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Haley Barbour apologizes after calling Obama’s policies ‘tar babies’

soot said:
Right.

Because the folks who are going to get offended by this probably have the intellectual wherewithal to research the etymology of the phrase "tar baby" and conclude, "You know what? This rich, white, southern, conservative lobbyist is on point using this quasi-racist term correctly in this case. Let's give him a pass."

Bottom line is the guy might be right, but he's still tone deaf.

The Republican Party isn't going to earn any friends among a growing minority electorate when its "star players" consistently piss all over that electorate.

This isn't about "being right". It's about winning national elections.
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Which just happens to be a whole lot easier when your party is supported by the press. How hard could it be to include that etymology/definition in the story? What we seem to have is a "bad word" list that mainly (only?) applies to those "wrong thinking" folks that support the "other" party. Some folks can use redskins and not be labeled as bigots while others cannot - regardless of the exact same context (a sports team name). This makes political correctness simply amount to political bias.

This story is an example of one explaining the context, but not the etymlogy, of the use of the term tar baby:

GOP lawmaker Frank Ruff apologizes for calling Obamacare a “tar baby” - Salon.com
 
Why should he appologize for the literary ignorance of others ? Tar babies are exactly what they are.
 
tres borrachos said:
Spot on, Soot. This is the problem with comments like Barbour's. The Republicans want to win elections, but then do this. It's contradictory.

Barbour has been around a long time. He should have known that this was not going to help the party he has worked so hard to advance.
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Maybe Barbour cant get past this by inviting all his black friends over for fried chicken and watermelon.
 
polgara said:
Good morning, CJ. :2wave:

Excellent post! :thumbs: The term "tar baby" was never meant to be a racist slur - WTH is the matter with people? :shock:

How's your weather, CJ? You know why I'm asking! brrrr.....
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Good afternoon Lady P.

Weather here was beautiful yesterday, sunny and mild - Indian Summer weather, if that doesn't offend anyone :roll: - but today is a totally different story, cold, near freezing, very windy, but no snow, although flurries in the areas surrounding Toronto and further north. Temps are supposed to be just above freezing for the next couple of weeks, from what I've seen, but no real snow.

Time for you to be thinking about wintering in Texas, I guess.

Take care and have fun!
 
justabubba said:
apologize! ostracized! for what?
it was a very appropriate usage
some of Obama's policies ARE tar babies for those seeking election
if Obama were not black, would there be any outrage about such use of the expression "tar baby"
USA. home of the offended
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Then why did Sambo's restaurant change their name back in the '80s?
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Which just happens to be a whole lot easier when your party is supported by the press. How hard could it be to include that etymology/definition in the story? What we seem to have is a "bad word" list that mainly (only?) applies to those "wrong thinking" folks that support the "other" party. Some folks can use redskins and not be labeled as bigots while others cannot - regardless of the exact same context (a sports team name). This makes political correctness simply amount to political bias.
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That comment kind of presumes that when Democrats make some sort of faux pas they're given a pass, which couldn't be further from the truth.

But it does illustrate just one more reason for the first string to bring their A game.

Barber gets no quarter from me on this and I refuse to make or accept excuses for him.
 
soot said:
That comment kind of presumes that when Democrats make some sort of faux pas they're given a pass, which couldn't be further from the truth.

But it does illustrate just one more reason for the first string to bring their A game.

Barber gets no quarter from me on this and I refuse to make or accept excuses for him.
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Hmm... I offer Joe Biden as evidence to the contrary. It is not so much what is said but who says it that gets it any MSM attention.

The Top 5 Racist Biden Gaffes ... - Fox Nation

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...s-comment-and-the-racial-double-standard.html
 
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ttwtt78640 said:
Hmm... I offer Joe Biden as evidence to the contrary. It is not so much what is said but who says it that gets it any MSM attention.

The Top 5 Racist Biden Gaffes ... - Fox Nation

Joe Biden
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If you Google any one of those comments you get numerous hits of coverage across the MSM.

Case in point:

CNN - Biden's description of Obama draws scrutiny

ABC - A Biden Problem: Foot in Mouth

There are more.

I'm not going to keep going with this because I've satisfied my own curiosity that your point really doesn't have any legs.

If you or anyone else is interested in doing the leg work Google is available any time.
 
soot said:
If you Google any one of those comments you get numerous hits of coverage across the MSM.

Case in point:

CNN - Biden's description of Obama draws scrutiny

ABC - A Biden Problem: Foot in Mouth

There are more.

I'm not going to keep going with this because I've satisfied my own curiosity that your point really doesn't have any legs.

If you or anyone else is interested in doing the leg work Google is available any time.
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OK, what was the effect (if any) on Biden's political career, much less demorats in general, from this negative press? Did that make republicants come out in droves to the polls to punish other demorats?

