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Thread: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense' [W:406]

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    Re: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense'

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    No. High crimes and misdemeanors might be breaking the law. Or it might be violating the Constitution.

    I want him out of office. I want him in prison for the rest of his life.

    The violating the Constitution part isn't nearly that straightforward. Lincoln almost assuredly violated the Constitutional a number of times during the civil war. Would you have impeached him as well?

    And he'll never see prison. No President ever will.
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    Re: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense'

    Isn't there one person on the left who will address the question I asked?

    Here it is again:

    ... just think about the precedent Obama will be setting (using executive orders to decree new immigration law) and ask yourself if you will feel comfortable with a Republican president being able to do the very same thing with the laws and issues that are of great importance to you? If you can honestly say that you would be comfortable with that, then go after me with both guns... But if you can't, then it's about time that you, and every single liberal who feels the same way, to use your voices to stop this from happening.

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    Re: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense'

    Quote Originally Posted by Hari Seldon View Post
    Lets hope so. A sure fire way to get out the democratic vote. Go Tea Party Whackos!
    And it's a way to place crazy uncle Joe at the head of the table.



    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    If the president carries out this threat, I would wait and see what the people think. Polls have been conflicting at times on this issue. One poll says 63% of Americans are against the president acting along on amnesty. Yet on the same day another poll showed 51% of Americans in favor of amnesty. Which is it?

    As for impeachment, for impeachment to work the public has to be for it. Without the public approval it is bound to fail. Failure will give the Republicans another black eye like they got in their attempt to impeach President Clinton. In fact I think Obama would like nothing better than for the House to take up impeachment.

    Let the president go ahead, let the chips fall where they may and see how the American people react. There are other ways to deal with executive over reach. Keep in mind, impeachment is overthrowing an election result. If it is attempted, you better be darn sure the president has done something real horrible to warrant it and the people realize he has done something so horrible they want him out of office.

    Outside of that, take him to court, defund his initiatives, perhaps even a censure.
    It's going to depend on what he actually does to the immigration laws. If he allows for an eventual partial amnesty for existing immigrants to stay and contribute or if he allows for future illegals to easily have access. Those are two big differences and will draw different responses. The Republicans using the impeachment process to throw a Dem out, based on partisan politics, would hurt them. It needs to be a 2/3rds of the public and Congress to be successful, and even then you get a weaker gov't as a result. Remember the general public approval numbers for Congress, as a whole, are far worse than the President's.



    Quote Originally Posted by Grim17 View Post
    Impeaching the president will never fly because the main stream liberal media will never allow the American people to hear the facts, so in my opinion it simply isn't an option...

    Now with that said...

    Krauthammer's analysis, opinions and comparisons on the legality and future consequences of Obama taking action on the immigration issue, was absolutely spot on. It's simply mind blowing how democrats in Washington and the people on the political left are perfectly content with Obama taking such action. In my opinion it's quite a blow to the credibility of the political left and brings into question whether they can be trusted to govern this nation in the future.

    I know that my words may strike some, especially those on the left, as being harsh but just think about the precedent Obama will be setting and ask yourself if you will feel comfortable with a Republican president being able to do the very same thing with the laws and issues that are of great importance to you? If you can honestly say that you would be comfortable with that, then go after me with both guns... But if you can't, then it's about time that you, and every single liberal who feels the same way, to use your voices to stop this from happening.
    I agree it probably will not happen.

    I believe the Democrats and Republicans are both overreaching on many issues to try and get movement towards their sides. It may get an emotional reaction from their base and opposition, but it alienates the middle. And though, I may have a liberal view on some issues, I'm by no means a party liberal and registered as a Republican voter, with a moderate stance. Your assumption was incorrect.
    Last edited by grip; 11-15-14 at 02:08 PM.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

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    Re: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense'

    Quote Originally Posted by Risky Thicket View Post
    Substantively? Not much. But he could possibly look damned good doing it. That could be a problem for the GOP.

    Shooting straight from the hip I would think that impeaching Obama would piss off more people than the GOP can afford to piss off. Don't mistake the GOP win for a big "like" from America, it wasn't. The GOP doesn't have that much political capital to gamble on an impeachment hearing. Then there is the minority vote, which the party of angry old white dudes needs and will need more and more of in the future. I'm not an ethnic minority and thus I cannot speak for or with any real insight into ethnic communities, but I don't believe they are in love with either major party. I know for certain they aren't head over heels in love with the GOP. Many may equate impeachment with lack of respect, commitment, understanding of ethnic issues. Does the GOP really want to take that chance? Hell no, they don't.

