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Thread: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

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    Re: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    So you are saying that an ISP can not charge what it wants for what it provides?
    Is that about right?

    Interesting.
    The ISP doesn't provide content, they provide a conduit for you to access content produced by other people using hardware developed by other people running software developed by other people. They're not doing the innovating.

    You already pay and ISP to access the internet, content providers already pay ISPs to host content on the internet. So why should ISPs take a 3rd slice and charge content providers again?

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    Re: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Apparently you are not paying attention.
    "Cruz stated that he wants things to remain as they are. That is an alternative to classifying it as a utility."


    Again he stated he is for letting it remain as it is now.
    That is an alternative to Obama's governmental control proposal.
    ANnd far better than Gov control.


    Why is it those who have no valid arguments constantly bring up irrelevancies?
    I don't usually answer irrelevant questions, but as a sharer I have been aware for as long as you have, and have made both for and against arguments not only in ref to NN but to actual sharing as well.



    More irrelevancies. Figures.
    Show me where he has to have a sated position that was previously announced. Can you do that?
    Thought not.
    He doesn't have to have a previously stated position.



    Please note that is irrelevant as well.
    Especially as it appears that, like here, there are those who have no idea what they were speaking about.
    Cruz was speaking to what implementing NN by classifying it as a utility would bring. Which is not saying what NN is as the idiots were saying.
    You attempting to provided such nonsense in support of your position is absurd to an extreme. You thinking irrelevant bs holds any significance, speaks wholly to your own thoughts on this and does not reflect well.



    Still irrelevant.
    Kate Knibbs, some author of no merit.
    Not only that, but she is a wrong as the others you presented.
    So not just irrelevant, but also meaningless and invalid.

    This is a disingenuous, chicken**** political maneuver and nothing more.
    Yeah sure. Just as Obama's support of NN is.
    Her hyperbole discredits her.

    Ted Cruz and his team have the facts wrong about net neutrality. Obama specifically said the government would NOT be in charge of pricing: "I believe the FCC should reclassify consumer broadband service under Title II of the Telecommunications Act — while at the same time forbearing from rate regulation and other provisions less relevant to broadband services."
    She doesn't seem to understand that such regulation comes with the classification of Utility, just as the taxes that come with it are.
    That doesn't change because Obama says so.
    Right... no one understands this issue except Ted Cruz and yourself.

    The fact that you consider tech blogs, which aren't partisan in any way, to be irrelevant on an issue that is entirely tech related is extremely telling. This is like you telling an auto-mechanic that their expertise on fixing a car is irrelevant, because your hair dresser had a dream in which your car would be fixed if it only ran on Canadian air.

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    Re: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    The ISP doesn't provide content, they provide a conduit for you to access content produced by other people using hardware developed by other people running software developed by other people. They're not doing the innovating.

    You already pay and ISP to access the internet, content providers already pay ISPs to host content on the internet. So why should ISPs take a 3rd slice and charge content providers again?

    Remove that isp and you do not get that content. They are a provider, not the originator. Don't confuse the two.

    I swear, some folks try to be too specific for their own good.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    Right... no one understands this issue except Ted Cruz and yourself.
    Stop making false and absurd arguments.
    What is understood by me, and obviously not by you, is that it does not need to be brought about by classifying it as a Utility.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    The fact that you consider tech blogs, which aren't partisan in any way, to be irrelevant on an issue that is entirely tech related is extremely telling. This is like you telling an auto-mechanic that their expertise on fixing a car is irrelevant, because your hair dresser had a dream in which your car would be fixed if it only ran on Canadian air.

    You are talking nonsense now.
    Tech blogs can be and are as partisan as it gets and she clearly was.
    In this case what they see are the words "Net Neutrality", not the way it would be brought about, and that is the issue here.
    Obama's desire to bring it about in a way that is not needed, classifying it as a utility, and would open it up to far more political control and taxes.

