• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Michael Savage: Here's how to stop Obama Amnesty

They can cut line items costs from the amnesty bill to make it harder to implement....I hope.

There is no amnesty bill. The Obama plan seems to be to issue stay in the country passes to (selectively) prevent the "accidental" deportation of his favorite illegal aliens. It seems unlikely that congress critters are smart enough to figure out what (out of thousands of pages of federal "budget" nonsense) could prevent that (relatively) tiny amount of federal spending.
 
They can cut line item costs from the amnesty bill to make it harder to implement....I hope.

Heya WCH. :2wave: McConnell was talking with Cruz about using the Stop Gap Measure to not fund DHS. Which IMO is the way to go.
 
I don't think either party in gov is anti amnesty. Dems want voters and a bigger uneducated population to manipulate while reps are afraid to make Hispanics mad and want cheap labor.
If that's what the Repubs are thinking, then they better think twice, as amnesty and legalization of 22-23 million people will cause wage scales to plummet, and that won't make many Americans happy when they're fending off the resultant depressing recession.

Also, since legalization will likely lead to citizenship, making these "undocumented Democrats" voters, the Repubs can kiss the popular-voted Presidency of the U.S. good-bye for many decades.

No, there's two good reasons here why the Repubs have not put forth any legislation on the matter.

But the best reason, of course, is that there's nothing wrong with our present systems relating to the problem of illegal aliens -- their statutes simply need to be enforced.
 
Heya WCH. :2wave: McConnell was talking with Cruz about using the Stop Gap Measure to not fund DHS. Which IMO is the way to go.

Yep since there was a border enforcement assumption, taking away DHS monies would stifle some of.it.
 
We grow your food and produce the bulk of your energy. See how long you can get by without it. Besides, Gruber said you guys were stupid, and he's a really really smart man. Just ask him.

He said the American voters are stupid - that includes you. I'm probably about as concerned about what Gruber thinks of me as you are.

I have no problem with people who work an honest job, but for this guy to come in and say the liberal base is uneducated is laughable.
 
If that's what the Repubs are thinking, then they better think twice, as amnesty and legalization of 22-23 million people will cause wage scales to plummet, and that won't make many Americans happy when they're fending off the resultant depressing recession.

Also, since legalization will likely lead to citizenship, making these "undocumented Democrats" voters, the Repubs can kiss the popular-voted Presidency of the U.S. good-bye for many decades.

No, there's two good reasons here why the Repubs have not put forth any legislation on the matter.

But the best reason, of course, is that there's nothing wrong with our present systems relating to the problem of illegal aliens -- their statutes simply need to be enforced.


Legislation can be passed wherein they can be legal to get a perm green card.....but then they cannot Vote.

Demos wont like it.....but once they lose the Presidency. Nothing they can do about it, huh?
 
He said the American voters are stupid - that includes you. I'm probably about as concerned about what Gruber thinks of me as you are.

I could be stupid, but it's certainly not dependent on my vote. I never supported the ACA, and that lack of support was precisely because of it's impossibility from the start, and because I could see the Gruberization that took place to get it passed as a result.

I have no problem with people who work an honest job, but for this guy to come in and say the liberal base is uneducated is laughable.

Just keep in mind that the people saying such things are actually running the government here right now. We're paying them for this.
 
Yep since there was a border enforcement assumption, taking away DHS monies would stifle some of.it.


Here is the one wrinkle.



One wrinkle in the emerging Republican plan is that the agency that actually issues work permits, the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services, is almost entirely (95 percent) self-funded. That means that during past government shutdowns 97 precent of USCIS employees kept working.

This does not mean, however, that Obama could veto legislation that defunded USCIS and his amnesty would continue without a hitch. USCIS only has a set number of employees, and without new legislation or funding, Obama does not have the ability to significantly boost their output.

