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Thread: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    I appreciate the up front answer Rev. But in my mind, this is just unrealistic. It's no different than Ron Paul droning on about being completely isolationist or like those who declare we should just remove marriage from governent all together as their ONLY option as it relates to that issue. It's a great stance to have in a smokey room with a bunch of collegues waxing philisophical regarding policy, but has little real impact on the real world.

    In an ideal world I agree, that's my prefered method for that as well. I said in another thread, in a perfect sort of world I'd say the backbone infastructure which is even more monopolized then the telecoms would continue to be regulated and subsidized by the government, while the actual middle men (the ISPs) would be far less regulated and far more open and free with a lower bar to hurdle to gain entry into the market place.

    But it's just extremely unlikely given the importance to the telecoms those things you speak of are and how much influence they have over politicians on both sides of the aisles...there's little to no chance that we see the government legitimately bust up their monopolies. So simply saying that's the answer, and looking at no other alternative, is no different in my eyes than saying "just leave things the way they are"....because ultimatley, realistically, that's what will happen. There's little to no chance those psued-monopolies are busted, and if that doesn't happen and that's all we say we want to try, then the reality is that we just go with the status quo.

    Even if you look at now, Cruz hasn't said one word about busting up the telecoms. Not a single one that I've seen. All he's done is **** on the Democratic proposals and tacitly suggest we just need to maintain the status quo.

    And the status quo is not working. The status quo has been a steady movement away from net neutrality proposals, with clear reasons to see that the telecoms have every intent to continue that push.


    Cruz is just another republocrat, will say enough to stir the pot and get headlines for his own run, so I am not to impressed with that guy.


    I'm a little less of an isolationist but I am also in the firm camp that we've had enough war for a country. I am also in the camp of removing marriage as a government institution, that said, like you I am also a realist, I know these things are not likely nor probable, in that sense I support a net neutrality as posted in my graphic, a simple law stating that Internet service providers and governments must treat all data on the Internet equally, not discriminating or charging differently basis of user, content, site, platform, application, type of attached equipment, or mode of communication.


    We don't need a regulatory body, we don't need a commission, czar or turn it into a utility like my gas bill. I think that's way to far in the other direction.
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  2. #142
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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    This has gottan really nuts.

    People who are against Net Neutrality are against it for purely political reasons and nothing more.

    There is no reason to do away with Net Neutrality, to do so would be incredibly harmful to small businesses, entrepreneurs and innovation, things conservatives claim to champion.

    The only people, THE ONLY people who benefit from Net Neutrality being torn down is big corporations.

    There is no more transparent issue than this one that clearly shows what side many extremist and ignorant conservatives are on and that isn't regular folks.

  3. #143
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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    Again, you're missing the point. You're paying for that bandwidth. If you watch Netflix, or Hulu, or Amazon Prime, or host a website.. it doesn't matter. All of those packets should be treated the same. How an ISP handles peak vs average bandwidth is entirely up to the agreement between you and the ISP. An ISP can throttle it's biggest data users without violating net neutrality.

    What we're talking about is throttling down one provider like Hulu, but throttling up another provider like NetFlix. And all of the traffic is travelling over the same exact network.
    The problem is that the often cited Comcast/NetFlix issue has nothing to do wit that scenario. Also, while the traffic is traveling on the same network, the path it takes to get from point to point differs based on the path it takes. Indeed, the reason that Netflix was slowed during the peering contract dispute, rather than stopped all together, was because Netflix traffic simply routed through other peering relationships with the Comcast network. It wasn't "throttled", it was given the same QoS as any traffic coming from those other internet providers.

    So, does Net Neutrality enforce topology decisions for ISPs? Are ISPs now required to create peering relationships with all other networks to ensure equal access?
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  4. #144
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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This has gottan really nuts.

    People who are against Net Neutrality are against it for purely political reasons and nothing more.

    There is no reason to do away with Net Neutrality, to do so would be incredibly harmful to small businesses, entrepreneurs and innovation, things conservatives claim to champion.

    The only people, THE ONLY people who benefit from Net Neutrality being torn down is big corporations.

    There is no more transparent issue than this one that clearly shows what side many extremist and ignorant conservatives are on and that isn't regular folks.
    False. Your statement was born of a wrong generalization and didn't get better from there.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  5. #145
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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    Cruz is just another republocrat, will say enough to stir the pot and get headlines for his own run, so I am not to impressed with that guy.

