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Thread: Obama on Moms Who Stay Home to Raise Kids: 'That's Not a Choice We Want Americans to

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    Re: Obama doesn't want Moms staying home to raise their kids. Wants the state to do i

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    "It takes a village". Now there is a quote that grated on my nerves when she said it, and after bringing up 3 kids into their teens (where they all are now), I know damn well that no village has raised my kids. My husband & I did.
    Yet, I'm willing to bet that there were plenty of other influences in your children's lives. That was the whole point. Did your children go to school? Then they had teachers that played a part in their raising. Did your children interact with your other relatives on any sort of basis? If so, then those relatives likely played at least a small part in their raising. Did they have friends, did you? They too could have had some part in their raising. Coaches, scout leaders, religious leaders, babysitters or others that your children are left with to be taught or cared for by had a part of in how your children were raised, even if it is going to be way less significant than yours and your husband's. Even the media and society as a whole plays a big part in how your children are raised, even if you limit greatly what they get to see in media.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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    Re: Obama doesn't want Moms staying home to raise their kids. Wants the state to do i

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Yet, I'm willing to bet that there were plenty of other influences in your children's lives. That was the whole point. Did your children go to school? Then they had teachers that played a part in their raising. Did your children interact with your other relatives on any sort of basis? If so, then those relatives likely played at least a small part in their raising. Did they have friends, did you? They too could have had some part in their raising. Coaches, scout leaders, religious leaders, babysitters or others that your children are left with to be taught or cared for by had a part of in how your children were raised, even if it is going to be way less significant than yours and your husband's. Even the media and society as a whole plays a big part in how your children are raised, even if you limit greatly what they get to see in media.
    Strange that with all thiscommunity involvement all children don't turn out the same. Maybe it takes a village to screw up children's lives also.

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    Re: Obama doesn't want Moms staying home to raise their kids. Wants the state to do i

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    I don't buy it. In the case of most stay at home mothers and in the case of most jobs, the experience at one has barely anything to do with the experience at the other. A stay at home mother can be a lot of work, but it is (rarely) relatable to industry or job experience.
    I'm in a position to hire people occasionally and, more than anything, character counts. Everything else runs second.

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    Re: Obama doesn't want Moms staying home to raise their kids. Wants the state to do i

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    This is so far beyond wrong I don't know where you get these ideas.

    Government programs did not cause the problems of unwed mothers. Unwed mothers led to us needing the programs more and more because societal changes in what people are taught at home caused the issues. Part of it is the fact that we look for love instead of stability and a stable reliable person when it comes to a mate and are taught this more than actually being taught what a good, positive intimate relationship is about. It all starts in what people are taught at home and by others if the home just isn't enough. Many unwed mothers are searching for someone that they can be with, to be a good father or parent for their children, and ways to better themselves, to make their career opportunities better, so they can care for their children rather than rely on the government assistance. No, it may not be all unwed mothers, but it still is many.

    So you want to get people off of those programs, work on programs that give a hand up rather than a hand out, including job training that is accepted by work places that pay more than minimum wage or just barely above because parents cannot raise children on minimum wage. And when it comes to those on assistance programs, we should be working on setting up job share situations where if a mother/father is not working full time or going to school full time, then they should be first looking for a full time job or schooling or they need to be helping to take care of other people's children or helping them run errands or with rides to work or school in order to help take some of that societal burden away. And they need to get classes on relationships, budgeting, and other "life skills" classes. In fact, we should have these in high school. And these should include definitely a class on healthy, intimate, committed relationships.
    You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I just don't agree with it. However I do agree that the moral bankruptcy of society has caused the increase in out of wedlock births and the increase of women being abandoned and left to struggle financially raising children. But by having so many government subsidies for single mothers, it doesn't hinder the bad behavior but rather encourages it because mothers are able to get by with government taking the place of the father. If benefits had greater limits on them and stronger laws forcing men to take responsibility for the children they have fathered, you would see women learning to follow the directions on their birth control and men thinking twice about having sex unprotected. While it is impossible to legislate morality, it doesn't help when the government voids personal responsibility.
    Last edited by vesper; 11-03-14 at 11:51 AM. Reason: spelling

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    Re: Obama doesn't want Moms staying home to raise their kids. Wants the state to do i

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I just don't agree with it. However I do agree that the moral bankruptcy of society has caused the increase in out of wedlock births and the increase of women being abandoned and left to struggle financially raising children. But by having so many government subsidies for single mothers, it doesn't hinder the bad behavior but rather encourages it because mothers are able to get by with government taking the place of the father. If benefits had greater limits on them and stronger laws forcing men to take responsibility for the children they have fathered, you would see women learning to follow the directions on their birth control and men thinking twice about having sex unprotected. While it is impossible to legislate morality, it doesn't helps when the government voids personal responsibility.
    Once you get past the old jokes this guy nails it. Well worth the read. Why the decline of the West is best for us - and them

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    Re: Obama doesn't want Moms staying home to raise their kids. Wants the state to do i

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    "It takes a village". Now there is a quote that grated on my nerves when she said it, and after bringing up 3 kids into their teens (where they all are now), I know damn well that no village has raised my kids. My husband & I did.
    I personally wouldn't let them get within 10 miles off my kids - I've seen and heard enough about their "Village" to know that much! My husband and I did our best to raise our children to be honest, hard working adults, and I am proud of all of them. No slackers allowed in our family, and we all had fun along the way!