It was not presented in the same context as the OP notes; it was never presented as typical for the demorat party or an indication the "secret underlying motives" of many (most?) demorats - that is the important distinction between the type of press coverage given. Oh golly yet another Biden gaffe is hardly in the same ballpark as painting Biden as a closet racist typical of many demorats.
 
CanadaJohn said:
Good afternoon Lady P.

Weather here was beautiful yesterday, sunny and mild - Indian Summer weather, if that doesn't offend anyone :roll: - but today is a totally different story, cold, near freezing, very windy, but no snow, although flurries in the areas surrounding Toronto and further north. Temps are supposed to be just above freezing for the next couple of weeks, from what I've seen, but no real snow.

Time for you to be thinking about wintering in Texas, I guess.

Take care and have fun!
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My daughter is with me this week, and she has mentioned it non-stop. I admit I am listening, and I suspect I'll be listening harder as it gets colder! :lamo: That's the beauty of laptops - they don't care where you are... they work just the same. I will take the Chihuahua with me if I go, as he was born there, and the cold really makes him miserable, poor little guy. He glares at me when I let him out, and he sure does hurry! My son will watch my house, so I really have no excuse - except inertia - but cold like we had last Winter can be a powerful motivator....
 
Ockham said:
I even learned this morning on MSNBC that the term "whistling Dixie" is a racist term by progressive standards.
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It turns out surprisingly often that phrases like this have ridiculous origins. Or things we tell to children. "Ring around the rosies?" Google its origin. The **** do we teach that to kids for?
 
tres borrachos said:
Stupid politician of the day #2. But at least he doesn't hold office.

Haley Barbour called President Barack Obama’s policies “tar babies” on a post-election conference call for clients of his lobbying firm, two sources familiar with the call told POLITICO.

The former Mississippi governor made the remark as he was taking questions from 100 or more clients of the BGR Group during an hourlong call on Thursday morning. According to a person on the call, Barbour was noting how rare it is for Americans to elect a president from the same party as a commander-in-chief leaving office after two terms.

“And then he said there is no one who will run for president who will endorse Obama’s issues, because Obama’s issues are ‘tar babies.’”


Haley Barbour apologizes after calling Obama?s policies ?tar babies? - James Hohmann and Kenneth P. Vogel - POLITICO

This part really got me.

“If someone takes offense, I regret it. But, again, neither the context nor the connotation was intended to offend,” wrote Barbour

WTF is with these idiots and their half hearted apologies? "If someone takes offense, I regret it"? How about "That was an inappropriate comment and I regret making it.", Haley.

Politicians run their mouths without thinking.
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When I was growing up in the South, the term "tar baby" was heard occasionally, always in the context of some kind of sticky mess you didn't want to get involved in... like having a blob of tar stuck to your boot.

There was, to my knowledge, no racial content to the remark.


Or so I always thought, until in recent years it has been construed as some kind of racist "code".... to my surprise.


If she meant it the way I'd always heard it used, I wouldn't have bothered to apologize at all.
 
It's from a Disney flick Song of the South. The best music ever from any Disney flick and they've long since shelved the movie because it portrayed slavery south with positive characters. It was part of the lessons Briar Rabbit learned. Barbour used the term absolutely appropriately and it wasn't a racist term.

The movie suffers from Huck Finn syndrome where modern folk just can't handle the real past.

My Grandma used to read us the real Grimm's Fairy Tales. These days that would be considered child abuse. :mrgreen:
 
d0gbreath said:
Then why did Sambo's restaurant change their name back in the '80s?
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Not the same at all, you'd know that if you'd ever eaten at a Sambos and read the placemat and then watched Song of the South.
 
Goshin said:
When I was growing up in the South, the term "tar baby" was heard occasionally, always in the context of some kind of sticky mess you didn't want to get involved in... like having a blob of tar stuck to your boot.

There was, to my knowledge, no racial content to the remark.


Or so I always thought, until in recent years it has been construed as some kind of racist "code".... to my surprise.


If she meant it the way I'd always heard it used, I wouldn't have bothered to apologize at all.
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Miscontrued as racist code, as anybody familiar with Joel Chandler Harris will tell you.
 
clownboy said:
It's from a Disney flick Song of the South. The best music ever from any Disney flick and they've long since shelved the movie because it portrayed slavery south with positive characters. It was part of the lessons Briar Rabbit learned. Barbour used the term absolutely appropriately and it wasn't a racist term.

The movie suffers from Huck Finn syndrome where modern folk just can't handle the real past.

My Grandma used to read us the real Grimm's Fairy Tales. These days that would be considered child abuse. :mrgreen:
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Yeah, like that thread where people were bitching that some group of Muslims was handing out literature that talked about founding fathers owning slaves. People freaked out. YOU CANT TALK ABOUT THEM LIKE THAT YOU AMERICA HATER!!! RARRR!

It's history, man. Deal with it. There's a lot of stuff in history that's ****ed up by modern standards. We don't condone it, but we can talk about it like adults, right?
 