At current staffing levels, USCIS issues about 1 million green cards per year. And when Obama enacted his first executive amnesty, the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals in 2012, wait times for legal immigrants to get their visas tripled from under five months to over 15 months. Only about 1 million illegal immigrants were eligible to apply for DACA amnesty and only about 600,000 were given amnesty......snip~


How Republicans Will Respond To Obama's Executive Amnesty - Conn Carroll
 
I could be stupid, but it's certainly not dependent on my vote. I never supported the ACA, and that lack of support was precisely because of it's impossibility from the start, and because I could see the Gruberization that took place to get it passed as a result.

It was as dependent on your vote as it was mine.

Just keep in mind that the people saying such things are actually running the government here right now. We're paying them for this.

If you are asking me to defend politicians, you're talking to the wrong guy. I hate politicians. They are the most useless group of people on the face of the Earth. How great - a people that make decisions for the rest of us, and yet they know nothing about anything.
 
If that's what the Repubs are thinking, then they better think twice, as amnesty and legalization of 22-23 million people will cause wage scales to plummet...

It's funny to see the right now be concerned about wages. I'm 62 years old and retired. I remember the past 40 years of working in a machine shop. Wage have not nearly kept up since Reagan.
 
It was as dependent on your vote as it was mine.

Even so, I was part of the loyal opposition.

If you are asking me to defend politicians, you're talking to the wrong guy. I hate politicians. They are the most useless group of people on the face of the Earth. How great - a people that make decisions for the rest of us, and yet they know nothing about anything.

I don't hate 'em. I expect them to be what they are, and that's not a whole lot different than your description.
 
What amazes me most about all this is that so many people are openly willing to defend lawless rule by a President--any President--of the U.S. Millions of Americans must now either be ignorant of basic civics, or be apathetic about maintaining a free country.

The Constitution gives the President the power to "grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States . . . ." Art. II, sec. 2, cl. 1. This pardon power is entirely the President's. The purpose of it is to allow the President, in unusual cases, to relieve a person from being punished by the law where special circumstances made that punishment unjust.

This is something like the power British monarchs had had. There is a famous old case from England involving two survivors of a shipwreck, at death's door after days at sea in a lifeboat with no food or water. In desperation, they killed a third man--who was even worse off and would certainly have died within hours anyway--and ate him. This saved their lives, but legally it was murder. When the two finally got back to England and the facts came out, they were tried and convicted. This upheld the law. But to prevent the injustice of punishing the men for murder when they had acted under such bizarre circumstances, the Queen later pardoned them.

Not quite like pardoning a whole class of people numbering in the millions, I'd say. It distorts the pardon power into a license for a President to ignore the expressed will of the people by making the law say whatever he wants.

And it is just as false for the President to explain away his refusal to arrest or deport millions of illegal aliens as "prosecutorial discretion." It is no such thing, by any stretch of the imagination. The purpose of prosecutorial discretion is simple--to direct the fixed resources of the Justice Department where you will get the most bang for the buck. It might make sense, for example, to have federal prosecutors invest less time and effort in prosecuting minor marijuana offenses and more in prosecuting major traffickers in heroin and cocaine. But to use this power as nothing but an excuse to fail to enforce laws you personally disagree with is to abuse it. It is a violation of the President's constitutional duty to "take care that the laws be faithfully executed." Art. II, sec. 3.

Worse than either the abuse of the pardon power or of prosecutorial discretion, though, is granting illegal aliens positive benefits such as work permits or certificates of dispensation from deportation. There is not even a scrap of authority, however far-fetched, that a President can cite for doing that. It is completely lawless. I hope the House will do its duty and refuse to fund this lawlessness. We don't have kings in this country, and if we want to keep it a free country, we can never afford to let any President act like one.
 
Please warn when linking to WND. SOme of us do not like giving page views to a source that lies so often, and promotes conspiracy nonsense.

I read the quote, saw I was in the non-MSM forum and elected not to click the link. I suggest the same process for you.
 
Legislation can be passed wherein they can be legal to get a perm green card.....but then they cannot Vote.