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    Re: Obama doesn't want Moms staying home to raise their kids. Wants the state to do i

    appears to make (long-term) financial sense based on head start data:
    Cost-benefit Analyses. With an average cost per child of $6,692 for 1.5 years of participation, the preschool program generates a total return to society at large of $47,759 per participant. These benefits are the result of participantsí increased earnings capacity due to educational attainment, criminal justice system savings, reduced school remedial services, and averted tangible costs to crime victims. Benefits realized in each of these areas exceed the cost of just one year of the preschool program, which is $4,400. Overall, every dollar invested in the preschool program returns $7.14 in individual, educational, social welfare and socioeconomic benefits
    Strengthening Head Start:* What the Evidence Shows

    below is some stark data, looking at students who are eligible for free lunch versus those more affluent students who are not
    in the first graph we see the effects of poverty on readiness to learn, examining those percentages at or above the fully proficient benchmark:
    graph of students success compare free lunch eligible to others.gif
    in this next graph we see how student performance compares for those eligible for free lunch versus those students who are more affluent. these are the numbers for those who showing inadequate performance when tested at grades 4 and 12
    graph performance free lunch eligible to others.gif

    what is obvious is that students from impoverished circumstances have a much lower chance of exceeding the fully proficient level and a much higher chance of exhibiting under proficient academic levels than their more affluent counterparts
    this alone should cause us to embrace Obama's approach. more education, especially at the preschool level, is needed for our kids to be able to break the cycle of poverty
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
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    Re: Obama doesn't want Moms staying home to raise their kids. Wants the state to do i

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    appears to make (long-term) financial sense based on head start data:

    Strengthening Head Start:* What the Evidence Shows

    below is some stark data, looking at students who are eligible for free lunch versus those more affluent students who are not
    in the first graph we see the effects of poverty on readiness to learn, examining those percentages at or above the fully proficient benchmark:
    graph of students success compare free lunch eligible to others.gif
    in this next graph we see how student performance compares for those eligible for free lunch versus those students who are more affluent. these are the numbers for those who showing inadequate performance when tested at grades 4 and 12
    graph performance free lunch eligible to others.gif

    what is obvious is that students from impoverished circumstances have a much lower chance of exceeding the fully proficient level and a much higher chance of exhibiting under proficient academic levels than their more affluent counterparts
    this alone should cause us to embrace Obama's approach. more education, especially at the preschool level, is needed for our kids to be able to break the cycle of poverty
    I don't know how you come to the conclusion Head Start makes good sense long term. We've had the program since the Great Society under Johnson. This study showed how inadequate the program has been in preparing children for Kindergarten. The study was so damning that HHS stalled in releasing the data.

    Head Start Impact Evaluation Report Finally Released

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    Re: Obama doesn't want Moms staying home to raise their kids. Wants the state to do i

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Strange that with all thiscommunity involvement all children don't turn out the same. Maybe it takes a village to screw up children's lives also.
    Are two coaches the exact same? Are your friends going to be just alike? Are your friends going to be like other people's friends? How about teachers? Kids' friends? People in media your children are most exposed to compared to other people's children? Types of media your children prefer compared to others?

    I'm not saying that parents aren't a huge influence on their children but there are still many more influences in a child's life, more people contributing to who they are or become than just parents. And there is nothing wrong with that for most children/people.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    Re: Obama doesn't want Moms staying home to raise their kids. Wants the state to do i

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I just don't agree with it. However I do agree that the moral bankruptcy of society has caused the increase in out of wedlock births and the increase of women being abandoned and left to struggle financially raising children. But by having so many government subsidies for single mothers, it doesn't hinder the bad behavior but rather encourages it because mothers are able to get by with government taking the place of the father. If benefits had greater limits on them and stronger laws forcing men to take responsibility for the children they have fathered, you would see women learning to follow the directions on their birth control and men thinking twice about having sex unprotected. While it is impossible to legislate morality, it doesn't help when the government voids personal responsibility.
    Good morning, Vesper.

    : If everyone took personal responsibility for their lives, government would not be involved to the extent they are! The day is fast approaching, though, when people will have no choice but to take care of themselves - and I fear they won't know what to do! Tough way to learn under those conditions! sad....

    On another subject: Today I start painting window panes and windowsills on all the windows in my granddaughter's house! That's my job for this week, according to the powers-that-be! Okay, I can do that. After the floor sanding is done in the next week or so, they will stain the floor using a roller, but my job at that point will be staining the baseboards using a brush. Okay, I can do that, too - but my knees sure aren't going to be happy cause this house is a ranch that is 90 feet long! Some of that is 2-1/2 car garage, though, so I won't have baseboards to do there. Still a lot of work, though! See you intermittently over the next two weeks!

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