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Thread: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

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    Re: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    The problem with the Texas case and others is the proponents can't demonstrate that 1) the impersonation fraud at the polls which is preventable by photo ID is more than trivial (2 cases in Texas, with 20 million votes cast) or 2) that the new rules make that trivial amount of fraud less likely. Furthermore, the estimates were about 600,000 registered Texas voters didn't have acceptable photo ID. Those that didn't were 2-3 times more likely to be hispanic or black, and poor, than anglo, and therefore the effect was clearly disproportionately on minorities which Texas has a long history of discriminating against. The law was passed on a fast track that was unprecedented (rules were changed in a manner not seen for a century) for no good reason, and much more.

    And anyone who thinks the "point" of the fast tracked rules changes was to reduce "election fraud" is delusional. That's the stated reason, but the actual reason is clearly and obviously to help GOPers win elections in red states. As the judge pointed out, the area where virtually ALL "voter" fraud occurs is with absentee ballots and the emergency, fast tracked, legislation left those rules untouched. Gosh, could it be that demographics that lean republican in Texas are more likely to use absentee ballots? Of course.....
    Who is the racist here? you seem to think blacks and mexicans are to lazy and stupid to get a simple id that is needed for many aspects of modern life

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    Re: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    Well, you've certainly made up your mind on this issue.
    True, because the evidence allows no other conclusion. Lawyers arguing FOR photo ID don't even really attempt to tie the new rules to preventing fraud - they can't demonstrate that any is occurring, so it's hard to argue in COURT, under oath, with the opposing side able to challenge claims, that rules changes are needed to solve the problem of nearly non-existent impersonation fraud.

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    Re: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    True, because the evidence allows no other conclusion. Lawyers arguing FOR photo ID don't even really attempt to tie the new rules to preventing fraud - they can't demonstrate that any is occurring, so it's hard to argue in COURT, under oath, with the opposing side able to challenge claims, that rules changes are needed to solve the problem of nearly non-existent impersonation fraud.
    Election fraud is/has been far more damaging then "voter fraud".

    Despite many instances of electoral fraud internationally, in the U.S. a major study by the Justice Department between 2002 and 2007[2] showed of the 300 million votes cast in that period, federal prosecutors convicted only 86 people for voter fraud and of those few cases, most involved persons who were simply unaware of their ineligibility.

    I would draw attention to the fact that this study was conducted by the Bush administrations Justice Dept.!

    Electoral fraud - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

    Quote Originally Posted by Crovax View Post
    Who is the racist here? you seem to think blacks and mexicans are to lazy and stupid to get a simple id that is needed for many aspects of modern life
    I never said that, but it's nice that you made those ugly sentiments up and then attributed them to me!! Are you familiar with the term, Projection?

    And the bolded part just isn't true. The people who are registered and do not have the acceptable forms of ID obviously DO NOT NEED the required forms of photo ID except to vote. If they had to have the required ID, they'd have it. The rules require 600,000 properly registered Texans to spend money on an ID they do not otherwise need. Hence, the "poll tax" nature of the law.

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    Re: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I never said that, but it's nice that you made those ugly sentiments up and then attributed them to me!! Are you familiar with the term, Projection?

    And the bolded part just isn't true. The people who are registered and do not have the acceptable forms of ID obviously DO NOT NEED the required forms of photo ID except to vote. If they had to have the required ID, they'd have it. The rules require 600,000 properly registered Texans to spend money on an ID they do not otherwise need. Hence, the "poll tax" nature of the law.
    How do they drive without ID, how do they cash checks without ID, how do they rent/own places of residence without ID, how do they travel without ID, how do they buy beer without ID. All of these things require an ID which is also an acceptable form of voter ID.

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    Re: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    But large-scale voter fraud is virtually non-existent today. Yet the efforts to root it out recall the horrid Jim Crow era. The former “party of Lincoln” has been most active in this fraudulent crusade. It’s mostly prevented people of color and older folks from voting. Could it be that they’d largely vote for Democrats?

    Shades of 2000 and 2004 when somehow voting machines weren’t delivered to African-American precincts in Ohio and Florida or unforeseen glitches prevented their ballots from counting. It’s not that the disenfranchised voters weren’t properly registered — by and large they were. But a systematic campaign to keep them from voting was in place. It’s been documented by several news organizations, most notably the Miami Herald.

    Voter Fraud: A Massive, Anti-Democratic Deception - Forbes
    How can you prove fraud is or isnt going on when there is no method to test for it. That would be like saying there is no mass internet piracy because just a few people have been arrested for it.

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    Re: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

    Quote Originally Posted by Crovax View Post
    How do they drive without ID, how do they cash checks without ID, how do they rent/own places of residence without ID, how do they travel without ID, how do they buy beer without ID. All of these things require an ID which is also an acceptable form of voter ID.
    Two things. 1) you're conflating "ID" with "Photo ID acceptable for voting." They're not the same, which is a BIG part of the problem. Almost everyone has "ID" but roughly 600,000 registered voters in Texas do not have an ID acceptable for voting at the polls.

    And 2) no one disputes that these roughly 600,000 people in Texas get by just fine without the types of Photo ID required in Texas to vote. So your question is interesting from a sociological standpoint, but irrelevant to the discussion of photo ID for voting purposes.

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    Re: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

    Quote Originally Posted by Crovax View Post
    How can you prove fraud is or isnt going on when there is no method to test for it. That would be like saying there is no mass internet piracy because just a few people have been arrested for it.
    There are methods to detect it. To engage in impersonation fraud at the polls, the person has to know that someone is registered to vote, obtain some form of ID (e.g. a utility bill) that will indicate he or she is that person, get to the polls before the REAL registered voter shows up, trust that no poll worker knows the registered person, vote, then hope that the person registered doesn't show up later and find out someone has cast a vote in their name. If the person registered is dead, that can and is checked against lists of people who are dead. If the person moved, that can also be checked - did that person vote in some other election. There is a permanent record of all registered voters and of persons casting a vote.

    And the thing is, if you were going to vote as someone else, why show up at the polls and risk showing your face? Request an absentee ballot instead and you need no ID, and don't risk someone who knows Jane Doe is at the desk when you sign in as Jane Doe. Of course ALL the evidence indicates that in fact those engaging in "voter" fraud do it through absentee ballots, naturally. It's less risky, by far. And Texas and most other republican states passing strict photo ID laws did NOTHING to tighten up the rules for absentee voting.

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    Re: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    Two things. 1) you're conflating "ID" with "Photo ID acceptable for voting." They're not the same, which is a BIG part of the problem. Almost everyone has "ID" but roughly 600,000 registered voters in Texas do not have an ID acceptable for voting at the polls.

    And 2) no one disputes that these roughly 600,000 people in Texas get by just fine without the types of Photo ID required in Texas to vote. So your question is interesting from a sociological standpoint, but irrelevant to the discussion of photo ID for voting purposes.
    Maybe you should read my post again, I said the same ID that is required for all of those things(DL, ID or passport) is also acceptable for voting. So please explain how they are getting by fine without doing any of those activities

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    Re: Federal Court Blocks Texas Voter ID Law

    Quote Originally Posted by Crovax View Post
    Considering it just like the Indiana law that the SCOTUS said was constitutional this will flip back



    Federal court calls Texas voter ID law unconstitutional | www.statesman.com
    Supreme Court just stayed lower court' s ruling freezing Wisconsin's law.

    US Supreme Court blocks Wisconsin voter ID law - The Washington Post


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