    And yet here you are obviously for such nonsense. Figures.
    NN does not need to be brought about in this manner.



    Last edited by Excon; 11-20-14 at 07:46 AM.
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    Re: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    And you are wrong again. Figures.
    He is against classifying it as a utility to accomplish NN. Which this is about.
    He clearly stated he wanted things to remain they way they are.
    Your failure to acknowledge these things as well as what he actually said, continually makes you in the wrong.
    So come back when you have something valid to say.
    Why is Ted Cruz saying he's against net neutrality if he's not against net neutrality? The question here is whether or not the executive and legislative branch should be pushing net neutrality and how that should be accomplished. Without net neutrality, start ups and small businesses operating on the internet are completely screwed. What we're headed towards is an internet that caters only to the Amazons of the world.

    Cruz did not come out and say "I am for net neutrality but against classifying it as a utility." He said "I am against classifying the internet as a utility. Net neutrality is Obamacare for the internet." Then he makes a video whose title is "The Negative Consequences of Net Neutrality." You've said that Cruz isn't talking about net neutrality but he's using the term "net neutrality" an awful lot for somebody who isn't talking about it.

    After doing some reading, my take on this is that Cruz is intentionally trying to conflate Obama's calls to have to FCC regulate the internet and the completely separate issue of net neutrality. He's hammering in the idea that the government taking over the internet is net neutrality to change public opinion and create a base that will work for big business and prevent net neutrality from ever being turned into law. That also explains why Cruz is saying he wants things to "remain the way they are" instead of saying that he's for net neutrality. That way, when the internet becomes an inhospitable platform for small businesses and start ups, the foundation of all innovation, Cruz will say "it's a free market! That's the way it was, just like I said!" I mean it's just my opinion, but it's an opinion that seems to jive pretty well with reality.
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    Re: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    Why is Ted Cruz saying he's against net neutrality if he's not against net neutrality?
    In both his Opinion piece and his video, he is clearly speaking to Obama's suggestion for NN of classifying it as a Utility.
    Any other suggestion besides that is out of context.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    The question here is whether or not the executive and legislative branch should be pushing net neutrality and how that should be accomplished.
    Which is exactly what Cruz addressed.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    Without net neutrality, start ups and small businesses operating on the internet are completely screwed. What we're headed towards is an internet that caters only to the Amazons of the world.
    Odd. Franken has said that we have had NN all along.
    Yet these fears have not manifested itself in any major way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    Cruz did not come out and say "I am for net neutrality but against classifying it as a utility." He said "I am against classifying the internet as a utility.
    1. He does not have to say he is for NN when he is addressing and specifically against Obama's NN suggestion.
    2. Whether he is, or isn't for NN in principle, is irrelevant to his opposition to it being classified as a utility.
    3. Franken says that we have had NN all along, and as you pointed out, Cruz says he wants it to remain the same.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    Net neutrality is Obamacare for the internet."
    Which makes it clear he is speaking of what Obama's version of NN, which is reclassifying it as a utility which he also clearly addresses.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    Then he makes a video whose title is "The Negative Consequences of Net Neutrality." You've said that Cruz isn't talking about net neutrality but he's using the term "net neutrality" an awful lot for somebody who isn't talking about it.
    Specifically in rebuttal to Franken's bs about NN.
    And I seriously doubt the way his staff has labled the video matters one bit to the current argument.
    But here is a suggestion. Email or call his Office and ask?
    It is that simple.
    Ask he is opposed over all to NN or just what Obama is suggesting.
    To me, his overall position is irrelevant to opposing Obama's suggestion as Gov control by classification is not needed. Nor are the taxes that come along with such classification.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    After doing some reading, my take on this is that Cruz is intentionally trying to conflate Obama's calls to have to FCC regulate the internet and the completely separate issue of net neutrality.
    You are imagining things.
    But like I said, ask.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    He's hammering in the idea that the government taking over the internet is net neutrality to change public opinion and create a base that will work for big business and prevent net neutrality from ever being turned into law.
    Unlikely. Especially if legislation is introduced to give the FCC authority to keep the Net neutral and the power through fines to enforce it. That would not be any where near the control it would have over it as a utility and would not included the taxes of a Utility.