Demos wont like it.....but once they lose the Presidency. Nothing they can do about it, huh?
I sure hope that injustice to American citizens (permanent green card) doesn't happen, as that means they get to keep their ill-gotten gains and Americans whom they stole from don't get restitution justice.

That's just wrong.

But, if by virtue of having that permanent green card means they can apply for citizenship .. and get preferential treatment because they're already here and have been here so long ... :shock:

The only way "they cannot vote" works in this lesser of many evils solution is if they can never become citizens.
 
It's funny to see the right now be concerned about wages. I'm 62 years old and retired. I remember the past 40 years of working in a machine shop. Wage have not nearly kept up since Reagan.
Everyone should be concerned about wage scales plummeting, which is what will happen the moment millions of illegal aliens get legalized to work above the table in America.

It's the plummeting that's the great concern.

That will crush the buying power of so many people that layoffs will occur, further crushing buying power, resulting in further layoffs ... :shock:
 
I sure hope that injustice to American citizens (permanent green card) doesn't happen, as that means they get to keep their ill-gotten gains and Americans whom they stole from don't get restitution justice.

That's just wrong.

But, if by virtue of having that permanent green card means they can apply for citizenship .. and get preferential treatment because they're already here and have been here so long ... :shock:

The only way "they cannot vote" works in this lesser of many evils solution is if they can never become citizens.



I was told there are perm Green Cards.....but they don't have US citizenship. Nor can they vote. But are legal here, pay taxes and pay their way.
 
I was told there are perm Green Cards.....but they don't have US citizenship. Nor can they vote. But are legal here, pay taxes and pay their way.
Yes .. but .. it's still a step in the direction of eventual citizenship.

The camel gets its nose (amnesty-legalization) under the tent, as they say in the Middle East, and thus the rest (citizenship) is sure to follow.

If these green cards were temporary and they come with a "forever you can never be a citizen unless you leave and file papers and wait in line like everyone else), then this evil wouldn't be as evil.

But these green cards are permanent, and they don't come with a "you can never ever be a citizen" clause.

So they get to stay, and keep Americans' jobs, and pay taxes that Americans are supposed to be paying.

So they get to pay their way .. pay their way out of being brought to justice for their multiple crimes, pay their way out of having to make restitution to Americans and give back their stolen goods.

Though this may be what Obama has in mind, it's simply wrong, and for so many reasons.
 
Yes .. but .. it's still a step in the direction of eventual citizenship.

The camel gets its nose (amnesty-legalization) under the tent, as they say in the Middle East, and thus the rest (citizenship) is sure to follow.

If these green cards were temporary and they come with a "forever you can never be a citizen unless you leave and file papers and wait in line like everyone else), then this evil wouldn't be as evil.

But these green cards are permanent, and they don't come with a "you can never ever be a citizen" clause.

So they get to stay, and keep Americans' jobs, and pay taxes that Americans are supposed to be paying.

So they get to pay their way .. pay their way out of being brought to justice for their multiple crimes, pay their way out of having to make restitution to Americans and give back their stolen goods.

Though this may be what Obama has in mind, it's simply wrong, and for so many reasons.


Heya OG. :2wave: Yeah, not that I don't think it takes away from those born here. I am not found of increasing Worker Visas and Student Visas either.
 
Word is, Obama will reveal his anticipated EO on the 21st. That's the day after tomorrow. If he does show his hand, then we'll actually know what we're discussing the day after tomorrow.

Knowing what we're discussing... now that will be refreshing, don't you think?
 
What about the 'purse'?

There are only so many resources. The executive branch at any level of government has prosecutorial discretion as to where to best apply those resources. For example: police officers may have a policy to not pull anyone over unless they are 10+ miles an hour over the speed limit. You could argue that they're unilaterally increasing in the speed limit by 10 miles an hour. But we all understand the necessity of such a policy. It doesn't make the police force lawless or dictatorial.

Congress could certainly use the power of the purse to allocate additional resources towards deportation. But threatening to cut off resources to protest an action when the entire justification for that action is a lack of resources.. Well that's just a bit counterproductive.
 
Back
Top Bottom