGS | Department of Justice
 
stonewall50 said:
Yea I figured you would sneak away from acknowledging the not so heroic past of the Union.
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Your quip makes no sense on any level. You asked who makes the decisions in running a union - I told you it was the membership. That is a fact. That is reality. That is how unions are structured.

But perhaps you can tell us of your own union membership experience which runs contrary to that?
 
haymarket said:
Your quip makes no sense on any level. You asked who makes the decisions in running a union - I told you it was the membership. That is a fact. That is reality. That is how unions are structured.

But perhaps you can tell us of your own union membership experience which runs contrary to that?
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That (bolded above) is not exactly true. Members choose leaders that then make decisions on their behalf, much like any US local or state government is structured. Unpopular acts still occur yet if they do not result in the election of new leaders to reverse them they stand. I doubt that much of the union's political funding decisions are even presented to the membership much less put up for a vote.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
That (bolded above) is not exactly true. Members choose leaders that then make decisions on their behalf, much like any US local or state government is structured. Unpopular acts still occur yet if they do not result in the election of new leaders to reverse them they stand. I doubt that much of the union's political funding decisions are even presented to the membership much less put up for a vote.
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I belonged to a teachers union which was a part of the American Federation of Teachers and then AFL-CIO and our charter had to be approved by the governing body. Part of that charter makes the membership the decision making body which tells the leaders what to do. This is carried out through the mechanism of monthly membership meetings at which every member can participate and vote.

I participated in many a meeting where we endorsed certain candidates and allocated funds and it was done by a vote of the membership. Yes, there is a leadership structure which makes day to day decisions, but the membership is the ultimate authority. which can override a decision of the leadership by a vote of the members at the meeting or even through a special ballot vote for all members.
 
haymarket said:
I belonged to a teachers union which was a part of the American Federation of Teachers and then AFL-CIO and our charter had to be approved by the governing body. Part of that charter makes the membership the decision making body which tells the leaders what to do. This is carried out through the mechanism of monthly membership meetings at which every member can participate and vote.
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Are you asserting that each political contribution, including the donee name and amount, was put to a vote during a membership meeting?
 
haymarket said:
Your quip makes no sense on any level. You asked who makes the decisions in running a union - I told you it was the membership. That is a fact. That is reality. That is how unions are structured.

But perhaps you can tell us of your own union membership experience which runs contrary to that?
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So you as members decided which politicians to pay for? Hm? You decided what to lobby? Did you also decide what to do about those who didn't join?
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Are you asserting that each political contribution, including the donee name and amount, was put to a vote during a membership meeting?
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Not at all. As I said, the leadership, in this case our union Executive Board which was elected by a vote of the membership and who stands for election every two years can also endorse and contribute. But that can then be subject to being override by the next membership meeting.
 
stonewall50 said:
So you as members decided which politicians to pay for? Hm? You decided what to lobby? Did you also decide what to do about those who didn't join?
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The only discussion I can ever recall in over thirty years of meetings was how much agency shop fees were and why they were a bit lower than the union shop fee.

added: we did have yearly two day workshops for Building reps or what some would call union stewards - and participated in those for over 20 years. I do remember stats being told to us that less than 30 or 40 people out of nearly 11,000 were non union members and paid the agency shop fee. I never was in a school where we had anything less than 100% union membership.
 
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haymarket said:
Not at all. As I said, the leadership, in this case our union Executive Board which was elected by a vote of the membership and who stands for election every two years can also endorse and contribute. But that can then be subject to being override by the next membership meeting.
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LOL! Of course each and every one of these proposed actions is presented in advance at such meetings. ;)

You cannot override that which already has occurred or that you didn't know about. How, exactly do you undo or override a political contribution, or any other expenditure, that has already been made?
 
haymarket said:
The only discussion I can ever recall in over thirty years of meetings was how much agency shop fees were and why they were a bit lower than the union shop fee.

added: we did have yearly two day workshops for Building reps or what some would call union stewards - and participated in those for over 20 years. I do remember stats being told to us that less than 30 or 40 people out of nearly 11,000 were non union members and paid the agency shop fee. I never was in a school where we had anything less than 100% union membership.
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Oh. So because they are an extreme minority they can be discriminated against then? Right?
 
stonewall50 said:
Oh. So because they are an extreme minority they can be discriminated against then? Right?
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Is there some reason which prevents you from actually stopping with the rhetoric and introducing the verifiable evidence that union sanctioned violence is some sort of nation problem that needs to be dealt with?
 
Bassman said:
The main problem I have with unions is they FORCE their membership to vote in elections a certain way.
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i do not believe you can cite any proof of that allegation of illicit behavior by the unions
 
Bassman said:
What do you mean illicit? I know of union members who were ostracized because they DARED to vote their conscience.
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ok, all you keep offering is unsubstantiated half-assed opinion
instead, give us proof that unions "FORCE their membership to vote in elections a certain way"
i believe you are just making this **** up rather than having anything which documents your post's assertion
 
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