    As I have already pointed out, throttling and packet priority is already happening. Because it has too.
    That isn't going to change.
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    Re: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    ...3. Franken says that we have had NN all along, and as you pointed out, Cruz says he wants it to remain the same.
    Then Cruz is clearly lying.

    As I have already pointed out, throttling and packet priority is already happening. Because it has too.
    That isn't going to change.
    And without legislation to keep the Net neutral, there will be a lot more of both, and nearly all of it will be unnecessary and profit-motivated. You can bet your portfolio on that.
    I fight against the ignorant, irresponsible, and/or closed-minded.
    This group is the worst enemy of America and its freedoms. It includes, but is not limited to, all Trump supporters.

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    Re: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

    Quote Originally Posted by DifferentDrummr View Post
    Then Cruz is clearly lying.
    Not.
    You have no clue what he means by the same. In context it would mean without the imposed classification that Obama wants.
    Out of context is could simply mean neutral as it has been without any regulation.

    But since you say so; Prove it.


    Quote Originally Posted by DifferentDrummr View Post
    And without legislation to keep the Net neutral, there will be a lot more of both, and nearly all of it will be unnecessary and profit-motivated. You can bet your portfolio on that.
    There is going to be more period, whether NN exists or not, and no, it isn't unnecessary.

    And again, the net has been neutral, even Franken says so and these outrageous claims have not manifested in any significant fashion.
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    Re: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    You have no clue what he means by the same. In context it would mean without the imposed classification that Obama wants.
    Out of context is could simply mean neutral as it has been without any regulation.

    But since you say so; Prove it.
    The proof is in this very thread; you just haven't been paying attention.

    Why would Cruz be taking $47k from the major ISPs to keep "existing NN" the same?

    There is going to be more period, whether NN exists or not, and no, it isn't unnecessary.
    " Not. " On both counts.

    (See? Two can play that game.)
    I fight against the ignorant, irresponsible, and/or closed-minded.
    This group is the worst enemy of America and its freedoms. It includes, but is not limited to, all Trump supporters.

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    Re: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

    Quote Originally Posted by DifferentDrummr View Post
    The proof is in this very thread; you just haven't been paying attention.

    Why would Cruz be taking $47k from the major ISPs to keep "existing NN" the same?

    That isn't proving anything but you having an over active imagination. Nothing more.

    And Obama got more from their CEO's than he ever has.
    So what does your over active imagination tell you about that?

    Comcast, Time Warner execs have been big Obama supporters | TheHill

    Quote Originally Posted by DifferentDrummr View Post
    "doh Not. lamo" On both counts.

    (See? Two can play that game.)
    1. Your reply is idiotic as no game is being played.
    2. It is you who are wrong.
    There is going to be more period, whether NN exists or not, and no, it isn't unnecessary.
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    Re: Al Franken Explains Net Neutrality To Ted Cruz

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post

    That isn't proving anything but you having an over active imagination. Nothing more.

    And Obama got more from their CEO's than he ever has.
    So what does your over active imagination tell you about that?

    Comcast, Time Warner execs have been big Obama supporters | TheHill

    1. Your reply is idiotic as no game is being played.
    2. It is you who are wrong.
    There is going to be more period, whether NN exists or not, and no, it isn't unnecessary.
    Pot, meet kettle. The above is nothing but a bunch of "nuh-uh"s.

    To avoid further embarrassment to yourself, grow up and admit that you have nothing to support the claims you've been mindlessly repeating for the past several pages.
    I fight against the ignorant, irresponsible, and/or closed-minded.
    This group is the worst enemy of America and its freedoms. It includes, but is not limited to, all Trump supporters.

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