    Have it all happen and problems over a Ferguson verdict, minority voters just aren't going to flock to the GOP. Then Biden becomes the President and doesn't screw anything up and looks good and trustworthy. It could happen. Biden isn't stupid. He's not diplomatic, LOL, but that could play in his favor,not being slick and polished at a time when most of us are sick of that crap.

    The establishment GOP is having none of that. They are better off having Obama finish his term and I think the establishment GOP are very much aware of that. Tea baggers? I don't know. Neocons? I have no idea. Krauthammer is in some ways like Limbaugh, except he is more educated.



    They do have their own civil war going. Looking at both ****ed up parties I never regret having left both behind.
    Most neoconservatives think impeachment is a waste of time. When they aren't obsessed with policy, they are thinking about shoring up support for the next election.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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    Re: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense'

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    And it's a way to place crazy uncle Joe at the head of the table.





    It's going to depend on what he actually does to the immigration laws. If he allows for an eventual partial amnesty for existing immigrants to stay and contribute or if he allows for future illegals to easily have access. Those are two big differences and will draw different responses. The Republicans using the impeachment process to throw a Dem out, based on partisan politics, would hurt them. It needs to be a 2/3rds of the public and Congress to be successful, and even then you get a weaker gov't as a result. Remember the general public approval numbers for Congress, as a whole, are far worse than the Presidents.





    I agree it probably will not happen.

    I believe the Democrats and Republicans are both overreaching on many issues to try and get movement towards their sides. It may get an emotional reaction from their base and opposition, but it alienates the middle. And though, I may have a liberal view on some issues, I'm by no means a party liberal and registered as a Republican voter, with a moderate stance. Your assumption was incorrect.
    I believe what you said in your reply to me is true. Ford was much weaker than even a wounded Nixon and was run over by the Democratic controlled congress back then. Yes, it all depends on what the president does. Before anyone starts using the I word, they better be sure the public is behind them. It sure isn't now.

    I will say this, after looking at the exist polls, so much of the anger, resentment at the Democrats was because of the economy. Getting into a fight on immigration reform instead of seeing what can be done to improve the economy is something that could hurt the new Republican majority before they are even seated and begin the new session.

    Let Obama do what Obama is going to do, then sit back and gauge the public's response. According to the exit polls, the public wants action on the economy over immigration by at least a 5-1 margin, 54% vs. 11%. Let the president and the Democrats put immigration first, that is not what the election results last week meant.

    If I were Mitch McConnell once Obama acts, I would say to the American people, "Now you know where the Democrats priority are, ours is to get the economy moving again.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense'

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Talk of impeachment at this point is largely premature. Lets see what he ACTUALLY proposes.

    If it literally grants anyone here illegally the ability to naturalize, then yes it's arguably an impeachable offense and given such a flagrant act at a time where the american voting base just sent forth a stout repudiation of the President and where it would be CLEARLY against the implied will of Congress I'd almost actually be able to get on board with such.

    If it simply allows them the ability to stay in the country legally for a few years then its likely not an impeachable offense and attempting to do such would just be a waste of time and the tax payers money.

    Right now we have no clue what he'll ACTUALLY do, so speculating on it is kind of worthless.
    Don't deflate Krauthammer's big erection. At his age he doesn't get them very often.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

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    Re: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense'

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    I believe what you said in your reply to me is true. Ford was much weaker than even a wounded Nixon and was run over by the Democratic controlled congress back then. Yes, it all depends on what the president does. Before anyone starts using the I word, they better be sure the public is behind them. It sure isn't now.

    I will say this, after looking at the exist polls, so much of the anger, resentment at the Democrats was because of the economy. Getting into a fight on immigration reform instead of seeing what can be done to improve the economy is something that could hurt the new Republican majority before they are even seated and begin the new session.

    Let Obama do what Obama is going to do, then sit back and gauge the public's response. According to the exit polls, the public wants action on the economy over immigration by at least a 5-1 margin, 54% vs. 11%. Let the president and the Democrats put immigration first, that is not what the election results last week meant.

    If I were Mitch McConnell once Obama acts, I would say to the American people, "Now you know where the Democrats priority are, ours is to get the economy moving again.
    Which impeachment would not do.

    but-thats-none-of-my2.jpg


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

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    Re: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense'

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim17 View Post
    Isn't there one person on the left who will address the question I asked?