Brer Rabbit was one of my favorite books as a child. I still say "oh no, don't throw me into the briar patch" when someone asks me to do something they think I don't like when I actually enjoy it.

I do know "tar baby" has racist connotations nowadays. But I don't remember when that happened. Languages are alive and words change. That has ALWAYS been the case.
 
Deuce said:
Yeah, like that thread where people were bitching that some group of Muslims was handing out literature that talked about founding fathers owning slaves. People freaked out. YOU CANT TALK ABOUT THEM LIKE THAT YOU AMERICA HATER!!! RARRR!

It's history, man. Deal with it. There's a lot of stuff in history that's ****ed up by modern standards. We don't condone it, but we can talk about it like adults, right?
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I agree with that last statement. But it doesn't go far enough. We should evaluate historical speech by the standards of the day, not modern ones. Understand where those people were coming from and what they were really saying to one another. We don't have to adopt past attitudes and solutions, but we should understand them.
 
tres borrachos said:
Stupid politician of the day #2. But at least he doesn't hold office.

Haley Barbour called President Barack Obama’s policies “tar babies” on a post-election conference call for clients of his lobbying firm, two sources familiar with the call told POLITICO.

The former Mississippi governor made the remark as he was taking questions from 100 or more clients of the BGR Group during an hourlong call on Thursday morning. According to a person on the call, Barbour was noting how rare it is for Americans to elect a president from the same party as a commander-in-chief leaving office after two terms.

“And then he said there is no one who will run for president who will endorse Obama’s issues, because Obama’s issues are ‘tar babies.’”


Haley Barbour apologizes after calling Obama?s policies ?tar babies? - James Hohmann and Kenneth P. Vogel - POLITICO

This part really got me.

“If someone takes offense, I regret it. But, again, neither the context nor the connotation was intended to offend,” wrote Barbour

WTF is with these idiots and their half hearted apologies? "If someone takes offense, I regret it"? How about "That was an inappropriate comment and I regret making it.", Haley.

Politicians run their mouths without thinking.
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Since the term has no offensive meaning or context I fail to see why an apology was in order.
 
clownboy said:
I agree with that last statement. But it doesn't go far enough. We should evaluate historical speech by the standards of the day, not modern ones. Understand where those people were coming from and what they were really saying to one another. We don't have to adopt past attitudes and solutions, but we should understand them.
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There was a time in history where "the standards" allowed slaves to be placed in a big arena and forced to fight each other to the death. I'm comfortable with saying "Yeah, these people were ****ed up. We should remember these sorts of things so we don't get this ****ed up ever again."
 
Very discouraging that so many posting on this thread are unfamiliar with the "Uncle Remus" stories and their place in American folklore and literature.

From Wiki:

The Tar-Baby is a fictional character in the second of the Uncle Remus stories published in 1881; it is a doll made of tar and turpentine used to entrap Br'er Rabbit. The more that Br'er Rabbit fights the Tar-Baby, the more entangled he becomes.

In modern usage, "tar baby" refers to any "sticky situation" that is only aggravated by additional contact.

Related stories

Variations on the tar baby legend are found in the folklore of more than one culture. In the Journal of American Folklore, Aurelio M. Espinosa examined 267 versions of the tar baby story.The next year, Archer Taylor added a list of tarbaby stories from more sources around the world, citing scholarly claims of its earliest origins in India and Iran. Espinosa later published documentation on tarbaby stories from a variety of language communities around the world.

According to James Mooney in "Myths of the Cherokee",[SUP] [/SUP]the tar baby story may have been influenced in America by the Cherokee "Tar Wolf" story, considered unlikely to have been derived from similar African stories: "Some of these animal stories are common to widely separated [Native American] tribes among whom there can be no suspicion of [African] influences. Thus the famous "tar baby" story has variants, not only among the Cherokee, but also in New Mexico, Washington [State], and southern Alaska—wherever, in fact, the pine supplies enough gum to be molded into a ball for [Native American] uses...."

Idiomatic references

The story has given rise to two American English idioms. References to Brer Rabbit's feigned protestations such as "please don't fling me in dat brier-patch" refer to guilefully seeking something by pretending to protest, with a "briar patch" often meaning a more advantageous situation or environment for one of the parties. The term "tar baby" has come to refer to a problem that is exacerbated by attempts to struggle with it, or by extension a situation in which mere contact can lead to becoming inextricably involved.

Tar-Baby - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Could we become more silly about 'racism'........Joel Chandler Harris wrote some classic stories.........it's just niggardly to think otherwise........
 
Wiggen said:
Speaking of racist...
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Speaking of racist.... then you must be thinking of the Obama administration. "If I had a son, he'd look like...."
 
Flamethrower said:
Speaking of racist.... then you must be thinking of the Obama administration. "If I had a son, he'd look like...."
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How is that racist? Did you expect Obama to say "If I had a son he would be ginger?".
 
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