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Thread: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    Again, answer my question and I will answer yours.


    Actually, I am not sure exactly what you are asking. can you rephrase?
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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Either you believe that an ISP should not be able to prioritize their content over their competitors content or you don't. Once you accept that, its then just a question of how best to accomplish such a principle with public policy.
    I personally believe that content that is more latent susceptible should be prioritized.

    So in this case, I am in favor of prioritizing content based on the content itself, not based on where the content originates.

    What I am not in favor of, is allowing people that have little or no understanding of technology to rule on these issues, which is what you are apparently seeking. Once we allow government to make laws to regulate this, the people that have very little idea how things work will be put in charge.

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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Hyperbolic nonsense.
    He said he wanted it to remain the way it is.
    Which is entirely idiotic given how ISPs have engaged in throttling. There is literally nothing stopping Time Warner and Comcast from engaging in a pay per page view form of internet tiering.

    You do not obtain neutrality by classifying it as a utility, which is what he opposes.
    Actually you do. Classifying it as a utility would allow the FCC to force ISPs to treat all packets of data the same.

    The only reason that he may not, is that it is a dishonest question in regards to the topic.
    No, he won't answer because he doesn't understand the topic outside of using it bash Obama. US Conservative is an extremist partisan who will always turn every topic he can into "why he hates democrats" and completely ignore the actual topic.

    The real question in regards to this topic should be; Can you tell us how classifying the internet as a utility restricts innovation?
    Cruz already answered that question.
    If you think he answered that question, I have ocean front property to sell you in Switzerland.

    Cruz is against trying to achieve neutrality by classifying the internet as a utility.
    Which is what his comments are about.
    As he stated in his published opinion, the following is what he wants.
    To which he has zero explanations on how to do that. Meaning Cruz is entirely for letting the ISPs throttle all they want since he is against NN and against any form of regulation to ensure that all packets of data are treated the same.

    Cruz's motto is "let's do nothing while they screw us over."
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    And again. That is a discussion for a different thread

    Meaning you have nothing.


    Expected.

    All you can do is complain. You never, ever, ever offer any solutions.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by tacomancer View Post
    So you have nothing them. Typical from what I've seen of your post history.

    My point stands, Cruz was wrong and innovation happened
    Excon is limited to complaining. You will never see him offer a solution because has none.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    But it's not about paying for bandwidth. Lets take his example.

    Company X and Company Y are consulting companies. They both have a plan purchased through the cable company that provides them with a 30 Mbps download speed, with a clear caveat in the fine print that the speed could be lower due to network congestion.

    Company X uses Adobe Connect as their means of teleconferencing. Adobe has an agreement in place with the cable company where they pay the cable company $X amount of money in order for their service to be on a "fast lane". Company X thus is able to do their teleconference at their full 30 Mbps speed they're paying for

    Company Y uses Webex as their means of teleconferencing. WebEx has no such agreement with the cable company. As such, the ISP throttles WebEx's services over their network, causing Company Y to only be able to do their video conference at 10 Mpbs.

    Company X and Y are paying for the same amount of bandwidth. However, because the service Company X is using pays the ISP money they actually get to use all that speed they're paying for. Meanwhlie, because the service Company Y uses doesn't pay, Company Y is hit with a reduction in speeds that is not network congestion related, therefore not geting their moneys worth.

    This isn't a case of Company X paying for more bandwidth then Company Y....they're paying the same money for the same bandwidth. But because a company on the other end didn't give the ISP money, their data is slowed down, and Company Y is screwed out of what it's paying for unless it changes its teleconferencing service.

    That arguably could screw up competition, but it becomes even worse if you imagine a scenario where Adobe doesn't just pay to keep its data in the "fast lane" (which is really just the normal lane), but rather pays an extra amount on top of that to be the exclusive teleconference service for that ISP...meaning if you use that ISP, it's either Adobe OR a slowed down teleconference service.

    A scenario like that is not allowable under net neutrality ideals and principles. It's ENTIRELY possible with what Verizon and other ISPs have been arguing for in front of courts that allows them to discriminate against data for any reason they want and allows for them to demand payment from content providers or else have their data throttled.
    I hear where you're coming from but that just doesn't seem likely to me. It would be silly for an ISP to tie up a vendor like that. They'd be stuck with that particular vendors product no matter what anyone else came up with and their customers would revolt over not having choices.

    The flip side is that by charging more for certain services they can turn that additional revenue into improved infrastructure faster than before. I know that being anti-corporate is the "in thing" these days but corporations as a whole just plain are not as mean and evil as people make them out to be.

  7. #237
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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    I personally believe that content that is more latent susceptible should be prioritized.

    So in this case, I am in favor of prioritizing content based on the content itself, not based on where the content originates.

    What I am not in favor of, is allowing people that have little or no understanding of technology to rule on these issues, which is what you are apparently seeking. Once we allow government to make laws to regulate this, the people that have very little idea how things work will be put in charge.
    First off if you have read all my posts in this thread, then you should know that earlier I stated I am quite leery of a bunch of lawyers that are completely ignorant of the subject (ie: Ted Cruz) writing laws that govern this.

    That said, if we are going to enforce a common carrier principle for internet providers - which is what net neutrality is, then there has to be some sort of oversight. Hell I can setup a QoS class and policy about as quick as I can write this post, so without some sort of minimal regulatory oversight, how do you propose we prevent the Comcasts and Time Warners out there from doing the same?
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    I hear where you're coming from but that just doesn't seem likely to me. It would be silly for an ISP to tie up a vendor like that. They'd be stuck with that particular vendors product no matter what anyone else came up with and their customers would revolt over not having choices.

    The flip side is that by charging more for certain services they can turn that additional revenue into improved infrastructure faster than before. I know that being anti-corporate is the "in thing" these days but corporations as a whole just plain are not as mean and evil as people make them out to be.


    Verizon and comcast throttled Netflix until Netflix paid the ransom,

    Netflix Agrees To Pay Comcast To End Slowdown
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  9. #239
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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Yes. Nonsense.
    I am glad that you realize what you said was exaggerated nonsense.
    Good for you!


    That smiley is a winking for a reason.
    it sure is there buddy...

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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    I hear where you're coming from but that just doesn't seem likely to me. It would be silly for an ISP to tie up a vendor like that. They'd be stuck with that particular vendors product no matter what anyone else came up with and their customers would revolt over not having choices.

    The flip side is that by charging more for certain services they can turn that additional revenue into improved infrastructure faster than before. I know that being anti-corporate is the "in thing" these days but corporations as a whole just plain are not as mean and evil as people make them out to be.
    If I can implement QoS, CoS, and other Traffic Shaping policies to prioritize certain traffic over other traffic (ie: the companies that are paying me to prioritize my traffic), then there is far less of an incentive for me to upgrade my infrastructure as my "preferred" traffic is always the first in line. Moreover, in most markets I have no real competition, thus my end user customers can either continue to buy my service, or go with something much slower.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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