    Here it is again:

    ... just think about the precedent Obama will be setting (using executive orders to decree new immigration law) and ask yourself if you will feel comfortable with a Republican president being able to do the very same thing with the laws and issues that are of great importance to you? If you can honestly say that you would be comfortable with that, then go after me with both guns... But if you can't, then it's about time that you, and every single liberal who feels the same way, to use your voices to stop this from happening.
    We know you would be.

    Lets see you answer this question: Did you know that the Constitution gives Obama the power to grant pardons to every illegal immigrant? What would be unconstitutional about him doing so?


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

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    Re: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense'

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim17 View Post
    Isn't there one person on the left who will address the question I asked?

    Here it is again:

    ... just think about the precedent Obama will be setting (using executive orders to decree new immigration law) and ask yourself if you will feel comfortable with a Republican president being able to do the very same thing with the laws and issues that are of great importance to you? If you can honestly say that you would be comfortable with that, then go after me with both guns... But if you can't, then it's about time that you, and every single liberal who feels the same way, to use your voices to stop this from happening.
    Obama isn't setting a precedent.

    How Obama has used executive powers compared to his predecessors - The Washington Post

    Bill Clinton was no stranger to far-reaching orders either. During his two terms in office, he banned the import of 50+ types of semi-automatic assault weapons and assault pistols, created the President’s Council on Sustainable Development (which forced America to become more sustainable in line with the U.N.’s Agenda 21) and focused federal attention on environmental justice for minority and low-income populations.
    Two other Republican leaders used their executive powers to great effect. In May 1989, George H. W. Bush temporarily halted the importation of some semi-automatic firearms, following a school shooting in Stockton, Calif. This was made permanent a month later.
    Ronald Reagan also enacted some significant policy initiatives through executive power. The NSA has said that its controversial collection of e-mail and Internet data, for example, was authorized back in 1981 by Reagan's executive order. His order on cattle grazing in 1986 continues to rile bloggers to this day and in 1987, and Reagan issued an executive order banning federal workers from using drugs on and off duty.
    Presidents create EOs some people don't like every year. From the liberal Forbes:

    When It Comes To Abuse Of Presidential Power, Obama Is A Mere Piker - Forbes

    FDR issued one that forcibly transferred Japanese-Americans and German-Americans to internment camps during World War II.
    Harry Truman issued an order to seize and nationalize all steel mills in America, during a labor strike in 1952. These were clearly rights-violating orders. On the positive side, in a famous 1957 order that was respectful of rights, Dwight Eisenhower decreed an end to racial segregation in America’s public schools.
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    Re: Krauthammer: 'Impeachable Offense'

    Quote Originally Posted by 1750Texan View Post
    You consider yourself a constitutionalist...Have you made case for impeachment? . . . I don't seem to recall your thread on making a case for impeachment.
    No. And I'm not interested in making a case for it here just to answer your disingenuous question. If you want to think there are not are not adequate grounds for impeaching your President, or that I couldn't state them, fine by me.

    Seems the GOP has failed in that simple task.
    Really? Doesn't seem that way at all to me. I haven't seen any Republican official even try, so far. That may change before long.

    What exact crime, misdemeanor, or violation of the Constitution has the President committed?
    I've made clear more than once in this thread--most recently in my last post--that no one had suggested Mr. Obama had violated any criminal law, or that he should be prosecuted for any crime. And yet you bring it up again.

    Impeachment by the House is nothing like a jury trial, with requirements for standard of proof, exclusion of certain evidence, unanimous verdicts, and so on. If a simple majority of the members of the House want to impeach an official, they don't need elaborate justifications for their vote. If an impeached official refuses to resign, the Senate may try him. And if two-thirds or more of the Senators present were to vote to convict, their vote would remove him from office.

    I love to check your constitutional reasoning.
    About what? Drafting articles of impeachment doesn't involve much constitutional reasoning, in the sense a Supreme Court decision does. If enough people think a high official has abused his office and want him removed from it, their representatives can find colorable reasons to impeach him, and then try him if necessary.

    If you want to learn about the Framers' reasons for including the impeachment process in the Constitution, or what they intended it to do, or anything else about it, there are plenty of articles about those things. I'm not interested in teaching basic civics to Obama's acolytes. There would be no point, because they have the same contempt for the Constitution that he does.
    Last edited by matchlight; 11-15-14 at 02:50 PM.

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