    I'm a little less of an isolationist but I am also in the firm camp that we've had enough war for a country. I am also in the camp of removing marriage as a government institution, that said, like you I am also a realist, I know these things are not likely nor probable, in that sense I support a net neutrality as posted in my graphic, a simple law stating that Internet service providers and governments must treat all data on the Internet equally, not discriminating or charging differently basis of user, content, site, platform, application, type of attached equipment, or mode of communication.

    We don't need a regulatory body, we don't need a commission, czar or turn it into a utility like my gas bill. I think that's way to far in the other direction.
    Thank you.

    I can't tell you how refreshing it is to see someone who doesn't like the utility option actually put forth a clear, reasonable, realistic alternative.

    And I agree with you entirely. I would be far more interested in passing legislation mandating that all entities must treat data on the internet equally as you say, except in situations of legitimate network congestion issues where there are no other reasonable solutions. The issue with such a law is that it still would need regulation by SOME government body or else it'd have no teeth, and I don't necessarily mind the FCC being that body. But I agree with you, I'd prefer that method to the utility method IF there's legitimate grounds for the government to be able to enforce such a law.

    Also agree with you on my general neutral to sour view of Cruz. Doesn't impress me much, and instances like this are a great example of why.

  6. #146
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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This has gottan really nuts.

    People who are against Net Neutrality are against it for purely political reasons and nothing more.

    There is no reason to do away with Net Neutrality, to do so would be incredibly harmful to small businesses, entrepreneurs and innovation, things conservatives claim to champion.

    The only people, THE ONLY people who benefit from Net Neutrality being torn down is big corporations.

    There is no more transparent issue than this one that clearly shows what side many extremist and ignorant conservatives are on and that isn't regular folks.
    I don't think anyone is against it. Most folks oppose Franken's bill, because there's no telling what that bill will do. The Democrats don't have a good track record for passing legislation that is honest, transparent and isn't confused, convoluted and over-reaching. They're currently notorious for passing legislation that is, "written in a tortured way", so that they can take advantage of the, "stupidity of the American people".
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    Your selective quoting is quite telling.

    It's not exactly intellectually honest to concentrate on half of a statement, and ignore the bold.

    Why do you continue to ignore that option? You cannot claim to be for Net Neutrality, but against any means of actually achieving it. So once again, would you support any means of ensuring net neutrality?

    I am quoting to that which I am responding. No matter how much you may complain about that, there is nothing wrong or intellectually dishonest about it.

    As to what you emboldened. It was irrelevant and as such I was not responding to it. That shouldn't be that hard for you to understand.
    Especially as it is dishonest to try and discuss that which the topic isn't about and not even being argued.
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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Thank you.

    I can't tell you how refreshing it is to see someone who doesn't like the utility option actually put forth a clear, reasonable, realistic alternative.

    And I agree with you entirely. I would be far more interested in passing legislation mandating that all entities must treat data on the internet equally as you say, except in situations of legitimate network congestion issues where there are no other reasonable solutions. The issue with such a law is that it still would need regulation by SOME government body or else it'd have no teeth, and I don't necessarily mind the FCC being that body. But I agree with you, I'd prefer that method to the utility method IF there's legitimate grounds for the government to be able to enforce such a law.

    Also agree with you on my general neutral to sour view of Cruz. Doesn't impress me much, and instances like this are a great example of why.


    rest assured, no matter what happens, we can be guaranteed the government will **** it up to benefit themselves and those they protect.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by SlevinKelevra View Post
    As it is is a system with documented cases of ISP's not operating under net neutrality.

    So, you're saying he's on record with not wanting net neutrality then?
    I see. You are one of those people that likes trying to put words into another's mouth. Sorry that doesn't work with me.

    I am pointing out what he said.
    Funny thing here is that folks have been saying that we have NN as it is.


    What do I think he means?
    I am pretty sure that in context of all that he has said, it means he does not want it to be regulated as a Utility, just as it isn't now.
    It is funny how partisan hacks can't see that.
    Are you one of those partisan hacks?
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    Re: Ted Cruz Hits Back At Al Franken On Net Neutrality

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    In a sense Cruz is farming the idiots for their votes.
    In a sense, you share Professor Gruber's view of the electorate. We can't all come up to your standard of intelligence--why, Cruz himself probably misses it by a mile.

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