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Thread: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

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    re: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    One shouldn't base positions on BS they invent themselves. No one believes slavery is ok as long as it's not WASPs owning the slaves. Using that crap as a basis for understanding anything is nonsense.

    That you refuse to reveal your source is telling.
    How often do people complain slave owners who weren't white?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    re: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Freedmen weren't regard as 3/5 of a person.

    And, it was 3/5, not 2/3...you didn't even know that and we're supposed to just take your word on what's what?

    Three-Fifths Compromise - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Were African Americans given the right to vote? Were African Americans given the same rights? No.


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    re: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Actually Islam continues to teach that enslaving pagans (by which they mean non-people-of-the-Book) is a religious duty.
    So?

    That means the founders were not racist?


    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    How often do people complain slave owners who weren't white?
    All the time. Constantly. How have you missed it?

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    re: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Perpetuating the myth that racism existed in the 1800s. Next they'll be telling kids the Holocaust really happened. Don't you see the social programming supported by the media?
    This is why you should stick to your expertise.

    Racism actually was largely an invention that took place in the 19th century - the argument was largely scientific in nature, actually, which is why it gave us Eugenics. Racism did exist in the 1800s, but wasn't universal (worth noting is that official and unofficial bigotry against blacks =/= Racism, it simply has large zones of overlap)

    However, this handout deliberately paints a false picture. Theodore Roosevelt took quite a lot of heat at the time for his public support of African American leadership, and the idea that Abraham Lincoln didn't interfere with slavery is historically alliterate.




    But more broadly, yeah. This seems to be an incident of a stupid decision by a teacher, nothing more.

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    re: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Who told you that. Or is that another load of crap you invented yourself.
    You're the one that slavery was all about oppessing black folks.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    re: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    This is why you should stick to your expertise.
    The founders were not racist?


    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You're the one that slavery was all about oppessing black folks.
    I said no such thing. You just made it up, like you did the crap about people thinking slavery is ok when conducted by non-WASPs.

    At what point does your made up nonsense begin to not make sense even to you? Can you just keep making things up endlessly and somehow it all makes sense to you? If so, that's amazing.

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    re: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    So?

    That means the founders were not racist?
    The founders by and large weren't racist. You are confusing a system of slavery with an intellectual construct that was later used to justify it.

    All the time. Constantly. How have you missed it?
    Because it's not, actually, all the time. It is, in fact, pretty rare that we hear about slavery in a non white-person-owning-black-people context.

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    re: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    The founders by and large weren't racist.
    Of course they were. They owned slaves and thought blacks were not human. If that's not racist, then what the **** is??

    Because it's not, actually, all the time. It is, in fact, extremely rare that we hear about slavery in a non white-person-owning-black-people context.
    That's YOUR problem and not others'. I hear about non-white-owned slavery all the time. Perhaps you should stop ignoring the subject.

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    re: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Were African Americans given the right to vote? Were African Americans given the same rights? No.


    State constitutions protecting voting rights for blacks included those of Delaware (1776), [5] Maryland (1776), [6] New Hampshire (1784), [7] and New York (1777). [8] (Constitution signer Rufus King declared that in New York, “a citizen of color was entitled to all the privileges of a citizen. . . . [and] entitled to vote.”) [9] Pennsylvania also extended such rights in her 1776 constitution, [10] as did Massachusetts in her 1780 constitution. [11] In fact, nearly a century later in 1874, US Rep. Robert Brown Elliott (a black Republican from SC) queried: “When did Massachusetts sully her proud record by placing on her statute-book any law which admitted to the ballot the white man and shut out the black man? She has never done it; she will not do it.” [12]

    As a result of these provisions, early American towns such as Baltimore had more blacks than whites voting in elections; [13] and when the proposed US Constitution was placed before citizens in 1787 and 1788, it was ratified by both black and white voters in a number of States. [14]

    [5] The Constitutions of the Several Independent States of America (Boston: Norman and Bowen, 1785), p. 92, 1776 Delaware Constitution, “Declaration of Rights,” #6.
    [6] Constitutions (1785), p. 104, 1776 Maryland Constitution, “Declaration of Rights,” #5.
    [7] Constitutions (1785), p. 5, 1784 New Hampshire Constitution, “Bill of Rights,” #11.
    [8] Constitutions (1785), p. 58, 1777 New York Constitution, “Declaration of Rights,” #7.
    [9] Rufus King, The Life and Correspondence of Rufus King, Charles R. King, editor (New York: G.P. Putnam’s Sons, 1900), p. 404.
    [10] Constitutions (1785), p. 78, 1776 Pennsylvania Constitution, “Declaration of Rights,” #7.
    [11] Constitutions (1785), p. 8, 1780 Massachusetts Constitution, “Declaration of Rights,” #9.
    [12] Carter G. Woodson, Negro Orators and Their Orations (Washington, DC: The Associated Publishers, Inc., 1925), p. 310, Rep. Robert Brown Elliott from his speech on the Civil Rights Bill on January 6, 1874.
    [13] John Hancock, Essays on the Elective Franchise; or, Who Has the Right to Vote? (Philadelphia: Merrihew & Son, 1865), pp. 22-23.
    [14] Hancock, Essays on the Elective Franchise, p. 27

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    re: School's Nation of Islam handout paints Founding Fathers as racists [W:293]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Of course they were. They owned slaves and thought blacks were not human. If that's not racist, then what the **** is??
    The bolded part is correct (for many of them), and the underlined is not. The idea that Blacks were some kind of sub-human came into vogue in later generations.

    That's YOUR problem and not others'. I hear about non-white-owned slavery all the time. Perhaps you should stop ignoring the subject.
    where in our schools is the subject taught, especially compared to the other? where in our national public conversations do we make sure that we always point out that there were black slave owners in America just as there were white slave owners? You may get a brief mention of modern Islamist groups grabbing girls.

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